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Old 08-23-2017, 11:58 AM
rum_runner rum_runner is offline
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Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip?  
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Default Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip?

I can get a small rail. Just wondered was the hand guard strong enough to hold it and a grip. Nothing else will be added. If not, what should I get. Not wanting to spend a large amount.
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Old 08-23-2017, 03:47 PM
cyphertext cyphertext is offline
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I must ask, if you are not adding anything else to the rifle, then why add the vertical grip? The military added vertical grips to the rifles as other gear such as lights, PEQ boxes, and other whiz bang devices took up room on the rails of the hand guard... If you are not adding these other things, then why add the vertical grip?

But to answer your question, yes, you can mount it and it will hold.

Last edited by cyphertext; 08-23-2017 at 04:00 PM.
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Old 08-24-2017, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by rum_runner View Post
I can get a small rail. Just wondered was the hand guard strong enough to hold it and a grip. Nothing else will be added. If not, what should I get. Not wanting to spend a large amount.
So you want to add a rail to the stock cheap plastic hand guards?

Any reason you don't want to use a drop in quad rail?

I'm sure your way would work but I would bet before long one of the plastic hand guards would break.

You can get a cheap drop in quad rail for like $30
M4 and AR15 / AR16 - 6.75" Quad Rail - 161275, Grips at Sportsman's Guide

I should have been more specific, what I meant was any aluminum drop in would seem better than a polymer hand guard. Polymer hand guards are known to flex with with grips attached.

As far a quad rail ,keymod or Mloc that's user preference. I was just posting an example with the link, they have cheap and expensive just depends on the OP's budget.

The magpul moe might be sturdier than the oem hand guards, but when I looked at them they seemed fat.
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Old 08-24-2017, 09:45 AM
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Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip?  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hdrolling View Post
So you want to add a rail to the stock cheap plastic hand guards?

Any reason you don't want to use a drop in quad rail?

I'm sure your way would work but I would bet before long one of the plastic hand guards would break.

You can get a cheap drop in quad rail for like $30
M4 and AR15 / AR16 - 6.75" Quad Rail - 161275, Grips at Sportsman's Guide
So you want to add cheap railed handguards of unknown quality to replace cheap plastic handguards?

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Old 08-24-2017, 09:56 AM
Hillbillyhero Hillbillyhero is offline
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Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip?  
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Do yourself a favor and don't buy a quad rail especially a cheap one. Save your money and get a lightweight quality handguard with Mlok or Keymod. Just one person's opinion.

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Last edited by Hillbillyhero; 08-24-2017 at 10:01 AM.
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Old 08-24-2017, 11:39 AM
cyphertext cyphertext is offline
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Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip?  
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I agree with the recommendation of avoiding a quad rail, both cheap or expensive.

The cheapest route is to get the rail that attaches through the vent holes in the stock hand guard... it works... many have done that over the years.

A better solution would be one of the Magpul M LOK handguards... allows you to attach the vertical grip and has the additional bonus of heat guards. About $30 for this option. There are other solutions similar to this as well.

Or, free float it and put an extended M LOK hand guard on.
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Old 08-24-2017, 12:34 PM
Scotiapilot Scotiapilot is offline
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NO they are not, try magpul m loc
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Old 08-24-2017, 01:55 PM
arnoob arnoob is offline
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If you want to stick with the classic style for looks you could upgrade to a BCM M4 hand guard, I don't have a vertical grip on mine (not a fan) but the hand guard is night and day more solid than the one that comes with the Sport.

M4 Handguards Black
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Old 08-24-2017, 03:00 PM
C J C J is offline
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There are rails that mount to the handguard that can be made to be very strong. I used this setup with my stock handguard only I put larger washers inside to give the rail added strength.




It gave me plenty of strength to add a vertical grip. I eventually changed to a Magpul handguard because I wanted a heat shield but I still use the same rail mount.

As for why a person would want a vertical grip I find the handguards on pretty much all AR's to be uncomfortable to hold and hard to hold steady because I don't think I get a good enough grip on the handguards. A vertical grip gives me a lot more control over the front end of my rifle. I'm not saying that everyone will have that issue but for me it was a no brainer especially since I could mount a decent vertical grip for about $20 including the rail. I have a vertical grip on both of my AR's. One has a quadrail that doesn't need the added rail obviously. Quadrails to me are especially hard to grip well. Accuracy depends on a solid grip so I add a vertical grip and it helps me considerably.
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Old 08-25-2017, 05:18 AM
Hillbillyhero Hillbillyhero is offline
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Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip?  
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My first handguard was a Troy Delta Rail/Battle Rail. You don't want to spend that much money probably. I liked those at the time because you could just drop them in and free float your barrel and were very light weight. All kinds of cheaper options out there now though. A lot of people buy certain types of quadrails and they end up adding an extra 2 pounds on their gun...lol. I'm a weight snob.Don't seem like much but it is.

