Thinking of getting this optic for my Sport...should I get the cantilever or flat base version? And, what are the pros/cons to each?

Molte grazie!

The advantage of a cantilever mount is that it allows for more efficient use of all the existing receiver rail space.



In this picture, it pushes the dot forward. It allowed me to mount a magnifier behind it.

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-John

I have a Strikefire I mounted on the cantilever. It provides absolute co-witness with the sights.

My understanding was the primary reason for the cantilever mount was to achieve 1/3 co-witness. It's the low ring mount that provides absolute co-witness.

Guys. Reading comprehension is key. The OP's question isn't whether or not to achieve absolute v.s. lower 1/3 co-witness. The question isn't about mount height. He's asking why to use a cantilever mount v.s. a standard flat mount. Keyword = cantilever.

A cantilever does exactly what it's name implies. Look at the picture I provided. The red dot is on a cantilever mount. The mount cantilevers outward, pushing the objective end of the dot forward of the end of the receiver rail space, in turn pushing the exit end of the scope forward too. This allows the marksman to place another device on the limited top rail space. If I didn't use a cantilever mount, I could not mount the magnifier behind the dot.

Cantilever mounts are available in different heights, but their primary function is the same.

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-John

Nice try JaPes. Round here the OP's intent rarely guides a thread or discussion. Usually one or two subsequent posts and alllll the cannons are loose. Sit back, watch em run.

Thanks all...a lot of great information to consider. I think the answer to my next question is "depends on what you want to do , but here goes; which should I get, the cantilever or flat base? FYI, I'm probably not going to shoot much beyond 100 yards or so.

Thanks!

I'd go with the cantilever mount. If you change your mind about shooting over 100 yards (and why wouldn't you?) the setup for a magnifier is already there. You can keep your rear BUIS and have enough rail space for everything.


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By the way, I love my Strikefire 2 and have the cantilever mount as well. It works great and I love the lower 1/3 cowitness.


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Yes, sorry. You are right. I mis-spoke. It gives a 1/3 co-witness.

Even though I was poking fun at the thread drift here, I've read all these red dot threads for months now and been toying with the idea of getting a Strikefire II for my own AR. Lots of reviews out there and they are overwhelmingly positive. Sure, a few complaints, now and then, but most seem to be resolved with that sweet warranty from Vortex.

So, I busted off and bought a Strikefire II today. Got a nice online discount with free delivery from Optics planet. It comes with the cantilever mount. I'll start there. Then, I'll probably be back right here wondering whats best...

Come on man. The main reason for the cantilever is to be able to achieve lower 1/3 co=witness. The low mount won't do it. It is very much key to the discussion. He wanted to know why to pick one over the other and this has a lot to do with that choice.

If you go to the web site of the sight maker you'll see that the low mount doesn't do co-witness.

Vortex Optics - StrikeFire II Red Dot

No, that is not the main reason for a cantilever mount... the main reason for cantilever mount is to move the optic forward but keeping the mount itself on the receiver.

If you go here, you will see that a cantilever mount is available in both heights... therefore it is obvious that the reason to choose a cantilever mount is not height!

Vortex Optics - Cantilever 30 mm Ring Absolute Co-Witness

I went there and the only co-witness setup they had was with the cantilever mount. Maybe other companies do it different but Vortex made it clear you only get co-witness with the higher mount.

I just bought the Strikefire 11 last weekend at Cabelas and they mounted it as well. He said I could have it either absolute or 1/3rd co witness with the cantilever mount. I chose to have it absolute and he bore sighted it for me. Haven't gone to the range yet but right now the dot is slightly higher than my A2 post. He said it should be pretty close at 100 yds.

If you can still find an original Strikefire, it comes with a screw-in doubler (2X magnifier) and is otherwise just the same as the Strikefire II.

Take a look at what you wrote... they have two heights of cantilever mounts to provide both co-witness techniques. Since both are cantilever mounts, the main reason for a cantilever mount is not ring height. Again, the main reason for a cantilever mount is to allow you to move the optic to a more forward position while still maintaining the mount on the receiver only.

BTW, Vortex offers other mounts that provide co-witness with the Stikefire II...
Vortex Optics - StrikeFire II Red Dot Red/Green<br />Cantilever

You should take a look at what I wrote. They have 2 heights. Only one has co-witness available. The cantilever mount. Again other companies do it differently. But in this case the main reason I "chose" a cantilever mount was so that I could have co-witness. It is NOT available with the low mount. If it doesn't sink in what I'm saying this time, read it again until you get it.

The On/Off button was also changed on the StrikeFire II. There were a lot of complaints about the original StrikeFire's switch being accidentally turned on while the rifle was in a case thus resulting in dead battery.

Good Optic. I have one on my M&P15-22.

So last weekend I ordered up a Strikefire II online. Watching the tracking and looking forward to it's arrival. Disappointment struck when I checked the tracking info and find that they attempted delivery this morning at my office.

