Dear Smith and Wesson Fourm i would like to hear some opinions from my fellow Forum members about the Walther ppk semi automatic pistol sincerely and respectfully mg357 a proud member of the Smith and Wesson Forum

My brother bought one new (I believe from Sports Authority)about ten years ago and ended up returning it for a trade on something else. It continually malfunctioned, although I don't remember how. It's known to cause railroad tracks on your shooting hand, but S&W added a beavertail to prevent this.
Chris

mg357, I purchased a Walter ppk over 1 year ago. The first time I fired it, nothing but ftf and jams. At that same time, a recall was issued, so I contacted S&W, they provided ups instructions and label and off it went. I included a letter about the malfunctions and requested any help they could offer. The pistol was gone about 3 months due to the influx of a lot of pistols. Long story short, finally got a chance to put it through its paces with quality ammo today and it worked like a charm. Understand that it is not a comfortable weapon due to its design, but with practice it can be a lot of fun. I do carry it concealed, especially on days with very light clothing.

In 1989 I bought an Interarms Walther PPK from a local gun shop that was going out of business. It was a display model in stainless and the price was well below retail. My work schedule was hectic so I put the gun away in my safe. Almost six month later I took it out and field stripped it.

While the gun looked pristine on the outside, the inside was not. What I saw was bad workmanship. The frame’s right side slide groove was poorly machined with jagged metal its entire length. The feed ramp was not smooth—it looked carved out.

After a thorough cleaning I took it out for a test. I loaded both factory magazines with Winchester 95 GR FMJ’s. The grip magazine feed all rounds flawlessly. When I inserted the flat bottom mag and tried to chamber the first round, no luck—failure to feed jam again and again.

At 17 lbs., the double action pull is unbelievably stiff and long. The first time I shot it, I had to check to make sure the safety was not engaged. I could not pull the trigger in DA with the tip of my finger. On the other hand, the single action pull is light and the hammer breaks nicely. I have small hands but even so it manages to bite me at least once an outing. If my shooting hand rides up ever so slightly, ouch!

I’ve feed my PPK rounds form different manufactures with no problem except for Independence ammo—failure to feed about every third round. I’ve even put Winchester 85 GR Silver Tip HP’s through it without a hiccup.

Even with its flaws, I like the gun. It’s very accurate and fun to shoot.

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The PPK is a beautiful design, but quality control issues with various makers (Walther, Manhurin, S&W) have occurred -- and frankly, the PPK is the most uncomfortable-to-shoot .32 or .380 I have shot.

In my experience, very good, inexpensive, accurate, reliable and COMFORTABLE guns of the type are the Astra semi-clones (also marketed as Firestorm).

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Pisgah

My poor red blooded soul could not rest until I had a PPK or PPK/S. I guess I had seen too many James Bond movies.

My first one was the copy made in France. It was OK but the trigger was horrible and the slide cut the web of my hand a couple of times.

Later, I got the lucre together to buy a 'genuine' Walther. It was not reliable and very in-accurate. It was very cool of course. I had to wear a tux on weekends. I got a shoulder holster to wear the gun in. It was very "Bondesque", wearing a tux and carrying a PPK in a shoulder holster, but I replaced it with a gun that I had more conficence in, a J-frame Smith.

Later, a couple of decades, I tried out a Stainless Smith. There was no improvement.

This covers my almost 40 years experience with Walthers.

These days I have a P3-AT and a Bursa Thunder. I would recommend either of them. Not much sex appeal in either, but they just keep on ticking without fail or bobble.

Interarms PPKs are very well made and becoming quite collectable. I've owned mine (.32) for 10 years....flawless.

I owned a Used one for 1 day. It had quite a few FTF's and other jams. Did not like the recoil either. Got rid of it and bought a used Sig P230, what a amazing gun. It shoots great, great low recoil, functions flawlessly. My wife just bought a new Sig P232, which is the new version of the 230.

Funny - this was my same experience. Bought one of the S&W marketed Walther pistols and it was dreadful - wouldn't feed ball ammunition. Unfortunately, I bought mine brand new and paid big bucks for it. After fuming about it for 48 hours I took it back to where I bought a new Sig P323 in stainless with night sights and it was great.

Live and learn.

