I just purchased a M&P 15T and I want to replace the flash hider with a muzzle brake. First, is that a good idea? Second, is that possible? Third, what size threads are on the rifle?

Not trying to sound like a jerk, but if you are asking if this is a good idea or not, why do you want to do it? What are you trying to accomplish?

Sure, it is possible. The thread pitch is 1/2 X 28.

I recommend that you go shoot the rifle. After you have a couple hundred rounds down the pipe, you will have a better idea if any changes are needed.

I'm looking to minimize recoil as much as possible. I plan on putting a scope on the rifle and shooting out to 200 yds and would like to be able to follow my shot through the scope. Plus, I'm trying to get my wife interested in shooting so anything I can do to minimize recoil is a plus. If I can get her into shooting, it'll mean a bigger budget and more range time for me!

Will it reduce enough recoil to make it worth the expense and trouble of replacing the flash hider with a muzzle brake? I'm also a bit OCD so I'd like to put a Mech Force brake so this rifle looks like my other rifles.

I put about 300 rounds through the rifle so far using the MBUS sights and the rifle shoots great. The rifle seems to kick up and to the right when I shoot standing. I'm hoping the muzzle brake will calm that a bit.

Have to wait for some of the muzzle brake guys to respond if it will allow you to accomplish your goal. Personally, I don't think there is much recoil and I can't stand it when someone shoots with a brake next to me at the range.


Do you use a sling when shooting? Since you mentioned standing while shooting, I thought I would ask.

I don't use a sling. Once I mount the scope, I'll primarily shoot from a bench. I put a bipod on it for that purpose. I'm just waiting on the mount for the scope.

A comp/brake will accomplish some of what you are looking for. It will reduce the amount of muzzle flip-how much depends on the design. As to what is felt at the shoulder, haven't shot enough different ones to say one way or the other. On my Sport II, I have a comp to comply with state law, and really couldn't tell any difference between the flash hider and the comp. But then the installed flash hider also functions to some degree as a comp/brake.

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Here's some light reading on the topic of which muzzle brakes reduce recoil by how much.

5.56 Muzzle Brake / Comp / Flash Hider Shootout!

AR-15 Muzzle Brake Shootout #2 -- TheTruthAboutGuns

AR-15 Muzzle Brake Shootout #3 - The Truth About Guns

If the recoil of 5.56 NATO needs to be mitigated for the wife to enjoy shooting, you are probably tilting at windmills. The excessive blast from a muzzle break will be far more of a problem than 3.8 ft-lbs of recoil.

The noise level will be a problem as MichiganScott posted. Get her a 22 if recoil is a problem,they are great for beginners to learn on.

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This^^^^

I wouldn't put a break on a rifle for a new shooter. The increased sound and felt concussion will make it unpleasant. Get her a 15-22 to practice on and when she's ready introduce the AR.

The A2 flash hider that comes on most AR rifles already acts to prevent muzzle rise due to the bottom being closed. It also acts to prevent dirt getting kicked up from the muzzle blast.

Like mentioned above, muzzle brakes make the neighbors beside you unhappy due to the noise and blast. AR15s tend to not have much recoil, so it might be a good idea to let the person shoot it first before committing to changing to a brake. Typically, a brake is most beneficial for long range shooting and not so much for closer in. What one defines as long range is going to vary from person to person but the general agreement is something along the lines of 600 yards or more for an AR.

In the end, it's going to be your call but I wouldn't do it.

Not all brakes are created equal, but yes, they reduce muzzle rise.
I installed a Lantac on my 16in carbine which significantly reduced muzzle rise to the point that it barely moves between shoots while shooting offhand. Very nice.

Is a brake worth the price? Well.... the Lantac was about a $100. I can go through $100 of ammo during a shooting session. That my rifle performs significantly more to my satisfaction for a $100 which is relatively insignificant compared to ongoing shooting costs puts it in the category of well worth the price.

Thread is standard AR15 -1/2 28. You'll want a receiver vice block for removal and install. Wheeler for $20 works fine. Other than that there's no special tools required.

On my AR-556, Ruger installed a flash hider that is open at the bottom. I have no idea what their thinking was for doing this. I am open to suggestions on a replacement.

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Ruger_AR-556_014.jpg (54.4 KB, 45 views)

That's weird! Get a standard A2 birdcage and swap it out. They're cheap and effective.

A2 is closed at the bottom. A1 is not.

I took the flash hider off and installed a muzzle brake for no other reason than it looks cool.

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USAF Retired/VN Vet

All thoughts aside as to what works the best, yes it is very easy to remove and to install a different type. Unscrew old, screw in new (and time if necessary). That's it.

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Still carrying my S&W 642

Now there's an honest man.

Shooting next to someone using a muzzle brake will ruin your range day.

Cant stand muzzle brakes ... especially on 223/556. There is no need for them

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Thank You
Wayne

I ordered a Wilson Combat flash hider last night for the same reason. Chose it over YHM 5C2 after a lengthy internal debate.

