UPDATING AN OLD THREAD: New to me Performance Center 3953

[Jim PHL]

Just acquired and very cool! I love the single-stack 9mm's and threw a bid at it late in a GB auction without really researching it first. I was on my way out of the house and just happened to spot it with an hour left in the auction and several bids on it already, so I put a max bid $number on it and left. I came back later to find I had "won" it. It was listed as a "S+W Custom Shop 3953". I was hoping "Custom Shop" meant "Performance Center" but I wasn't sure until I picked it up. (Yeah, I guess I took a blind roll of the dice on it but I think it paid off.)

Pretty standard looking aluminum frame with hogue grips but has a blue (black) 4" (3904/5904?) slide. In the auction pics it was obviously 2-tone but I didn't realize it had a longer barrel until I picked it up. It's in the original box with a standard manual, no "PC" literature, and no significant markings on the gun identifying it as a PC gun except the PC serial number. (PCZ0xxx)

So, my question for you experts who can help: is there a standard list of improvements done to a 3rd Gen PC auto? In other words; I don't think they'd call it a PC just because they slapped a 3904 slide on a 3953 frame. So what else was most likely done to this gun by the Performance Center before it left the factory?

Looks very cool, feels great in the hand and has a slight "CCO" vibe to it with the extra length in the slide. Pics and range report will be coming but any information anyone can offer in the meantime would be appreciated.

[missiondude]

I looked up the gun on GB, and it appears to be a non PC gun in the frame/slide department. All the PC guns I have seen have a single rectangular slide to frame notch. The gun on GB seems to have the production step interface. I do know the PC did work on "production" guns on occasion, and this may well be one they tuned, but not sure short of a letter how you could find out.

[Scotter260]

No knowledge of them but it sounds very interesting.

Can you share some photos?

[18DAI]

Interesting 3953, congrats!

The "performance center" two tone 3953's I'm aware of all had gold etched writing on the right side of the slide. IIRC it said "classic series".

You can see a photo of one on the SCSW 2nd edition cover.

I notice two things about your 3953. It has a darker almost black finish, and the PCZ serial prefix is one mostly used by S&W on prototype pistols.

You would need to letter that 3953 to be sure, but you might very well have a one of a kind prototype there. Regards 18DAI.

[mlk18]

I saw that gun too and nearly bid on it. I have never seen one before and have been a 3rd Gen aficionado for several years. The slide would be from a 5944 (not a 3904). Definitely an interesting and potentially very rare pick up for a really good price. You will have to give us a range report. Here is a pic from GB.

[Jim PHL]

Thanks for the input and I'd welcome anything additional anyone has to add.

The pics from GB don't really do it justice. It appears to have been fired very little and kept well cleaned. The frame does show a bit of the yellowing we've all seen on the aluminum frames. The left side and right look like two different pistols. (I'm not really bothered by that - it's evident to varying degrees on all my aluminum frames.)

I just picked it up today and have not shot it yet but I really like the feel and balance of it.

I also like the hogues! My other 39xx all came the factory delrin grips on them. When I briefly had a 6906 I received it with both hogues and delrins and the hogues never were mounted while I had it. (I no longer have it.) When I got my CS9 it got "Big Dogs" in no time at all. I never even fired it with the factory hogues. I'm liking the hogue rubber more than I thought I would and will fire it some with them in place before making any decision. Between winning the auction and actually receiving the pistol I had already decided to change to the delrins but I'll take a wait and see for now. They don't really feel overly large nor as "spongy" as I thought they would.

It'd be nice to get a better idea of the story on this one. Is "lettering" the only way to secure that information? Will S+W customer service be able or willing to tell me anything about it via phone or e-mail using the serial number?

Missiondude; I'm no expert but I'm thinking if this was just a production gun the PC did some work on, would they bother to change the serial number to a "PCxxxx"? (I may be jumping to conclusions, but that can't be a random serial number, right? I mean, only PC guns would have a PC serial number, wouldn't they?)

18DAI I hope you're not funnin' me regarding the use of the 'Z' only on prototype guns. It's cool to think I may have a one-of-a-kind gun.

Thanks again,
Jim

[Scotter260]

Wow, that is very cool but the purist in me says a new set of Delrins would be the cat's meow, just personal preference mind you.

18DAI - Very interesting information you've provided, I should have known some good stuff would come from you.

What is the product code and/or the special order # on the box?

You could try calling S&W customer service, if you get a rep in a chipper mood he/she may give you some good info. I believe I've gotten approximate dates of manufacture and rough production numbers as they can't give out definite numbers.

I know Grinder and Shorty4T and at least one other member whose handle I can't recall seem to know an awful lot about PC guns so let's hope they drop in and share. snw19_357 may also be another source for good info.

It's been a while since we've had a good 3rd Gen. DAO thread so I thank you for the thread.

[Chuck Jones]

I have a 3954 that was built at the factory with 2 slides, one compct and one full length, both with tritium front sights.