I made a post on 7/20 detailing some of the problems we had with a S&W PPK/S. Since them we have put a few hundred more rounds through it with out any problems. It is rather brutal on recoil, especially when comparing it to my Browning BDA. But, its the wifes CC and she is happy with it.
PPK/S update-antibashing

I bought an Interarms PPK/S a number of years ago. My wife was enamored by the thought of being able to shoot the James Bond gun. She quickly gave up on that thought as the recoil is pretty tough and she had numerous FTFs.

It is well made. We have had some problems with it. The most common FTF was due to limp wristing. It can also be tough on the web of your hand. A few types of ammo (.380 Blazer) had problems. But, for my pistol as long as you have the right ammo (most brands and my reloads are fine) and a decent grip, its reliable and a good weapon. More importantly, I have no problems carrying it. It is light and conceals easily.

+1 The German made Walthers are great guns. I have a PPK/s in .22 that is a joy to shoot and totally reliable. The same cannot be said of S&W's attempt at making the Walther. Check out the Walther Forum for more information:

I had a Walther made one, back around 1980, and it was very disappointing. By far, the best .380's I've ever owned, were the Browning BDA 380, and it's close cousin, the Beretta 84. All the rest were way behind those two, in looks and in function.

I started with a PPk stainless in the early 70's and had a trigger job done on it and the barrel throated. It was my off duty gun for some time. It was pretty good reliability wise but it was not comfortable to shoot. Most bite the web of the hand unless you have small hands and they have sharp edges on the gripframe as well. They have a floating firing pin so they can be carried with the safety off but there is no ambi safety for us lefties.

I owned a couple of InterArms .380's and they functioned quite well. I then purchased one of the new S&W Walthers and it was a *** from day 1. In my opinion,there are several other brands of .380 or for that matter small .9mm's that are a better design, more comfortable to shoot with better triggers etc. Look at the Bersa Thunder, MOd. 84 or 85 Beretta or a Kahr .380 to name a few.

I love the design of the Walther but they lack in so many areas compared to other brands that I can not recommend them after owning or shooting several other brands.

Tom

I own and carry an 1980's Interarms PPK/S in 380 and is is flawless in function and accuracy.

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Regards
Paul

Well, it would appear that most respondents are in the negative. I, on the other hand, have had much better experiences with them. I can't however comment on the current crop available from S&W.

It is an old design and from what I can tell, they have never tried to improve upon that double action trigger pull. Every one I've ever shot felt like the last one I shot. Heavy, stiff double action pull. But, depending on your requirement(s), this could be a good thing.

Back in the late 80's, early 90's, I carried one as a bug. I carried it in the shock plate pouch of my Second Chance vest. Our department required us to qualify with our bug, however we carried it. At first it was a challenge drawing and firing from the shock plate pouch, but after much practice I got pretty good at it. Thank god for zippered uniform shirts! Anyway, my point is, it served its purpose well and I never felt unsafe with it. It always went bang and even though the trigger pull was heavy, once you become used to it, you hardly notice it. If you're trying to squeeze off an accurate double action first shot, forget it. Where it really shines is in the SA dept. The best thing for them is a LOT of shooting (practice). It was always comforting just knowing it was there. The only time it ever drew blood, was from inside the shock plate pouch. One night, during a scuffle with an "uncooperative character", (like the way I cleaned that one up?), he decided he was going to punch me in the chest in an attempt to get away. Well, you guessed it, right in the old PPK. His glassy stare suddenly became quite focused on his skinned knuckles and his rapidly swelling wrist, grabbing same and dropping to his knees. Trust me, the result was far better than if I had shot him with it. My partner just gave me a dumbfounded look and said, "What the hell was that?" Ahh, the good ole days!

As for me, I'm a big PPK fan. But, I will admit, like most anything else, including S&W's, the older ones are the better ones. Modernization has not been good for either!

Sorry about the long post. I just love War Stories, especially when I'm telling them!!

si------------

After owning a bunch of different PPK's and PP's over the last 35 years, I'd say heavy for it's calibers, spotty reliability, and not much fun to shoot.... but still cool to own, especially my Dural framed .22 PPK.

I own a couple of PPk's, one is original German and the other is an Interarms stainless model, both in .380 caliber. Recoil is a mite heavy but controllable and both are extremely accurate and reliable. I carry the stainless .380 during the summertime when I can't wear a coat. There are good and bad PPk's; I guess I got good ones and love em.

