Does anyone have one of the S&W Performace Center 1911's and do you like it "how does it shoot?How accurate is it?Would you recommend me to buy one? main question : are they worth the nearly $2400 msrp.I know I can buy one for less than msrp .

No. I bought one NIB, and it had so many finish issues I sent it back. To their credit, S&W replaced it with another one. That one had a loose trigger and a mushy thumb safety and a couple other smaller issues that belied its price and PC quality. Sent that one back, too, for service, and they ended up putting a DK thumb safety and trigger in to make it work...which it did, though I preferred the original stock parts. By then it was fine and worked very well, but my overall experience was such a fiasco (on a gun that should never have had the problems these did) that I got a bit annoyed every time I looked at it and ended up selling it at a few hunred dollars loss. I replaced it with a Baer, and that one's been great from the outset.

I'm certain there are other PC1911 owners who have had a completely different experience than me, but mine was such that I could never recommend one. I think there are much better guns at that price point (even at street retail)...and I love PC guns, and, in fact, have four now. But I certainly don't miss that PC1911.

I have 3 PC revolvers and LOVE every one of them. Consequently, I was VERY tempted when my local Gander Mountain had a used SW PC1911 come in. Both the store clerk and I examined it closely and couldn't believe the lack of fit and finish on a PC gun. The thing rattled almost as much as an older Colt. Makes me think those PC gunsmiths at SW tend to specialize in revolvers?

As posted above, I've got a Les Baer that has been perfect out of the box. And for that kind of money, I would recommend either the Baer or a Springfield Custom. Good luck!

Interestingly, though, I have three PC945 models and a PC952-1, and those four are absolutely gorgeous, with phenomonal fit and finish. I don't know what it is about the PC1911 that seems to skew the quality-control in the PC Dept..

I would put the PC 1911s up against any of the big 3 makers.

They just flat out shoot.

Bob

+2


Tom

There's no doubt that PC1911s shoot well, and are likely more accurate than many of us, including me, are capable of. If that's the only thing that is of interest to the OP, I'm sure he'd be pleased with one.

However, at that price point, the buyer should expect more than just accuracy. My Dan Wesson Pointman 1911 is also very accurate (as was my standard SW1911 before I sold it), but they're also cheaper. As the PC's price-point, they should be also be judged on other less pragmatic but equally important qualities (i.e. all those under the umbrella of "fit and finish"). In that regard, you may get a good PC1911 or you may not...and one shouldn't have to gamble with $2000'ish, especially when there are other brands out there in the same price ballpark where the odds are much more in one's favor.

My understanding is that the Performance Center is no longer the stand alone - seperate building - "custom shop" it once was.

I have it on good authority that it is now simply an assembly line in the main building simply adding some features to standard production guns and putting the PC seal on them....as well as an exhorbitant price tag.

I've gotten to handle one PC 1911 at the LGS. It was nothing special and the trigger moved around in its slot in the frame. That was last year, and its still there. If I was going to spend $2k + on a 1911 it would say Wilson Combat or Les Baer on the slide. My 0.02 Regards 18DAI

If true, that's very unfortunate. But it does go a long to explaining why there is such a quality difference between my PC semi-autos from five, ten year ago, and that PC1911 that I bought new a couple years ago.

I really hate to resurrect an old thread but I hate to leave mis-information out there for the others who may be searching for factual information.

The Performance Center at S&W that handles the 1911's IS separate.

As a matter of fact...only 4 guys work in there and build all of the PC1911's at this time...(2 of them are brothers).

I just pointed this out on another thread earlier tonight but I'll mention it here again....on 5/15/13...on the Outdoor Channel's show "Shooting USA"...they aired an hour long show with about 1/2 of the show being dedicated to introducing S&W's 2 new PC1911's and getting feedback about them from professional shooters.

They also gave the show a walk thru tour of the Performance Center and showed some of the individual custom work being done on these new 1911's by the 4 guys who build them.

They showed the one guy who was hand lapping the slide to frame fit....they showed the hand filing and sanding that was done to achieve the barrel to-bushing fitment...and quite a few other custom processes that were being done to them at the time of the interview.

I just wanted to let anyone know who's looking into one of these.....just so they don't get incorrect info.


When one of the other posters up above said

"I have it on good authority that it is now simply an assembly line in the main building simply adding some features to standard production guns and putting the PC seal on them....as well as an exhorbitant price tag"

I figured that I'd at least say something because that info is INCORRECT.

I'd say that "authority" where that info came from wasn't very good nor was it accurate.

Maybe it was an honest mistake though and either the "authority" or the poster could've possibly gotten the PC1911's mixed up with the PRO1911's ??

The PRO line of S&W 1911's are made to be a bit more economical...and they're "upgraded" and improved regular standard model 1911's (from what I understand anyways) with upgraded parts and options added to them for quite a bit cheaper than what a PC1911 would cost you.

I could see where it might be feasible for S&W to possibly build these "Pro" model 1911's right out on the regular production lines and just "adding parts" to them...can and probably does happen.

That would make sense to me.

Whatever S&W 1911 you choose..have fun with it...I've had several and they've all been great guns so far !

Did they mention on the show what they were doing to improve the quality?

S&W's Performance shop is achieving the production of their PC guns with a grand total of 4 guys in the 1911 Performance Center.

During the interview and walk thru on that show (American Shooter)....it was stressed several times that there were only 4 guys in the Performance center building these 1911's.

I know that there used to be more....maybe that's allowing them to put out better quality now?

The show was pretty informative...they showed how each of the gun's frames and slides are chucked up and precisely measured with CNC equipment..then both the slide and frame's final machine work are done off of each other's measurements to assure a good fit.