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Last edited by Hillbillyhero; 08-25-2017 at 05:24 AM.
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Old 08-25-2017, 05:32 AM
Hillbillyhero Hillbillyhero is offline
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Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip?  
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I like the kinda stubby vert grip. Blackhawk makes a good one in my opinion I liked it better than my magpul grip.
Blackhawk Rail Mount Vertical Grip - Blackhawk Weapon Accessory | Up To 29% OFF 4 Star Rating Free Shipping over $49!
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Last edited by Hillbillyhero; 08-25-2017 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 08-25-2017, 01:16 PM
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Rastoff Rastoff is offline
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Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip? Factory hand guard strong enough for vertical grip?  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cyphertext View Post
I must ask, if you are not adding anything else to the rifle, then why add the vertical grip? The military added vertical grips to the rifles as other gear such as lights, PEQ boxes, and other whiz bang devices took up room on the rails of the hand guard... If you are not adding these other things, then why add the vertical grip?

But to answer your question, yes, you can mount it and it will hold.
Maybe he just likes that hand position?
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Old 08-25-2017, 01:45 PM
cyphertext cyphertext is offline
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Maybe he just likes that hand position?
Maybe... but maybe he thought it looks cool but doesn't understand why the military added it to their rifles... maybe he doesn't understand that it does not enhance accuracy as some believe...

He's new to the AR. Doesn't want to spend a lot... seems like a waste to me.
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Old 08-25-2017, 01:47 PM
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Vertical grips come in different sizes and are used in a number of ways.

Long VG, sometimes referred to as broomsticks, are often used because of not enough room available on the handguard. Shooter simply wraps his hand around it.

Short VG is often used not because there is a lack of handguard space but to create a grip position. Shooter sometimes wraps only three fingers around the VG while thumb and forefinger are on the handguard. Thumb is often in a good position to manipulate a light switch.

Short VG can also be a makeshift adjustable monopod. Shooter wraps his hand around the VG and adjusts grip position for desired height, using the side of the palm as the contact surface.

Last edited by ChattanoogaPhil; 08-25-2017 at 06:28 PM.
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Old 08-25-2017, 02:04 PM
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Rastoff Rastoff is offline
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Maybe... but maybe he thought it looks cool but doesn't understand why the military added it to their rifles... maybe he doesn't understand that it does not enhance accuracy as some believe...

He's new to the AR. Doesn't want to spend a lot... seems like a waste to me.
Even if it's just to "look cool", so what? How else will we learn? You've bought stuff you took off and so have I. It's the rabbit hole and we must all go down it somewhat.

I guess my point is that we can relate the original history without questioning the motives of the questioner. I have an AFG on my X95 because it's more comfortable with the short frame. Because I can reach further on the AR, I don't need the angled grip.

Since we're talking about it, I have a GripPod I'll let go of if anyone is interested.
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Old 08-25-2017, 03:11 PM
C J C J is offline
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Quote:
maybe he doesn't understand that it does not enhance accuracy as some believe...
I originally put a vertical grip on my Sport because I wanted to get my hand away from the heat of a barrel with no heat shield. Then I discovered I like the ergonomics much better and I kept it after I put a heat shield on the Sport. I also put one on my Aero Precision because it has a quad rail and I find them uncomfortable to grip.

Ergonomics can make for better shooting. It doesn't make the rifle shoot any better. it makes the shooter better sometimes. Not always but sometimes. It helped me.
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Old 08-25-2017, 03:45 PM
cyphertext cyphertext is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rastoff View Post
Even if it's just to "look cool", so what? How else will we learn? You've bought stuff you took off and so have I. It's the rabbit hole and we must all go down it somewhat.

I guess my point is that we can relate the original history without questioning the motives of the questioner. I have an AFG on my X95 because it's more comfortable with the short frame. Because I can reach further on the AR, I don't need the angled grip.

Since we're talking about it, I have a GripPod I'll let go of if anyone is interested.
You're right... I shouldn't question why someone would want to do something that hundreds have done before him, only to throw it in the parts bin a few months later.

From my training, the vertical fore grip was a compromise solution for not having enough space to maintain a proper grip on the rifle... without other stuff, there is no need for one. I guess I am not the typical AR owner who likes to hang a bunch of useless stuff off of my rifle. If I put it on the rifle, it is there to serve a purpose, other than looking tacticool.
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Old 08-28-2017, 08:27 AM
rum_runner rum_runner is offline
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Thanks for all of the info. Reasoning for the grip would be because the round factory fore arm feels a little strange to me. I may get used to it. My AK's have "slab sided" Galil hand guards. The Cetme and PTR have slab sided guards. Most of my milsurp bolt guns have finger grooves.
I am 60 years old and have no desire to slap anything on my guns to look "cool". I want function and reliability. I suppose that's why I hunted for over 30 years with an UNMODIFIED Mauser 98k, while many of my friends, and most club members carried "nice" Rugers, Remingtons, etc.
I never had to "cry" over the finish getting scratched or dinged while being bounced around in a Jeep.
And yes, it killed deer just as dead as the "cool" looking guns.
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Old 08-28-2017, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rum_runner View Post
Thanks for all of the info. Reasoning for the grip would be because the round factory fore arm feels a little strange to me. I may get used to it. My AK's have "slab sided" Galil hand guards. The Cetme and PTR have slab sided guards. Most of my milsurp bolt guns have finger grooves.
I am 60 years old and have no desire to slap anything on my guns to look "cool". I want function and reliability. I suppose that's why I hunted for over 30 years with an UNMODIFIED Mauser 98k, while many of my friends, and most club members carried "nice" Rugers, Remingtons, etc.
I never had to "cry" over the finish getting scratched or dinged while being bounced around in a Jeep.
And yes, it killed deer just as dead as the "cool" looking guns.
The small OEM hand guards didn't work for me either, I used a free float extended quad rail so I could reach my arm out a little further to where it's more comfortable.