Charlie

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SWCA # 2294

I bought a new PPK/S .380 stainless in Dec of 1990 and loved it from the beginning. It was an Interarms. It was stolen from my company car (which was also stolen) Memorial day weekend in 1991. To the best of my knowledge it was never recovered. I located a used replacement at a gun show in August of 1991 and bought it. I still have this one and I love it. Both of the ones I owned/own have functioned flawlessly and are accurate. As others have stated recoil is a little stout but easily manageable with some practice. Guess I was just lucky twice in a row. I know that the one I have now is a keeper. :-)

I own two PPK/S models, one made by Interarms in .380ACP and stainless and the other made by Walther in W. Germany in .22LR. The quality and workmanship of both is excellent, althought the German made one is finished a bit better then the Interarms one. I have had the Interarms model since 1990 and the Walther made model since 1995.

I have had zero problems with the Interarms one, works everytime and have never had a jam. The Walther built one is a bit finicky when it comes to ammo. It seems to like CCI MiniMags and the cheap Remington stuff you can buy in 525 round bulk packs. If I load ten rounds of anything else in the .22, it always stove pipes on the third shot. If I load seven rounds in it, it works fine. The Walther built one is one of the smoothest shooting 22s I have ever shot.

When S&W first started making the PPK line, I looked at one and thought the fit and finish were awful. I haven't seen one lately, so things might have changed.

I related earlier how my brother ended up returning his new one after it malfunctioned. I always wanted one too, but never got around to it. I did buy an E. German Makarov (which American Rifleman TV calls a copy), and think so highly of it, I bought a Russian Makarov in .380 also. They are the only autos I have that have not jammed and they are very accurate. Trigger pulls in both DA abnd SA are fine. I carry the E. German and the Russian is a car gun.

Chris

I bought a new PPK/s .380 in 1981 and carried it for a time in a Bianchi shoulder holster. It never had any failures as long as I owned it. I used WW Silvertips in it. It was just "okay" in the accuracy dept. It was a good, reliable firearm --- very well made.

I picked up an Interarms version and love it. No problems except with the extended 7rd magazine. It didn't like that particular mag so I don't use it.

Here is my Bersa .380, all the sexiness of the PPK and 100% reliable with any ammo you would like to feed it

First of all I love S+W's. As a new officer in the 1970's I was given a Model 15. I later bought a 39, a 59, a 29, a 645, a 4506 and a 4516. They are all good weapons. I then bought a S+W PPK. It is the worst gun I've ever had. I've put a 1,000 rounds + (of all types) thru it. I've never been able to fire more than 2 or 3 rounds without a jam or FTF. Back to the factory twice (it's there now). I would never recommend this gun to anyone especially as a back-up gun for law enforcement officers. Get a SIG .380 (unless you enjoy clearing jams or the uncertainty of whether the gun will work when you need it).

You've had mostly bad reviews. I have had this 1972 German manufactured, ULM proofed, Interarms imported PPK/S .380 for about 20 years. The closest tolerences to my Kimber and smoother, like greased lightning. Eats everything I feed it with nary a malfunction. Stout to shoot and heavy to carry, yes. Then again I'm used to carrying heavier and shoot more powerful. So it's all subjective. I've seen the S&W knockoffs and they were at best poor and worst terrible. Find a good one and you'll fall in love just don't blame me if you have to kiss a few pigs to find a sweetheart. Ignore the German made blade, she's such a showoff!

My PPK pistols are all Pre-War, which are beautifully made and reliable. However, why anyone would buy an 80-year-old design to carry for defense is a mystery to me. The reliability issues have been outlined, and the blow-back design is brutal to shoot. The gun is heavy for its power and has a small magazine capacity. Any of the modern locked-breech .380 pistols are far superior. For the size and weight of a PPK, you can have a 9x19 pistol that is reliable and more pleasant to shoot.

In the PPK size category, I carry a Kel-Tec P11, which is lighter and holds 10+1 of 9x19 ammunition. No comparison. For a pistol in .380, it should be much smaller than the PPK. Look at the Kel-Tec P3AT, Ruger LCP, Kahr P380 (my new favorite) and the Smith & Wesson Bodyguard .380, although it appears to be having significant teething problems.

For James Bond fans, buy a PPK to fondle in the gun room, but find something else to carry.

I purchased a new in box PPK/S .380ACP in stainless steel in 1998. Good accuracy, but it did not like most economy ammo. Premium ammo and the winchester (white box) and Fiocchi ran perfect in the pistol. I carried this pistol off duty for close to 10 years. No complaints.

Jeff

Aloha,

I have an Interarms PPK/S, it's barky and for sale locally.