Of course nobody was there on Saturday morning. Guess I'll get it on Monday.

Yes you are right. I forgot about that change. They have also "improved" the caps that come with it. They sent me a set of new caps for free. I did not see any difference. Still takes excessive effort to close the front one, or it will pop back open. I am using a Butler Creek tini bikini cover instead. Perfect fit.

CJ... They do have 2 heights of cantilever mount. One provides absolute co-witness. The other provides 1/3 lower co-witness.

IF you chose a cantilever mount strictly because of co-witness, you chose it for the wrong reason.

This provides absolute co-witness without cantilever and is a mount marked as an accessory for the Strikefire II.

Vortex Optics - StrikeFire Tactical 30 mm Ring Extra-High Absolute

This provides lower 1/3rd co-witness without cantilever and is a mount marked as an accessory for the Strikefire II.

Vortex Optics - Tactical 30 mm Ring Extra-High Lower 1/3

Again, the purpose of the cantilever mount is to move the optic forward of the mounting position... co-witness is a function of the height of a mount, not simply because it is cantilever.

Strikefire II delivered this morning. Looking forward to getting it mounted and trying it out on the range.

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America First

Good choice. I really like the StrikeFire II, really nice red/green dot for the money. Enjoy.

Got the Strikefire mounted up this evening. Range time is going to have to wait a few days.

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America First

Nice. I really like mine and in particular the green dot. If the dot looks a little like a star at times you may have astigmatism.

VaTom

I like mine a lot except I think the dot is too big. I suppose that's good for certain conditions but accurate shooting isn't one of them. It will give you decent accuracy but it's not like a crosshair by any means. I will look for a smaller dot the next time I buy a sight. Other than that I have zero complaints about it. No it won't stay on all the time but it turns on quick and easy.

It's 4MOA, more expensive red dots are 3 or 2MOA. Not sure if I'd notice the difference of an inch at 100 yards with an unmagnified optic and would rather have the easy acquisition of a slightly larger dot for close up shots. Red dots aren't for accurate bench shooting anyway, if you want 1MOA get a scope IMO.

Correct me if I am wrong, but red dots are most effective in CQC (Close Quarters Combat) when rapid target acquisition is required. I have mine sighted in at 25 yards on my M&P 15-22 and never use it out to more than 50 yards.

Maybe a former military person could elaborate more.

I took mine to the range on Saturday with the Strikefire II after purchasing it on the prior weekend and put 90 rounds through it. Started at 25 yds and soon had it sighted in. Then went to 100 yds and with a few more adjustments was hitting the 4 inch diamond fairly consistently. At that distance I was basically trying to center the red dot on the entire target as the dot was hard to contrast against the red diamond bullseye. I really like this sight and the gun is fun to shoot for sure.

You have the general gist of it. A red dot gives a better sight picture i low light conditions as well compared to iron sights. Depending on the size of the dot, it can be used out to longer ranges quite well. Each aiming system has it's positives and negatives and the shooter has to decide for themselves where they want to compromise.

Me personally, I like an illuminated reticule 1-4X or 1-6X scope with irons for back up. Not quite as fast as a red dot or iron sights but offers the advantage of a low light reticule and the ability to reach out farther than say 300 yards.

It is not meant to be for match grade accuracy. A red dot is made for fast acquisition on a target where a hit is a hit. If you are shooting a red dot from a bench, attempting to make one ragged hole at 100 yards, you have the wrong tool for the job.

The smaller the dot, the harder it is to pick it up in the optic. That is the beauty of the Eotech reticle... they offer a 1 MOA dot, surrounded by a 68 MOA circle to draw your eye to the dot.

I know that much. I just think it obscures targets that could be seen and shot if the dot was a bit smaller. If I had wanted a scope I would have bought one. I do know the difference. But the better red dots have smaller dots as has been said already. I just think that would be better. I certainly don't expect to make 150 yard shots with a red dot. To be honest I'd switch to irons before attempting a shot like that.

anyone wanting a smaller dot size, The Vortex Sparc AR has a 2 MOA dot size, I really like mine a lot!

When you have old eyes, its hard to focus on the front sight and target downrange. With the Red Dots its much more fun. Love my Vortex Strikefire.

I shot with my strikefire for the first time today. Wasn't a bad experience, but not stellar either. Going to give this some more time and some more rounds down range before I decide if I like it or not. I'm a newb to red dots, so it's not entirely comfortable just yet. It has promise tho!

Tell me about it!

what aren't you liking? you shooting with both eyes open?

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as red dots go I like my strikefire 2 really well......BUT.....if I had to do over again I think I would have opted for the strike eagle instead........I just don't see myself going into CQB with my AR on the mean streets of Cincinnati.....I'll leave that job to a pair of 4516-2

Been shooting with my strikefire 2 for several months now and love it..
My buddies have Aimpoints and EOtechs and my steel rings just as loud and often as theirs...

