I have a question for you that caring the sd9 as a ccw. I normally don’t carry the sd9 as a ccw because the sd9 is too big and too heavy on the office job.
But I carry the sd9 on the boat or vehicle.
The sd9 has no safety and I feel not comfortable with a bullet in the chamber without any safety besides a long triggerway directly on my bones.
How do you handle the sdve in a ccw scenario? Do you carry a Bullet in the barrel or not? What is your take on it?
Thank you

This question comes up quite often with different models. The answer comes down to this. Without a round chambered, you are basically carrying an unloaded weapon. The chances of you being able to camber a round in an emergency are almost none. What if someone grabs one of your arms or hands. If you are carrying without a round chambered, you might be better off to use it as a club.

With a round chambered, the probability of a ND is at the highest when you holster, so you want to make sure nothing is getting suck in your trigger guard. You will want to make sure your holster is made for your gun and is good quality. It should cover your trigger and not move around.

I have a Shield with a safety that I use when holstering and then I switch it off.

Might as well carry it loaded. A couple things have to happen for the SD to fire. First the trigger has to be pressed back enough to disengage the trigger safety. The trigger safety works the same as a Glock. But instead of using a blade in the center of the trigger, it uses a hinged trigger setup. Then only when the trigger is pulled all the way to the rear, will the trigger bar press up on the firing pin block allowing the firing pin to reach the primer. These are actual physically operating safeties that work along with each other for the pistol to fire. If the striker ever would release accidentally, the block is still there to stop it unless it's physically pushed out of the way...

L8R,
Matt

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SD40-VE owner and proud of it!

"....bullet in the barrel...." I hate squib loads.......don't you? LOL

Do you ever carry a S&W revolver?

Don't bring up revolvers. We're still not done with the last "Lock" thread.

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

Suggest you take a good pistol class and get more familiar with handling your gun, which usually alleviates the common anxiety in new shooters of the plastic fantastic. A proper holster and proper gun handling are vital, and when you practice drawing, cocking and firing against the clock, compared to just drawing and firing, you will probably answer your own question.

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Science plus Art

I do both , may not make sense to some , but depends on where I am & who is around. I did take a class & do practice both I can draw & rack really fast but nothing is faster than having a round in the chamber. Also racking the slide does make a distinctive sound.

Judging by the terminology and the question asked I would say to this guy, don't carry anything until you take some lessons.

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Back to back World War Champs.

Huuummmm:
U guys mean I should not deal with a gun at all and go first for a training to go familiar with a weapon?

OK - you guys mean 3 wars several small civilian unrest in Africa 7 injuries and day and night patrols in war zones are not enough?
Well true, a war zone is different and in a war zone I would not ask the question. Lucky me I live not in a war zone anymore but in the land of the free Texas. The biggest problem here in my neighborhood are some liberals looking for drug money.

But OK. I did not know that I'm dealing here with supra green barrettes of pistol fights.
Sorry to ask that question.

Barney Fife

Barney, I think you answered your own question. It's different.

Just for my own information, did you ask your drill sergeant if you should carry a "bullet in the barrel?"

(that was kinda mean . . . I know)

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

Bundesheer....no offense meant.....you gave us no background and as someone pointed out your terminology left; me at least ,wondering about your experience level.

When I opened your thread "Bullet in the barrel"...... that's a squib load....I noted; "LOL"...... that I was joking...

The second part of my answer was a brief but more serious inquiry and response........I don't own a sd9..... but my recollection is that it has a long (well at least longer than a Glock) trigger.......if you are comfortable with a revolver then you may be comfortable with the sd9.

Edit: Thinking/reading your second post.........."barrettes".... might I recommend a Beretta 92 Compact......they are making them again (with a light rail)....... 13+1 vs. 15 and 4.25 inch barrel vs. 4.9 compared to a issue 92. You can carry concealed without too much effort ( I often do) or consider it a OWB "almost full size" gun..........I'm assuming (which got me in trouble the first time...LOL) it's a platform you familiar and comfortable with. with factory /meg-gar mags and hollow-point it's not "Uncle Sugar's" 92!!!!!!!!!

A general followed by a specfic comment...

Many members here have posted a similar question stating that they have very little gun handling experience...obviously this does not pertain to you, but you didn't state this from the outset.