Then..1 guy...out of the 4 at the shop...hand laps each slide to it's frame until it's fit is just right.

Another quality related step that they take is that each slide is numbered to it's frame along with it's barrel and even the barrel's bushing so that there's no chance of them being intermingled/mixed.

So each one is pretty much a one of a kind...when it comes to those key parts...anyways.


Here are some of the other processes done to the PC1911's:

Precision Crowned Barrel
Hand Cut the Chamber
Hand Polish the feed Ramp
Smooth and Tune the action
Match Grade Trigger set at 3.5-4 lbs
2-stage polish on the sear
Front strap/frame checkering
Lightening Cuts to the front of the slide to reduce weight and help with recoil (I'm not sure how that helps with recoil but I'd like to know more..to me those cuts look pretty awesome and serve well as front cocking serrations too)

Then it showed how the barrels are chucked up in a lathe, filed, tapered and sanded by hand to give the exact fit that they want for the briley type bushing (not sure if my spelling is correct on that bushing).


To me it looks like the quality coming out of there is pretty good right now and arguably one of the best among all of the large manufacturer's that also have "custom/performance-type specialty shop guns" offered alongside their standard production pieces.

Are they as good as a total custom 1911 entirely built by one guy....well I'm sure that would be quite hard to do at that price point...so I'd say they are NOT.

But hey...you're getting an accurate and reliable gun that is hand fitted and built with a lot of "custom shop" type upgrades for about 1/2 the price of the others since S&W's MSRP price is $1539.

Do they occasionally miss something....I'm sure it happens.

That's the same from nearly every manufacturer..I'm sure.

Brand new here and saw this thread. I have a PC 1911 "bobtail" coming to my ffl guy tomorrow and can't wait. Very fortunate to have found one in just a week or so. I've heard nothing but great things about the two new models and chose the "bobtail" because of it's "commander" size, weight and c/c aspect (and it being a little different than what I have). I also have a Colt Gold Cup series '70 Mark IV National Match, Sig TACOPS 'tradional", SA TRP Operator 1/2 rail and a FULL rail (bad boy there ). So I'm anxious to compare them and from what I've seen in pics, videos, etc., it's a beautiful gun and right up there with the custom boys at a steal. I can't wait!

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Down inside's a true marksman!

I purchased a PC1911, not one complaint, price was $1322.00 (NIB) Purchased from Kentucy Gun Co. It out shoots and performs better than my Colts,Kimbers and STI's.

Really good to hear.

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Down inside's a true marksman!

I have two S&W 1911's neither of which is PC but they have both been 100% out of the box. I wouldn't hesitate to buy any of Smith's 1911's...they are as good or better than other 1911's in the price range.

Crimson Trace makes a nice grip for the bobtail as well.

Attached Images

	1911's 001.jpg (77.9 KB, 64 views)
	CT grips 002.jpg (71.0 KB, 56 views)

Very glad to report that I received my PC "bobtail" today and it is everything everyone said it would be. Extremely light and extremely good looking. Very happy and will take a few pics when I get settled and a little time. Anyway, I got it . . .

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Down inside's a true marksman!

I am not sure all PC1911s are fitted to the same standards. My understanding is that it varies with the intended purpose for the model. I have one of the original PC1911 models (5-inch gun, black Wilson adjustable sights, mag funnel, Roco stocks, etc.). The ONLY things I do not like about it are (1) it's stainless and (2) the firing pin safety. Neither one of those things has ever caused a problem. (I bought the stainless gun because it was available from stock and I got a good price on it.)

The gun has run like a champ. It's accurate with any load I have used in it, and it even has a very good trigger, in spite of the FP safety. It's a great gun, as far as I am concerned.

Having said all that, I'd still prefer to not have the FP safety, but since the gun is just great the way it is, I don't worry about it. It's not really meant to be a self-defense model, though I wouldn't have any problem with using it for that if need be. I can't see that there is much difference between the PC1911 and a Les Baer Premier II, except I would expect to get better CS from S&W. Both are good guns. Prices do vary considerably on the S&W. Not so much so on the Baer.

I picked up the 170334 version but have only been able to run about 3 or 4 mags through it. This was more of a function check vs anything else but from what I have seen so far it easily out shoots me. Fit and finish are superb and there are no rattles in it at all.

No.

If you have the money, buy a Colt model 70 and add the accessories

S&W 1911's aren't $2,400 pistols.

Very good. Looks like mine . . .

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Down inside's a true marksman!

I've got a PC1911 bobtail as well, and so far I am completely satisfied by this pistol. It is extremely tight, and very well finished. As far as how it shoots, like a dream. They are not cheap pistols, but not the most expensive either. Mine cost me about $1600 out the door.

Ahh yes, seems we both have good taste
From what I have read and seen online it is said these are comparable to a $2500 weapon thats selling well below that price point. I paid $1449 before tax with a little haggling and feel its worth every cent. The slide feels as if it is gliding on glass, the trigger is crisp but may be a tad light for use as a carry weapon ymmv. Hopefully this weekend I can run a few hundred rounds through her.

Can't wait to shoot mine also Rick. We both are fortunate to have these. I was prepared to pay full retail, as I too had read, etc. that they were equal to much higher end custom name brands out there. But glad to say that like you, I didn't pay anywhere near retail.

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Down inside's a true marksman!

Well I was able to get a couple hundred rounds through her this morning and she is a keeper. As suspected it shoots better than I Here are the last hundred rounds at 25' standing with AE 230 gn ball, not too bad for my old eyes. I may have a slight tendency to push a bit low and left. Thats what I get for slacking on my practice over the last couple months. I did have 4 FTF but that was more than likely my thumb dragging the slide.