The only reason I didn't recommend attaching a grip to the stock hand guards is that I read in other places that the plastic is know to flex, that might not always be the case but I wouldn't trust it.

The quad rail link I posted was just an example of how cheap you could go to get something that might be a little more durable. Quad rail Mloc and keymod are buyers preference, that just depends on what you prefer and how much you want to spend.

If you do add the rail to your stock setup I'd be interested in you review after you have some miles on it.

I have limited experience with civilian AR's, only started getting into it last winter. I have a couple decades of use with military AR's but were not allowed to really customize our rifles, everyone had to be more or less in uniform with each other. But my M4's always had a grip on them, it's the next best thing if you can't use and extended hand guard IMO.

Now that I own my own AR's I mod them to suit my needs and wants, I have no shame in my tacticool rifles.

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Old 08-28-2017, 10:33 AM
cyphertext cyphertext is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rum_runner View Post
Thanks for all of the info. Reasoning for the grip would be because the round factory fore arm feels a little strange to me. I may get used to it. My AK's have "slab sided" Galil hand guards. The Cetme and PTR have slab sided guards. Most of my milsurp bolt guns have finger grooves.
If you are looking to get away from the round hand guard, there are many replacement hand guards to choose from that may give you a more familiar feel. Added bonus, they will come with heat shields.

Although I haven't replaced the hand guards on my Sport, that is one upgrade that makes a lot of sense... My .22lr AR has better hand guards than what came on the Sport!
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Old 09-02-2017, 02:48 PM
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I'm running a Magpul VG on mine and it's worked out fine.

I do not believe the plastic used on the handguard is battleworthy.

I plan on changing out the handguard primarily due to heat issues. The VFG also helps with getting the front hand away from the heat at times.

Doesn't matter WHY you want a VFG, if it fits the way you run your rifle, do it. Just make sure to try different methods checking both your times and accuracy for a semi-objective answer. I run a VFG because I shoot better and differently when wearing plates using it. (I was a Sig fan and hated Glock, but I shot more accurately and slightly faster with a G17 over a 226)

As stated above, change it out for an MLOK or Keymod. Skip the quad rail unless you're going to be hanging 3+ items on your gun.

Wait, skip the quad rail anyway. There are so many better options.

Most people are fine with a light and if wanted a finger/hand placement device.
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Old 09-02-2017, 05:10 PM
Danc0320 Danc0320 is offline
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I am planning on ordering this. On the cheaper side but I have heard alot of good reviews on it, and its not plastic.
Drop-In, Enhanced, 7" -FDE | Troy Industries
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Old 09-02-2017, 08:22 PM
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I am planning on ordering this. On the cheaper side but I have heard alot of good reviews on it, and its not plastic.
Drop-In, Enhanced, 7" -FDE | Troy Industries
That's not on the "cheaper" side of anything! You can get drop in quad rails for much less than that, especially that quads are not in vogue anymore.
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Old 09-16-2017, 07:15 PM
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I got lucky my sport II came with a magpul moe hand guard. I put on a magpul handstop and it works perfect for me.
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Old 09-17-2017, 12:58 PM
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Rumrunner, there's no reason to not try to fit a vertical foregrip to your plastic handguards. If the VFG eventually pulls out of the plastic, you're not out anything.

However, a more elegant solution would be to try the MagPul Slimline handguard. It's narrower than the round handguards and it's cross section is that of flattened oval. I find the Slimline to be very comfortable in my hand. The Slimline also has good heat shielding and the polymer it's made from is very tough. I believe MagPul makes a VFG that mounts directly to the handguard and you won't have to worry about it pulling through. The slimline is longer than other handguards and covers the bottom and sides of the gas block. Gas block get quite hot and this protects your hands. All in all, the Slimline is well thought out and an excellent value

I use the Slimline on all of my ARS that don't use free float tubes and wouldn't hesitate to buy another one.
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Old 09-17-2017, 09:30 PM
hugger-4641 hugger-4641 is offline
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I have a UTG rail and vertIcal grip I bought from a forum member here. I had doubts about the strength of the hand gaurd also, but it is plenty strong.
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