To answer your specific question, you have to follow what your training and experience shows works for you. Most people here (many who have military, law enforcement or other training) will tell you it is perfectly safe to carry your SD9 with a round in the chamber. From a functional/mechanical standpoint that is true but it may not pertain to you and your specific situation. Hope this is helpful.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

Yes, same carry principle as any double action revolver. Rounds are loaded, but it won't fire unless your finger is pressing the trigger back. It may just be feeling strange to you carrying around civilians. Honestly I would not carry the pistol unloaded. If something happens and you can't rack the slide back, all you have is a small billy club.

L8R,
Matt

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SD40-VE owner and proud of it!

Attachment 162794
One in the pipe and a good holster...

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CCA of North Carolina
A.D.S.I

I always recommend carrying a bullet in the barrel unless you carry a revolver.

Your extensive experience with military weapons changes my advice not at all. The manual of arms for a striker-fired civilian carry piece is quite different, and I have many military types who find my 3 hour classroom and range familiarization with the new striker guns quite valuable. With the trigger safety, new precautions and habits need to be learned to protect the trigger from anything that could cause a negligent discharge, such as a strap on a holster (wrong holster!).
I have had to DQ some Army guys at club competitions because they had the nasty habit of keeping their finger on the trigger while running between firing points.
So no, military training does not usually cover the manual of arms for the striker fired guns. And in my familiarization class, we don't cover military tactics like looking for land mines

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Science plus Art

One in the chamber and most definitely a good holster that helps keep your finger out of the trigger guard.

Bill

If you are not going to carry in condition one, at least carry a large, all metal, heavy handgun so you can pistol whip someone with it.

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U.S. Navy - U.S. Army, ret

You can be as defensive and as "snarky" as you care to be, but the fact remains that your question could have been more properly worded.

I don't care if we're talking about General Patton or Sergeant York (or even a member of the "Green Berets")...if they aren't aware of the difference between the "barrel" and the "chamber" of a firearm, or the difference between a "bullet" and a "cartridge", they may require further instruction before walking around anywhere with a loaded gun.

You must do what is right for you, and for your level of experience and confidence, both in yourself and in your chosen platform. But, by and large...the general consensus is that, if you're competent enough to carry a firearm, and you have chosen a relatively modern quality firearm and proper gear (holster/belt/etc.)...the best choice will almost always be to have a round chambered.

Tim

I thought we had a "search" feature on this forum.

Do we not???

This question comes up at least once each WEEK!!!!

For someone who was trained on a Beretta M9 or a 1911, I can understand the discomfort of having no external safety. For a person like this, it does seem questionable to carry a gun with a round in the chamber, and risk it discharging unintentionally. However, the trigger on a 1911 or a M9 in SA mode is a very, very different trigger than on the SDVE. I would never carry one of these two guns (1911, M9) with a round in the chamber and the hammer cocked...unless the pistol was also "locked" (as can you do with a 1911; the M9 will decock, unless I have completely forgotten the action...I haven't owned one in a while.)

There are people who advocate the "Israeli draw" method of carry to address just this concern. (That is, the pistol is carried without a round in the chamber, and the slide is racked as the pistol is drawn.) If you are going to use this method, I would suggest that you train extensively, until it becomes second nature, relying on muscle memory, and doesn't require you to "think" about your action. Even then, under stress, it may not go as smoothly as when you drill...but extensive drilling may help compensate for stress reactions, if you have done it to the point that it over-rides any other conditions.

However, as others have suggested, the SDVE pistols have a purpose-designed heavier trigger to alleviate two possible concerns: one being an accidental/negligent discharge; and the other being very similar, but involving firing unintentionally when you are holding on a person. (There are many that also say you should never point a gun at another person unless you intend to shoot them, so you should shoot them if you point the gun at them anyway...but that's a different discussion.) If you handle your SDVE series gun sufficiently, I think you'll find that the instances where the trigger actually gets unintentionally pulled hard enough to cock and release the striker and fire the weapon just don't happen in NORMAL use. I emphasize normal use, including taking normal safety precautions (keep your booger hook off the bang switch, use a good holster, etc.) The reason that you hear about "Glock leg" incidents is that the trigger on even a standard/stock Glock is much lighter than on a SDVE, and also most if not all of these incidents have a negligence factor. I've yet to read of any account where a human wasn't involved.

I'd suggest you carry your SDVE pistol unloaded for a while...to see how it works for you, and if you encounter any concerns. If you can't get comfortable with it, and you don't feel comfortable with an Israeli draw, then a different pistol might be a better choice...one with a safety.

If you do choose to carry your pistol unloaded for a while, carry another pistol as well. Loaded.

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

For me, it's mostly psychological and probably some ignorance about how striker fired pistols work internally. I feel much more comfortable with a revolver or double action auto with a round chambered. Again, I don't know exactly why, but I do. I should probably pay a gunsmith to take apart my Shield 9mm and show me how it works internally.