Here it is over a standard 3954

/c

[KurtC]

In other words; I don't think they'd call it a PC just because they slapped a 3904 slide on a 3953 frame.

In this case, yes. The original run was part of the Classic Series for one of the major distributors. It is just a 3953 frame with a 5944 upper on it. Keep in mind that this pistol was made during the first year or two that the Performance Center was in existence. The enhancement features we know today did come about until a couple of years later.

Since your pistol does not have the Classic Series lettering on the slide, there is a good chance that this pistol was put together from left over parts several years later. If you have the original box, the Spec Ord number on the label should indicate when the pistol actually left the factory.

[18DAI]

Fellas I did say the PCZ prefix is MOSTLY used for prototypes.

I know my one of one 45 CQB prototype has it as have other prototypes I've come in contact with. BUT - the PCZ prefix was also used on some production 945's and may very well have been used on this small run of 3953's.

The finish on this particular 3953 is different from the other I've observed. In any case, I'd letter it to see. No matter the outcome you have a VERY nice, and rare, 3953! Regards 18DAI.

[Jim PHL]

It actually wouldn't be a bad thing for me if it is as KurtC suggests. If it was a one-of-a-kind, I'd feel obligated to baby it - maybe even safe queen it or re-sell it to a collector who would also make it a safe queen. The way Lady Luck avoids my house, it would have been a miracle to get a great deal on some kind of rarity. I didn't buy it with the expectation that that's what I was getting, anyway. I will try to find out more info about it, but if Kurt's right it just deserves to be carried and have the snot shot out of it, which is what I intend to do!

[Jim PHL]

Additional info if it helps anyone:
Product Code: 170107
Spec. Ord. 8056

[9146gt]

Originally Posted by Jim PHL

Additional info if it helps anyone:
Product Code: 170107
Spec. Ord. 8056

All the #170xxx Product Codes I have seen are Performance center guns.

Tom

[KurtC]

It left the factory on the 56th day of 1998, which was the year S&W switched over to the TSW series. Since the slide does not have the original logo, it was most likely built to use up spare parts from standard production. It doesn't have the Performance Center logo on the frame, but even the original Classic Series didn't have it.

Nonetheless, it does have a PC production code, so it can be considered a PC pistol. It just doesn't have the usual features: box rails, Briley bushing, etc.

[Jim PHL]

Got my letter from Mr. Jinx. It does not give details on why they were made in this confiugration or who they were ordered for. He refers to it in the letter as a "Performance Center Special". Perhaps it was just a special order and not necessarily a batch of "real" Performance Center guns.

Anyway it was shipped April 27, 1998 to a Mr. Ray X(last name withheld) in Danville, IL and was part of a special order for 20 units.

[18DAI]

One of twenty! You really scored Jim PHL! Congrats! Regards 18DAI

[Jim PHL]

I did not want to publish anyone's name but it is apparently a company, not a person. This special order was shipped to Ray O'Herron, Danville, IL. They are a supplier of "Public Safety Equipment". From their website it looks like they no longer deal in firearms (or at least not to the GP). I wonder if anyone there would be able and/or willing to look back at some old records to see if they can provide any additional info on the order? I'm thinking of writing them and including a copy of the Jinx letter to see.

[photoman]

17 posts and no pic yet?!?!

[4506517]

You know, I would like to see what it looks like.

That's pretty cool that it's 1 of 20.

[10mmauto]

Being the owner of a 3953, this thread caught my eye. Interesting, but you know what they say. If there are no pictures, it doesn't exist.

[Jim PHL]

Bringing this thread back from the dead to finally post pics. I've traded e-mails with an employee of the distributor this was originlly shipped to in hopes of getting some additional info on it. Nothing back from him so far. Actually took pics for a guy I was talking a trade with but looks like this one's going back in the safe. I haven't handled it for a while. Forgot how cool it was!

[18DAI]

Beautiful pistol Jim PHL!! Congrats again! Regards 18DAI

[Doug M.]

Originally Posted by Jim PHL

I did not want to publish anyone's name but it is apparently a company, not a person. This special order was shipped to Ray O'Herron, Danville, IL. They are a supplier of "Public Safety Equipment". From their website it looks like they no longer deal in firearms (or at least not to the GP). I wonder if anyone there would be able and/or willing to look back at some old records to see if they can provide any additional info on the order? I'm thinking of writing them and including a copy of the Jinx letter to see.

*
They were the premier source for LE and I think fire/medic equipment in that part of the country for a long time. I bought some of my first guns there, and much of my initial gear. It is a family business (or was; I have not been there in 23 or so years). Ray was no spring chicken then, and his kids were probably 20 years older than me if not more. It is likely the 3rd generation running the place by now, with the 4th coming on strong.
I don't know what kind of records they would have that would be of value/appeal to a collector, but they did get some unusual guns in. They had a few of the (real) M520s when NYSP declined them (bought one, sold it for law school tuition, what a shame) and I bought my M58 NIB there with a really out of date - like 15 years past manufacture date - serial #.