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Old 04-18-2015, 10:19 AM
XAVMECH XAVMECH is offline
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Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457?  
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Default Do you have this situation with your 457?

Friday morning: Range day - Great to be out at the club when it's nice and quiet. Today's objective: Test fire two newly acquired 3rd GEN's. One is a very nice 4513TSW, the other a 457S. Same ammo, two targets side by side, no distractions. After a bit, the 457's target is looking a lot better. This happened last time I did this with an old LE 457, and some rather expensive 1911 compacts.
What is with these guns, anyway? They're amazing little pistols!
When I compare them to other similar models, like the 4513, I must be overlooking something that is this gun's secret to success. I'm at the point with this quest for understanding that I think I should have more than one example of this model. I'm certainly ashamed that I let my previous example get away.
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Old 04-18-2015, 01:15 PM
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Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457?  
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Those are the pistols that convinced me to relegate my 1911s to range toy status. They are DA and SA, super accurate, not fussy about ammo... what else is there?
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Old 04-18-2015, 04:22 PM
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Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457?  
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The best part of course is when your $400.00 "Value Line" gun out shoots someone's $2500.00 custom 1911.

I've shot a friends very custom 1911 and it's a beauty. It's just not enough better than my 457 that I'd buy it.

I know everyone loves the 1911 platform, but frankly, the allure has always alluded me.
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Old 04-18-2015, 04:50 PM
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Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457?  
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I have the same experience within my 457. In fact, if it was just a little thinner through the slide, I'd probably sell all my other carry guns. Including the 4513's.

Makes a lot of my shooting buddies a little green when it shoots smaller groups than their VERY expensive blasters from custom makers. Regards 18DAI
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Old 04-18-2015, 05:24 PM
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Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457?  
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I was able to pick up a NOS 457 a few years back and absolutely love it. At first I was shooting low with it, but after adjusting my grip to the slightly larger frame, that little problem went away and she's been very accurate for me.

I've shot the 457 next to a pre-rail 4513 before, and it was just as accurate. I would not say more accurate than, but I also have Big Dots on the 457 vs. factory sights on the 4513. Triggers were also just about equally smooth, with a slight edge to the 4513 pre-rail.
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Old 04-18-2015, 05:43 PM
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I took one of the rounded base plates from a prerail 4513TSW and put it on my 7-round carry mag. That, combined with the Hogue grip sleeve, make my 457 sit just right in my hand .Probably contributes to the excellent accuracy as well. Regards 18DAI
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Old 04-18-2015, 05:51 PM
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Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457?  
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I took one of the rounded base plates from a prerail 4513TSW and put it on my 7-round carry mag. That, combined with the Hogue grip sleeve, make my 457 sit just right in my hand .Probably contributes to the excellent accuracy as well. Regards 18DAI
Ah, this is an interesting idea! I purchased some compact base plated 4013 mags hoping I could switch them onto my 457 mags, but it was a no-go. I'll have to locate a 4513 pre rail base plate and give this a shot, could make my 457 an option for T shirt weather.
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Old 04-18-2015, 09:03 PM
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Glad you enjoyed your outing, but perhaps a more balanced or equal "inherent accuracy test" might be to compare the 457S to the current 4513TSW, meaning one with the same full height grip frame profile and "feel".

Potentially, the TSW's tighter tolerances and increased dimensions of the frame/slide rails (box-type rails) would theoretically lend themselves to offering improved "accuracy", compared to the old-style narrower, stepped rails of the standard 3rd gen model. The S&W people with whom I've discussed this sort of thing over the years certainly believed that to be the case. The TSW's have some design enhancements that can give them an edge in potential accuracy.

It's also possible the slightly delayed unlocking of the TSW might have some measurable effect upon how the shooter perceives felt recoil/cycling, too. Not sure how most people might be able discern that, though. Probably more likely to feel differences produced among different ammo lines & loadings.

Since I don't use my little finger to tightly grasp and anchor my normal grip, I never really noticed a difference when shooting my own original 4513TSW, compared to my issued current production 4513TSW. They both handled and felt about the same, although my little finger could drop a bit lower and still feel a front strap or buttplate. The older TSW didn't have as "crowded" of a grip feel.

I've no doubt that folks with wider hands and thicker fingers might feel, interpret and react to these sort of differences between the cutaway & standard frames, too. Subtle differences that may be hard to quantify can still have a noticeable effect on different shooters, or even the same shooter on different days, or using different ammo.

It is what it is.

Now, I've always thought the standard 457 was just as capable of producing excellent "practical" accuracy as its tighter and enhanced TSW cousin, but in reality that probably means that both designs are inherently capable of better accuracy than most shooters are probably capable of wringing out of them.

I'd not be surprised if the heavier rails of the TSW's didn't create the potential for a bit of a longer service life, either. Or, at least able to better keep its tighter tolerances, longer. Presuming, of course, the owner/user actually kept it clean and the rails sufficiently lubed.
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Old 04-18-2015, 09:10 PM
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I have a dozen of the rounded baseplates and converted a few 7 round mags. Much as I like the Hogue rubber 4516 grips, I find the factory grip with a Hogue grip sleeve and the rounded mag baseplate to feel better, for me.

I have used this combination on my 4516ND, 457, Shorty 45 MKII, 4513TSW's and 4516-3. Funny, I'm so use to the Hogue rubber grip on the 4516-3 that I switched that one back. Just didn't feel right after all these years. Not that I carry it much anymore. But I still shoot it regularly. Regards 18DAI
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Old 04-18-2015, 09:28 PM
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Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457? Do you have this situation with your 457?  
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Another idea is putting a strip of this 3-M "Safety Walk" tread tape on the front of the grip. I've put it on my 457 (pictured is a 908S) and find it to be a very helpful surface without adding bulk or width to the pistol. The tape comes right on off without residue.

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Old 04-18-2015, 11:36 PM
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Just to answer the OP's question: yes, I do (did) have the same problem with my 457 being uncannily accurate to be the supposed Value Line gun that it was.

I'm no great shot, but I could see a difference when I shot the 457 compared to just about any other S&W pistol in any caliber, and I've owned a couple dozen in the past four years or so. Almost all came and went, including (to my regret) my little 457 and a sister 457S that I kept for a short time, and really liked too. (Both went to good homes, and I know the 457S is being enjoyed by its new owner.)

A lone Shorty 45 is my remaining PC Third Gen, and I hope one day to be a better shot with it than anything I've owned previously. It does its job as long as I do mine, which was the same case with the 457. I think the latter was a bit more forgiving, though -- probably due to the fact that it was humble and understanding, and helped account for my lapses.

Shorty demands my best, and doesn't like it when he feels he's gotten short shrift.....
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