LOL

I guess I should have clarified that...I meant around the house, as a test, to see if he had any incidents. An unloaded gun is not much better than a rock. Unless it's a Hi-Point...then it is much better than a rock. Those things are heavy!

Just a thought. You said you were not comfortable carrying the gun with a round in the chamber. If you are not comfortable, don't do it.

But I would encourage you to work on getting comfortable. The SD has a trigger that you really have to want to pull in order to fire it. Its the perfect gun to use to work on becoming comfortable (as opposed to something like a PPQ which will fire when a gnat lands on it -- almost).

Until this post, no one here knew what kind/type experience you had with handguns; or firearms in general. There are so many helpful, professional and knowledgeable people here that are willing to help/share, that being defensive/sarcastic is not really necessary.

I carried revolvers for many, many years. Getting comfortable with ANY semi-auto handgun was very hard for me. I have carried many different formats, and yes it took me a while to get/be comfortable with each one. I am a new owner of an SD9VE and just fired my first 100 rounds through it this week. I carried it today for the first time for a few hours. I was a little nervous, which is funny; since I carry a 1911 45 auto "cocked & locked". This too took me a while to get comfortable with. Carrying my 1911 is as comfortable now as having my morning coffee.

You are the one who has to be comfortable with your choice of a carry firearm. Practice and familiarization will be key to you becoming comfortable with it; whatever you choose in the end. Good luck and please, we are all here to help when you have questions; be respectful to those who choose to help/respond.

I carry several hand guns on a regular basis…….everything from a full size 1911, to a J frame Smith& Wesson……I realize that no S&W revolvers have a safety on them, but I will not stick a striker fired weapon without a safety in my pants…….the police actually have a term for the AD of one of these weapons…….Glock leg.

Semper Fi!

Guys, it's pretty obvious that English is not his first language, and I think that has confused the question.
Please cut him some slack.
Thanks.

There's a reason they call it Glock leg...

I wouldn't carry a gun with a 5lb or less trigger pull unless it had a safety. With an (approx) 8 lb pull on a SDVE, I don't think I'm going to have an issue. As for "sticking it in your pants" I assume you mean with a good holster...because if not, I'd agree with you 100%. I don't want ANY gun in my pants without a good holster...not even a revolver. They make pocket holsters, IWB holsters, OWB holsters, and shoulder holsters, to name a few...plus even some for the ladies (bra holsters.)

There are just too many choices to risk carrying any gun loose in your pants.

Bundesheer; I alternate between two carry guns, one being an SD9VE. I carry it with a round in the chamber as it was designed to do so and because, due to surgery, I lost 25% of my left arm strength so I can't count on being able to"rack a round" quickly. We all want to help, so do what's right for you. Good luck bud!

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Music/Sports/Beer fan

I own two SD9VE's both of which are carried with a cartridge in the chamber.

Which I do believe is what the OP meant.

They have a number of passive safeties but the foremost one is between my ears which says finger off trigger until muzzle's on target.

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NULLI SECUNDUS

Ok, I have to explain, English is not my native language but that some here became the impression it would be is positive for me. Therefore the argument about single words like a barrel or a chamber, bullet or cartridge or something different is not important to me, as long as U guys understand what I am talking about.
You are right and I should have. But it seems to me a long opening already and I would keep it short. Sorry.
And – Having military experiences means not always that they really know what they do. Every one of us that was in the service knows that there are people in the service that for several reasons you don’t like to have behind you with a loaded gun. Just saying.

You are right and I apologize for that.
I disagree. It points to non native English speakers (did U see my Nic and can U translate it) that not familiar with all the words given to specify a certain point on an equipment. Try to rewrite your post in French, will se how you doing. I am pretty satisfied with my English and I haven seen or heard an American complaining about my English or how I use it when I kept my skin in the line. Just saying.

I understand that many of U if not the most have a strong feeling to keep a bullet in the chamber even there is no safety beside the long triggerway of the sdve. My trigger is modified by a gunsmith and I have only 5 lb to pull. That makes my sd to a very smooth shooter that don’t have to fear a PPX or PPQ trigger on a target range. I did that because the sd is to big for me to carry on a daily base (office job) but I carry it in the car and boat with 15+1 for sure. WalMart etc I have it in a cheap IWB holster and unloaded 15+0. Especially the 15+0 carry made me feel a little like going without a gun at all.
I never thought I carry the sd as a sd gun but it turned out I like this gun very much, so I want to keep it closer. May be I should buy me 2 additional sdve without a modified trigger,. the question don’t even arise than at all.