Possibly because that style can be screwed on without need of indexing--it's the same all the way around. Saves time and cost of using peel washers, etc. to get alignment right.

It won't be an issue for you unless you do a lot of shooting from the prone, or your bench top is particularly dirty.

BTW, it's a flash suppressor...flash hiders look like little dunce caps.

Not at all. The shooter doesn't hear increased noise. Only those next to them. She'll be fine.

No, the flash hider is just that, a flash hider. It works great. The bottom is closed to reduce dirt flying up when shooting prone. The standard A2 flash hider doesn't reduce muzzle rise at all.


Wow, really? Ruin your day? Maybe move a little further than 3' from the guy with the muzzle brake?


Muzzle brakes work when used on rifles. They work nicely on the AR. They significantly reduce muzzle rise and that's a great asset when trying to shoot rapid pairs.

I have a brake on my Tavor and it took the muzzle rise from just a little to non-existent. I love muzzle brakes.

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That is the exact same flash suppressor I have on my 10/22 I-Tac model 22lr rifle. It doesn't do anything on the 22 so I'm supprised it does anything on the AR. My Smith Sport 2 Ar has a suppressor with the bottom closed.

Rick

In pics 1 & 2 below these are "FLASH HIDERS" like what is on my AR-556. In pic 3 is a "DUNCE CAP" flash hider.
I'm going to do what member mule69 did, and install something that looks cool.

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	Ruger_AR-556_014.jpg (54.4 KB, 27 views)
	ak-3-prong.jpg (85.1 KB, 40 views)

Depends on your range. If you shoot on the back 40 you are probably correct. If you shoot at a covered or indoor range, the muzzle blast is excessive for everyone, including the shooter. The loudest rifle I ever shot was .300 mag with a BOSS at a covered range. The concussion and blast physically hurt.

Some ranges like the one I shoot at have assigned lanes ... when the guy next to you is shooting a howitzer (because of a muzzle brake) it makes the day of shooting a lot less fun

The range I go to doesnt allow rapid fire ... no need for muzzle brakes unless you are outside and away from people

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Thank You
Wayne

1. It's a flash suppressor, not a flash hider. They ain't the same thing.
2. The A2 does give a slight brake (not 'break') effect,
over an A1.
3. Yes, muzzle devices can increase concussive effect/report
for the shooter.

No, DisabledOne...those are all flash suppressors.

These are flash hiders...


Enfield rifle:

http://www.enfield-rifles.com/uploads/2102/IMG_0323.JPG

Browning M2:

https://www.marstar.ca/product_image...MG/B50-206.jpg

M1 Garand sniper model flash hiders, here:

I'm not a child, so, don't type to me as one.
I Googled the pics that I have posted and it read FLASH HIDERS. So, if it's on the internet, it must be true.

Technically, he is correct, the muzzle devices on most firearms only suppress the flash, so it is a suppressor. Some do a darn good job at it too and are darn near a flash hider but there is still some residual flash.

As already replied by someone else, the closed bottom A2 bird cage directs gas up and to the side some, so does provide some muzzle rise control. Will it do it as well as a true brake? Nope.

In any case, flash hider/flash suppressor has been mixed used and probably shouldn't. Just like clip and magazine. Will it happen? Probably not.


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I left a range session early not long ago because the guy shooting 5 ft away had a muzzle break on his rifle. Every time he fired it felt like I was getting slapped upside the head. Outdoor, covered bench range.

Not all brakes nor ranges are designed the same, so there's no surprise that folks' experiences and conclusions are different.

Keeping things focused on the OP and his wife... here's what I can offer.

Our club has overheads but no rear or side walls. Here are two of my rifles. Both are 16in carbine gas system. One bare muzzle and the other with a Lantac. My wife is about 5'2'' and 135lbs. She's not a shooter (so forgive her style) but I drag her out to the range once or twice a year and she goes along to humor me.

Ammo - M193
Hearing protection - Foam plugs + Howard Leight Sport Electronic

From the shooting position the difference is that the bare muzzle has a deeper tone than the Lantac but there is little difference in perceived noise level, discomfort or pressure between the bare muzzle and using a brake. From about six feet to the side it's about the same difference though there is a light breeze felt on the face with each shot using the brake.

See the difference in muzzle rise, rifle movement and her being pushed around. Her unsolicited words... The one with the muzzle thingie is a lot nicer to shoot.

Thank you Sir, for that explanation. It all makes sense now.
I served 8 years in the ARMY and not one time had the subject about the FLASH HIDER/SUPPRESSOR ever come up. Even being deployed to Kuwait, not one time. I do know this though, my issued Colt M16A2 had the (3) prong "SUPPRESSOR?" on the 20" barrel, along with the triangular hand guard.

Believe it or not, some of those three pronged flash suppressors are designed to bias the gases up as well.

