My apologies to handejector and all others
for posting during an open auction, although
not named. Anyway, nice pistol with box and
1 original mag, for over $1000! I did bid but
soon realized I am not in that "league". I am
amazed. I was embarrassed I paid just under
$600 for the same in a 3906. I saw an old post
here that stated S&W said it would cost @ $1200
today if they produced a 645, but still.....

Yes, I think I also need to read the rules again as they must have changed it as I thought it was no live links. I wish they would remove the one put up 2 or 3 days ago on a gun I was looking at bidding on.
...anyway...
I replied on the original post and wrote something like this:
I have a 645 and they are a well made accurate and reliable pistol. I would rather a good steel gun over the polymer guns of today. The way I look at it, the choices are, used real (steel) gun or top end S&W/PC steel gun. The latter costing a lot more than this 645.

Sometimes I don't know what to think of some of the prices that I see online. All it takes is two bidders with $$ that want a certain gun and the price can get out of reasonable range. I have quite a number of Smith autos but only one 2nd gen in a 539 because it's all steel (can't afford the all steel 39). I only have the Smith autos in 9 and 40...nothing in 45 as I have left that duty to the 1911's...although they are Smiths as well so technically they qualify as Smith autos but you know what I mean...not to mention M&P's but, alas, wrong section!

I should admit that I have driven the price up on an auction or two myself from time to time and even won now and then!

The Model 645 seems to have a lot of unique cachet. It was S&W's first production .45 ACP pistol, a gun many of us waited for a long time to get. It is a big brute of a pistol, feeling bigger and heavier than a 1911 even though it really isn't. It has lots of sharp corners and edges on it, enough for Jeff Cooper to refer to the 645's "immense scratchiness" when he wrote about it. The gun has a monotonous reliability to it's function that was rare for the era. They only made them for two or three years, I think, and nice ones that are still in their original configurations and boxes are less often seen with each passing year.

I bought mine, S/N TAK2138, on January 2, 1986, from the very first batch shipped from the factory. I had never had so many people want to see, handle and shoot one of my new guns like that, before or since. Friend Dennis Tueller and I took it and just about every .45 ACP loading we could find down to DOUG'S SHOOTING SPORTS range and put almost 1,200 rounds through it in an afternoon. Flawless. I put another 1,000 rounds through it with only ONE stoppage, a handload with the primer seated upside down, and it became my house gun. My department was revolver-only then, so I never carried it for real, but there were plenty of worse choices available had it been an option. The only 645's I ever saw experience stoppages on our range when we went to semiautos in 1991, were guns that had been messed with by some self-educated "pistolsmith."

The M-645 was a benchmark gun for S&W. I paid $442.03 new, in 1986 dollars, so they were never cheap. I can see boxed, clean survivors with all their papers and the steel mag floorplates getting to be a bit spendy.

I can see that, far into the future, when liberals and progressives have finally eliminated ammunition from the earth, those of us with our Model 645's will still have very successful cudgels, that will rinse right off after cudgeling!

Having just re-read the .45 ACP thread( Experiences with S&W stainless steel .45's ) from a few years ago I can see how someone can get pretty hopped up on the 645, 745, and 4506, I was.

I am just tickled with my 4506-1 that I paid $550 for. What a beast. I had thought about looking for a 645 but, I may have to look hard considering the price.


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Vietnam Veteran, 68-69

And then there is that beautiful PC 845 up on our forum. Darn that is one very nice piece, $2400.


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Vietnam Veteran, 68-69

No box, priced as a NIB specimen, not surprisingly it's still available.

Heh, for a pistol of which somewhere between 585 and 650 examples were ever produced, a pistol which multiple folks who own multiple PC pistols claim may very well be THE best single model ever produced, the pistol which many who own both claim is BETTER than the 952 (of which far, far, far more were made) and have sold within the last year on Gunbroker for as much as $2,800, which again, compared to the 952, is undervalued.

The 845 is one of the Grandfathers of the absolute finest semi-auto pistols certainly EVER produced by Smith & Wesson and can hang with the finest semi-autos ever produced in Man's history on this planet.

And to think . . . just today I pondered a desire to finally shoot my new, once-shot (factory, still have the case, too) 645. Decided it'd have a go this week, then I read the above.

So much for that idea. I'll just have to stay with my 9mms.

Later.

Looking at that $1,000 price I guess I did good. Picked this up in February, no box or papers but only 50 previous rounds through it the weekend before. I was happy to pay $500 from a local party.

Yes it has a huge commanding presence. I thought it was bigger than my fullsize 1911's till I held it up to them.

That makes two this year that I have seen sell for over $1000.

I bought mine, S/N TAK214X in April of 1986 for $445 so the price was already on the rise.

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Birds like shiny new toys too.