I hope I have no one offended and if so than I honestly apologize for that.

Well done mon aml! Glad you told us about the 5lb. modified trigger pull. I would not keep one in the chamber either. When I moved to this country, I had to learn a new language. Fortunately I came from England. True dat!

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Music/Sports/Beer fan

Well, then, I don't blame you...I wouldn't carry a round in the chamber on a gun that has a 5 lb trigger pull without a safety either. I know it's been debated a lot here, but I personally believe that the trigger shouldn't be modified on a SDVE...it was designed to have a heavier trigger as a safety device. If someone wants a gun with a lighter trigger, then he should buy a gun designed with a lighter trigger and a safety.

I forget who said it, but "England and America...two people separated by a common language."

But is at least for me very interesting that with a little trigger job the sdve can play a very good role on a target range beside all this high prized and well advertised $ guns. Just saying. I’m saying that my $ 319.00 sd9ve with a $ 62.00 guns smith trigger modification can easy play with the M&P’s, Walther and Glockmeisters in the shelve above.

Hummmm. Hahaha - Well that happen when you go to the colonies to live with the colonists. Right ., It’s not so bad at all

True...and each man can decide what he wants to do with his gun. IMO, it makes more sense to make modifications to a range-use only gun, than it does for one you wish to use for CCW or HD. Often times, the modifications to the fire control group end up inducing malfunctions.


Colonies my butt! If it wasn't for America, England and France would be speaking German right now.

Das ist wirklich wichtig!
You right and really the most of the people don't even know how right you are. But what a war can't do, you can do from inside out on your self. The Egypt, Romans, Greek and many more went the same way. It all about opinions, promises of free loads, false entitlement etc. No one ask where the stuff will come from and how this all would look like in the daily live of the people and how much control is necessary to keep it up. One reason why I ended up in the US military.
You can not make everyone equal without making go away Billions of people that have a disagreement with the equalizer.
You cannot buy everyone shoes to make them equal because Billions on earth don't wanna shoes and trow it away as soon you deliver them. But you can take everyone shoes away to make them equal. Keep that in mind.

Belief me no one want to live in the free land of the equalizers. Today still many coming to the shore from all arround the world even from the high priced equalizer land of Europe to this wonderful in-perfect jewel of nation of the US, because they cant stand to be equal anymore.
Hope the american never forget why they were founded, how hard it was to defend it and how hard it was to keep it all this time alive.

My 5 cent.

If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you can read it in English, thank your military.

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U.S. Navy - U.S. Army, ret

If your EDC Semi-Auto is one that you are not comfortable carrying with a round in the chamber, then get a different gun, and sell the one you have, as it is effectively useless as EDC.

There are a number of ways to go, but having an EDC carried in Condition 3 is not where you want to be.

You may well find that a 5 lb trigger is a bit touchy for EDC without an external safety. Others would be very comfortable. Its all in what you get used to and what your level of comfort is.

But I have often wondered about the wisdom of carrying any gun with a trigger that has been extensively modified. You may want to become familiar with how some courts have viewed modified guns before you make your decision on carrying it at all.

I, too, have put all of the Apex stuff in my SD, including the polymer trigger. Those modifications have given me a gun that is a true delight to use at the range and I would make the changes again in a heartbeat. The trigger take-up is almost gone, the reset is instantaneous, and the pull is just over 5.5 lbs. If I had to put it back to OEM specs, I probably wouldn't like it anymore. But the SD is not my carry weapon, nor is it my primary SD weapon.

But if you ever really need a weapon, its pretty unlikely that the bad guys will cut you some slack while you rack the slide. It seems to me that your best bet is to work on achieving a level of comfort with it, or find a gun that you will be comfortable with. As you have found out already, the SD is a pretty great little gun. I'd work on getting comfortable.

This is all that needed to be said. For what it's worth, your original post was done well enough that I wasn't thinking that language was an issue. I commend anyone who is multilingual.

I have dabbled in German and Italian, but that was many years ago, and I'm afraid I've forgotten almost all of it.

I apologize for any misunderstanding.

Tim

Lol. Exactly.....

http://youtu.be/1hJQsvoY6VU

He didn't say it first but he sure puts it into perspective.

Sent from my BlackBerry Z10 using Tapatalk

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Later,
Hock

I suspected there was a language barrier at work.

That said regardless of the gun if you aren't comfortable carrying it with a round in the chamber then you need to carry a different gun.