The Wife and I have other 380s, I'm cleaning house and keeping only the Berettas. They "feel" better like a gun should and shoot reliably. As in no problems. The best of the bunch is the Model 86 with the
tip-up barrel. Very comfortable shooter and it's on target.

I had the same exact problem with mine. Second trip to Houlton, ME to get it fixed. If they can't fix it this time I'm gonna demand a refund.

I bought a S&W version a couple of years ago to replace a much older wartime Walther that I let get away from me after I had owned it for about 15 years. The recall struck before I had a chance to fire it, and when it came back from the factory it performed as expected -- no accidental discharges, no jams or FTFs. It's OK, I guess, but I agree with anyone who says the action sure feels stiff. The decocker turns only if you put some real arm into it. I improved it a little bit with some superfine sandpaper, but it still needs more work. In general, the sliding surfaces need to be better polished. But the gun is adequate as it is -- it deserves neither praise nor condemnation.

My new one is a .380; the older was was a .32 (or 7.65mm).

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David Wilson

I had one, in 7.65mm, in the late '70s. It had been submerged and for sale as-is. I had it disassembled, re-blued and a couple of parts replaced. I recall the stiff trigger and occasional stovepipes. Traded it on a 469 a few years later.

psst, don't tell that to the 1911 guys. lol

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M&P .40, M&P 9c & Shield 45

Love my SW's 1911, 41, & 63 but in .380 the CZ 83 fits all sizes of hands,
is just as accurate and reliable as the Model 84's and at 60% of the $. It is heavy enough to enjoy practice. (27 oz)

Its design has been tested for over 20 years (CZ82) in the Chech Army and will have a smoother and lighter trigger than any of them out there.

Just my 2 cents.

Just looked at CDNN sales page, and saw some SIG 232's in Excel Shape for $439 (half price) in SS. I don't like the blue 232 it too light for comfort shooting but in the stainless steel it is about 23 oz close to the CZ 83 27oz. Not much difference and the 232 also has a nice trigger.

Got a Buddy been Carrying for years, and his name is not Bond

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Old Shootist

The S+W Walther PPK/S is known to be very problematic.When I wanted one I made sure to get a West German model imported by Interarms made in 1977.No malfunctions or problems after many thousands of rounds.Save the cash and get a REAL WALTHER........Mike

Purchased a brand new, post-recall, Houlton-made "Smith & Walther" PPK in .32 acp last year. Shot over 2,000 rounds of Remington and Blazer range ammo through it without a single malfunction. Decocker/safety was rough at first, but smoothed out nicely. Double action first shot is indeed long and hard, but very safe. Trigger has also smoothed out considerably over time. Extended beavertail is a great modification. Absolutely no slide bite. The pistol is also very accurate for its size. At 50', I can consistently get palm-sized groups (and I have little hands). I often shoot PPC matches with it and even an occasional pin-and-plate match. Only time it really doesn't hold its own is with the large pepper poppers, which may or may not fall down when hit solidly at 30 to 40 feet. Oftentimes the pepper popper will take the hit, think it over for about 1 second, and then slowly keel over - which never fails to get a big round of applause from fellow shooters. I love my little .32 PPK S&W.

I had a .22 PP back in my youth so I've been familiar with the platform since forever. I've owned a PPK/s and a THP.

Cool? Ok, that I'll give you, but they're not at all pleasant to shoot. Atrocious triggers, heavy as a brick for their caliber, frustratingly poor function, mediocre accuracy, and they cut me more often than a Mexican flyweight!

I'm not a big .380 fan but I have a Starfire that shoots rings around the PPK (and that's pretty shocking!).

How good are they?

My cousin's for real Walther PPK is in my safe right now, he left it here about 10 years ago and hasn't once asked for it back, or bothered to take it home when I've mentioned it to him.

I'm pretty sure neither of us would neglect a well worn 1980s vintage model 10 heavy barrel like that.

Suddenly I have a fantasy of trading it to some unsuspecting Bond fan for a 3 inch 66. Now that would change my opinion of the PPK!

/c

I have two S&W PPK/S pistols. One has been flawless from day one...zero problems. The other I got from a buddy at work who liked mine so much he bought his own but had FTF problems the first day at the range. He got so mad he said "you give me $300 for this thing and you can have it." I figured it must be something he was doing cause my other one worked so good. But...the chamber was reamed so rough, looked like the reamer chattered and the feed ramp needed polishing bad. So about an hours worth of rubbing on it and it has worked flawless ever since. I will say that the ones I have are extremely very accurate. I dont find them "uncomfortable" to shoot or having harsh recoil as notted several times here in previous post. I do agree, there are smaller, lighter 380's out there as well as 9mm's that size/weight in about the same so it is definately not the ultimate carry gun but I know alot of guys that do carry them concealed.