I've had both mounting systems on a Strkefire I and II on a dedicated 22LR upper. The cantilever mount works best, but I like the looks of the old style mount.

Only reason I got rid of the gen 1 version of the Strikefire was the power button on the side. Every time I laid the rifle down or bumped it against something, it would turn the scope on.

I think it is mostly unfamiliarity with using a red dot. Yes, both eyes open. I think it will get better with some use. It's new ground for me.

Hoping they don't lock this up. Last time i replied to a thread four months old, it got the zombie pic and and locked.

Had the same experience just today. Was in a class taught by SF soldiers, yes, really. Was in there with a lot of cops and military types who had some seriously high dollar optics. Was well pleased with the performance of my Strikefire II and with my shooting. Hardly perfect, but respectable.

I've made friends with this thing since I last posted here.

There was a guy in the class today using a Strike Eagle. He was very high on this scope and it performed admirably in the exercises we ran today.His Strike Eagle is clearly capable of way more than the kind of shooting we were doing today. It is a running and gunning CQB class. Tiring, but a boat load of fun!

Day 2 tomorrow.

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America First

I just noticed this post from a while back. The Strikefire II comes with a choice of TWO mounts. One is a cantilever that is raised so that 1/3 co-witness can be achieved. The other sits down on the rail. The other choices are not part of the OP's question. And yes the cantilever will give you some extra room on the rail but the primary choice is about height according to Vortex. The OP didn't ask about other mounts. He asked for a comparison of the TWO available with the Strikefire II. You can buy all sorts of stuff if you want. Only two mounts come in the box with this sight.

BTW I have some other points to make. I bought a 2MOA red dot recently. I like it MUCH better than the 4MOA dot on the Strikefire II. And this notion that you can't shoot past 100 yards with a red dot - I just did it recently when I shot about 135 yards with the Strikefire II and I was putting rounds in about a 5" group. And I was standing with no rest when I shot that size group. People get certain things in their head and they don't even try to do stuff outside that box. They would probably get more out of their equipment if they did. I see no problem at all shooting as far as 200 yards with a red dot or maybe farther. Once you get into the realm of your shots dropping outside the view of the sight then you'll have a problem. Up to that point you can get shots on target with a red dot. And BTW the larger dot covered up a substantial area at 135 yards. It's hard to hit what you can't see because it's covered up. And before you tell me again to get a scope realize I have plenty of scopes. I use them to shoot 500 yards at times. I shoot 50 yards with them too. You can get lots of use out of equipment if you aren't cutting your options off by some arbitrary idea about what things can and can't do.

I passed on the Strikefire strictly because of the larger dot size myself. 2MOA dot Sightmark M-Spec (yeah everyone poos on sightmark, but seriously nearly $200 for a red dot is not cheap in the end). If the Sparc II or Strikefire had the 2 MOA dot, I'd own it. They didn't. I like to not completely eclipse my 3" spinners at 100yds.

So, I finished up day two of the class on Wednesday. Overall very pleased with my Strikefire II. The course included some exercises that had participants on the ground, up and down, on the ground acting as casualties being retrieved by other members of the class. There were some dropped and dragged rifles over the course of the two days.

Other exercises included transitioning to handgun from cover. Which often meant simple letting loose of the slung weapon to engage targets with handgun. That of course led to some more banging about.

In the end, I was pretty happy with my own shooting and the Strikefire's performance. No issues with losing zero after being knocked around a bit. At the moment, I really can't find a lot to dislike about a Strikefire II, especially given the price point.

I came away from the class pretty pleased with my equipment choices including my RMR'd pistol, which is a whole nother thread.

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America First

I prefer the smaller 2 MOA dot on my Primary Arms Advanced but other than that I can't find a single thing about the Vortex I don't like. Well I'd like for it to have the long battery life my PA has but not many red dots do have that. I would have had to pay a lot more to get that when I got my Vortex. It's still holding zero 18 months later. With a lifetime warranty I can't see a lot to complain about. I probably should drop in a fresh battery come to think of it. I guess the hard part is remembering to put a new one in before you need it and it doesn't work.

Front Sight teaches RDS users to align the target with the top edge of the dot. When I did that I realized that dot size becomes irrelevant.

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Roscoe
S&W M&P 15 Sport II

All my RDS have adjustable intensity and when zeroing them in I've found that the lowest intensity is best. For quick target aquisition, I set it bright, but for zeroing and bench shooting, I can get smaller groups with lower setting. I am not sure if the dot size is actually smaller on the lower setting, but the effect is as though it was.

I didn't know that Front Sight taught that, but I have long suggested using the top edge for those who complain their red dot isn't precise enough for their use. I don't believe many listen, and I think those who fret over precision aiming with a red dot purchased the wrong optic to begin with.

Right. Cranking up the red dot will make the dot appear larger/flared out.