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Retired Career Security Guard

All auto that I buy has a safety on them! This way I fell safe to carry one in the chamber. I do not have one that has a safety like the Glock.

Interesting points, and definitely safe with round in chamber, except perhaps for holstering issues. It helps if shooter started with revolvers and gained that confidence.

However, aren't the Israeli's, who seem to be in sufficiently more dangerous situations, trained to carry Condition 3?

And at least one of our Armed Services I have heard require safety ON with empty chamber on the M9.

Air Force I have read is the most liberal re carry- Condition 2, safety OFF;

Some military require round in chamber safety ON, and there's also empty chamber safety ON referenced above! Correct me if wrong, guys.

Glock only has passive trigger safety and firing pin block- no manual safety.

There's really no reason to feel unsafe with any modern hammer or striker-fired auto (with automatic firing pin block/safety) with manual safety OFF, unless one inadvertently and thoroughly pulls the trigger. This applies to Glock, also, which may be considered SA auto along with some others.

I'm not going to beat you up on this, do what you feel comfortable with. Let me put it to you like this.

You're carrying for self defense. Studies have shown that a BG with a knife can cover 21 feet (7 yards, which is defensive pistol range), in 2 seconds or less. Not much time to draw, load, aim, and fire. Remember, in a defensive situation, YOU are the target. The bad guy has seen you, he has picked you as his target, he has made a plan on how he wants to deal with you, and he is on his way to do the deed. You are the target, you don't know you're the target, you have no idea the bad guy is on the way, and you don't have a plan on how to deal with him. Everything you do is a reaction to what occurs after the BG makes his presence known. Every second spent preparing to react is a second less you have to survive his attack. The "one in the pipe" if you will, may be the difference between you or someone you love, going home or being a statistic on the evening news.

Practice, practice, practice, then practice some more. Focus on your surroundings, people, places, things, movement, and develop and update a plan as you move. Become very familiar with your carry firearm of choice, to the point that carrying it becomes second nature, and if it doesn't work for you, find one that will. If you can't get to that point, it won't matter what you carry or how.

Good Luck and good shooting.

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SFC, US Army, Retired

I think that is referred to as the Teuller (sp.) Drill, and I am aware of it, and I'm sure the Israeli's and others are as well. I am not advocating Condition 3 (as I carry Condition 2 with safety OFF), but there's undoubtedly merit to it, and it is a very subjective choice how one carries. Condition 3 is indisputably a safer method of carry (unless, arguably, one is engaged in a gunfight-but think of all the OTHER times where the benefit outweighs the risk, and that merely showing a firearm may stop a fight, real or potential- and let's face reality unless one is paranoid, it ain't gonna happen to the vast majority of us, even law enforcement).

Furthermore, a simple argument could be made that if one doesn't have the time to rack the slide it won't make a difference anyway. OTOH, George Zimmerman might have been killed had he not already had a round in the chamber of his PF9.

I do agree that confidence/comfort level should dictate mode of carry, gunny. So in the one in a million chance that one engages and needs to use the firearm, if one has the comfort level required for the 'KISS' method of carry, e.g., 'Point n Shoot', by all means carry that way. OTOH, I also advocate that those of us who are 'accident-prone' should be prosecuted for their ND's (they might do all a favor and not carry, or at least use the manual safety where available). The chances of a ND greatly outweigh the probability that one will have to discharge their firearm to protect life or limb.

A gunsmith improved trigger makes the SD9 no less safe than it came from the factory. The trigger still needs to be pulled, the firing pin block is still in place. Condition 1 is no less safe than condition 3 for the weapon, what benefits would there be in condition3?? I would really like to see some documented fact having to defend yourself is a 1-in-a-million-chance?? The odds of being struck by lightning in so cal are 7,538,382/1 where Mi it is 519,799 as of 2011 census, recorded # of strikes in the US, by the National Weather Service. I have not been struck by lightning, do not care to, I also have not been shot, also do not care to. I do not know what you mean by accident prone ( untrained, unable to follow instructions,lack of attention?? ) and a firearm (1911) with a "safety", is not as safe in untrained hands as a SD9, 3# vs 5# trigger.
Bottom line is that if you put your finger on the trigger and pull it the gun should go bang, if you do not understand that I would believe that you need training or should refrain from carrying/possessing a firearm. A safety does not make you safe, which is documented by the "rules" of various states that mandate ridiculous internal locks, external safeties, cable locks etc, purely political, not logical, check CDC for the decrease in ND due to safeties, I would love to see it!! Be Safe,

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I BACK OUR BLUE