Back in the mid '60's my wife gave me two West German PPK/s pistols. One .380 and one .22. At that time the .380 PPK was about the smallest "effective" pistol you could buy. (The only one comparable was the Mauser HSc.). Because the .380 ammo was expensive to plink with the .22 was a great training piece. I carried the .380 for a number of years in everything from jeans to tuxedos. When smaller pistols became available several years ago I sold both of the Walthers.

Both pistols were excellent workmanship, and I don't ever recall a malfunction with either. The biggest negative had to do with the blow-back action. Because of the unlocked breech a very strong recoil spring is necessary and consequently a great deal of strength is required to retract the slide. My wife never could reliably do it. The blow-back recoil is significant for such a small cartridge. I actually found it more uncomfortable than a .357 in a K frame revolver. Some folks complain of the slide cutting "railroad tracks" on their hand but I never had that problem.

I once shot an armadillo dead center with a .380 Super-Vel in the PPK/s and the beast ran about 50 yards before succumbing. That led me to push the .380 down to the bottom of my "must have" list. I still carry a Kel-Tec .380 but only as a tertiary carry piece (and it is MUCH smaller than the PPK/s).

Bob

Any reason not to buy a new Walther PPK?
Regards,
BM1

Back in the 1970's (when I was on my municipal police force) my partner bought a Walther PPKs for carrying off duty. He brought it out one day at the range and we had a lot of fun shooting it. It was obvious it was intended for close quarters defense, but for ten yards and closer it was adequate and did the job.

Several weeks later (I was single at the time) I bought myself a Mauser HSc, which was as close a competitor I could find for the PPKs, and we went to the range again just to see how they would compare.

Both were 9mm Kurz (.380 auto) and were more than up to the challenge of many, many rounds through them. Not one misfire, FTF, or anything. When we pulled the triggers they did indeed go "bang".

After extensively shooting BOTH weapons I was impressed by the designs and the comfort even thought these were SMALL pistols. I have to say I could not really pick one over the other. They BOTH shot well handled well and were accurate for close range shooting. They BOTH never did falter, and just kept on keeping on.

I cannot speak for any of the guns manufactured by other works outside Germany, but I was more than impressed all those many years ago................................. so much in fact, that I just bought myself a new WALTHER PK380 a few months ago, and again I am more than pleased with its performance, handling, and overall substance.

JMHO but I feel they are a gun that has out lived it's niche. If your going to carry a 380, there are certainly many others that are much smaller and compact. If your going to carry something of the PPKs weight, It should have ALLOT more UMPH than a 380.

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Dave

Guess I will be different. Back in the 90's I had an Interarms PPKS. It was terrible. Jammed and had an incredibly heavy trigger.

On the other hand my S&W-Walther PPK has been flawless out of the box with a much improved trigger and beavertail. I am not sure about the recoil comments as I regularly use it as a sample pistol "to try" for new shooters at training classes. No one has ever complained about the recoil.

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NRA Certified Instructor

I've had several PPK/s pistols made by Walther in Germany, Manhurin in France, Interarms and S&W. In my opinion, the German Walthers and the Interarms versions are the best. The Manhurin looked really nice on the outside but was a mess on the inside. The only S&W version I have owned, was the PPK/s-1; it had issues.

Just about all of them (don't know about the German ones) required a break in period. After they are broken in, if you do your job, the gun will do its job. It's pretty accurate.

You can't limp wrist the gun. Grasp it firmly and you should not have any FTF or FTE issues. With a gun this small, your hand and arm become part of the gun "system."

I have also owned two Bersa Thunder pistols. They have an alloy frame and lighter trigger. An excellent buy for the money.

I had one , a Walther USA marked. It was a great little gun but heavy for a .380 Mine shot high to the left. Traded as part of a deal for a Colt Officer's ACP

Ancient design, poor ergonomics, big reputation. I had one about 90 days traded off at a loss for a TZ also a mistake. A Sigma is a better pistol.

Geoff
Who is more careful with his money now days.

I'm confused...did this thread just drift to include the M1911, too??

Bob