Not unexpected as far as the military not instructing you about the various muzzle devices and what they do and don't do. They are more interest in you operating the rifle or pistol correctly than you understanding the nuances as to why and what things are designed to do. The Air Force is the same way. As long as you can hit what you aim at and don't endanger your comrades in the process, that's pretty much good enough.


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This old man thanks you as well. The only thing the AF had us worry about was being within 3000'.

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Peace was my Profession

For you fellas who like to reference military....

I have the US Marine Corps Technical Manual for the M16A2.
TM 05538C-23 Oct 1983.

That muzzle thingie..... is referenced as a "compensator" with an illustration of the rifle. It is later referenced as the compensator including an illustration on 2-5 with instructions that "the middle slot of the compensator must be straight up or at Top Dead Center (TDC). A minor variation of one-half the width of the slot on either side of TDC is allowed." and again on 2-30. And again on 3-34 along with peel washer instructions. Section II C-12 is the upper receiver and barrel assembly parts number list. The compensator is part # 9349051.

My wife in the above vids agrees with you.
So do I.

But as far as noise... like MichiganScott said a lot depends on range design (as well as brake design).

A public range in this area, Prentice Cooper, has a low flat overhead, rear wall only about three feet behind the shooter and side walls. It's a horrible design for noise no matter what firearm. Use a brake here, particularly one with side ports that are angled rearward, and youv'e got an extraordinary brain pounding experience for the shooter and everyone else. On the flip side... using my brake at my club no problemo.

This is a pic of Prentice Cooper I plucked off the Net. It is truly horrible in regard to noise.

Muzzle thingie!! Your wife must be talking to my wife!!

Vietnam era Manual..

A.

B.


Answer from the Military - COMPENSATOR (1) prevents muzzle rising while firing.




TM 9-1005-319-10 (2010) - OPERATOR'S MANUAL FOR RIFLE, 5.56 MM, M16A2/M16A3/M4 - Google Drive

In those illustrations I see the M16A2 has the round hand guards. That's very interesting because, my M16A2 had the triangular hand guards.

I think it has to do when the rifles were built. I'm not sure on that though. It may have been a retrofit thing on older rifles. I know the ones I've carried all had round hand guards.


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Well then the military got ripped because it doesn't.

When I was in basic, they gave us a typical military briefing on the M-16. I remember it because it was straight out of the movies. They made two points that stood out to me. First was the purpose of the little wings on either side of the front sight. He told us they were there for protection and not to be used for an aiming aid. He drove his point home by slamming the front sight on the table really hard. Second, and not really germane to this discussion, was his assertion that the rifle was originally invented to kill people. Hunting was just a serendipitous benefit.

He also mentioned the flash suppressor/hider. I don't remember the specific term he used, but he did say it was there to reduce the flash signature. He said it didn't eliminate the flash, but reduced it considerably. They made no mention of reducing muzzle rise. Of course they probably didn't care.

We then went immediately to the range where we fired the M-16 with a .22LR adapter kit. Completely anti-climactic. I missed expert because the idiot next to me shot my target. I would have had a perfect score if not for him.

They didn't let us fire it on burst.

Many years later I went through the CATM course. At that course they made no mention of the muzzle device what-so-ever. I had an M-4 in that course and I can tell you, while controllable, the A2 muzzle device is a sorry excuse for a muzzle brake, if it's supposed to be one, and I don't care what the manual says.

I have an M-4 clone with the A2 muzzle "thingie" and one with a real muzzle brake. I also have a 20" barrel that has no muzzle device on it. The A2 is the same as the 20" without any muzzle device. So, they may call it a compensator, and because it does indeed direct some gas up, you may be able to calculate the physics of how much it will reduce muzzle rise. But it's not a brake and the amount of rise it reduces is not significant enough to be felt by normal humans.

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I don't follow military number designations much, but isn't the current one an M16A3?

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Freedom isn't free.

I don't know. All I remember is that in BT I was issued an H&R M16A1 with the triangular hand guards. Before I left Ft. Benning, GA. in Nov. 1990 I was issued a Colt M16A2 with triangular hand guards.

If nothing else... at least we have a new definition of "mil-spec"-- Ripped off!

Having worked for the USAF for 33 years and having been part of the acquisition process for many very expensive items, it always makes me laugh when people use the term "MIL-SPEC" to denote quality. It might and it might not. MIL-SPEC is simply a list of what the military wants. Whether or not a particular vendor can provide that is another story altogether.

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Freedom isn't free.

One of the changes from A1 to A2 was use of round hand guards. The triangular were A1 and earlier, only.

From here on out, We shall call it the Flash surpresshidecomp..
or FSHC for short..


LOL.. just kiddin with Y'all..

You bring up a valid point. As critical as we sometimes get with those who call a magazine a clip, receiver extension a buffer tube... on and on... I suppose the only fair thing to do is scold ourselves for calling the A2 muzzle thingie a flash hider or flash suppressor when the military references it as a compensator. Oh boy... this could get rough.