New development on Gunbroker this evening brings up an interesting side-discussion.

A first run 845 that did have the original PC case and papers just sold for over $3,000. And while the pistol is completely gorgeous, it is not dead mint, new or unused and in fact is not wearing it's original issued grip.

A sale on Gunbroker is -NOT- the establishment of any set price, it is merely an occurrence or data point. However, that one just sold for $650 more (before shipping!) than the fantastic one offered here on our forums from a long time registered user.

One might argue that the fancy aluminum case and papers is $650 worth of extras. (I kid, I would never say that, merely a joke)

Gunbroker is sometimes it's own animal.

I too have noticed that 645s are launching upwards in value. Not just from GB, but on many other sites. Yes, 645s NIB are far and few these days, I was fortunate to grab one unfired last year for $600. I've also noticed the full metal mags are selling for big bucks these days ($50+ a piece). 4506s NIB seem to also be rare these days.

My PD's Armorer's took the class at S&W school... was his class gun. It had all the upgrades. I jumped on it when he offered to sell. Easiest gun I ever qualified with.

__________________
NRA LIFE
Reserve Officer 9yrs

"Funny" thing is this, back in '97 I
sold $9000 worth of my guns to help
buy a Mustang Cobra. One of those guns
was a 645. Now I'm selling that car, and
going to get another 645, if I can get one
at an OK price.
Guess what has appreciated in value and
what has not?

I dunno. When the so called performance center is selling plastic guns for big bucks, a $1k 645 doesn't sound too crazy.

As far as Gunbroker goes, I think I'll list my PC 14-6 there. And hopefully profit from the insanity that sometimes occurs there. Regards 18DAI

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7 +1 Rounds of hope & change

In these discussions it often occurs to me that some folks don't entirely understand or want to see the larger picture of what Gunbroker is and what happens. The easy answer is "Gunbroker is crazy! People are crazy!" Oh, believe me, I say it out loud OFTEN, haha, maybe to placate myself when I lose out on something I was interested in.

Gunbroker literally has a global audience. Obviously, it's mostly just American bidders and heck, probably only from about 46 states that are viable players, but it's like a virtual gun show with a million people in attendance. More or less depending on how long the auction runs.

And it helps to keep in mind that while many (most?) of the people bidding on Gunbroker are similar to us, enough of them are NOT similar to us. And here is what I mean by "similar to us"--

If you are reading this, you probably spend a lot time, care, energy and passion in this hobby/lifestyle. That includes doting on your guns, accessorizing, fixing, altering, etc. And when you are shopping for guns, you often go in to it in the same way. You learn a lot about them and you may spend a lot of time or energy in the chase.

Well, there are folks out there that don't do any of that stuff. There are folks who make a HEAP of money in their work or perhaps in their investing and paying a hundred more (or $700 more) for something they decide they want is just seriously not a big deal. Especially if they can click, click, click and then get a phone call and swing by the FFL and have it.

We play in a game where average guns are $300-$500 and nice guns are $1500 and grail guns are $2000-$4000 or whatever. What kind of money is a thousand dollar S&W 645 to a guy who has a couple of Mercedes' or a Bentley in the 8-car heated garage that's attached to his $3 million dollar home?

Now that isn't the guy who is battling you for a scarred up 39-2 that's missing it's magazine or a 915 that would make a fine truck gun. But if you are talking about a new old stock, as new in original box short-production gun from 1987 that a buyer might not even EVER shoot... or maybe a six-inch long slide Performance Center 952-2 that are as scarce as hen's teeth, you can't be shocked that some guy was willing to pay WELL beyond what you think is sensible.

It doesn't make the market, it does not set a "value." It's just something that was offered that one or two different guys decided they were willing to pay that much to get.

The seller has something to do with this also, you have to keep that in mind. If you have a high feedback seller with easy and helpful selling terms -AND- seems like a really safe bet that it's not some dumb Fudd living in a camper selling a gun that he's electro-penciled his name in to, the gun is extremely high condition or new old stock -AND- it is a hard to find gun -AND- it's all original with original box and goodies -AND- the auction has multiple clear and bright pictures from many angles -AND- the auction runs for 12 days...

Yeah.
It could very well go VERY high.

But it seems like most posts in discussion forums that refer to a Gunbroker gun is little more than "jeez... since when is a 645 worth a thousand bucks?!"

I hate to sound like I am preaching... perhaps I am. But Gunbroker often gets a poor shake in these pages and sometimes it sounds like a bitter former lover that never had a chance at a gun they wanted.

Look at that 845 that Haris just ran. This is a seller that deals in fantastic stuff and anyone who watches Gunbroker is familiar with him. He also posts in these forums and from everything that I have seen, he is an asset to folks like us who chase these great S&W pistols. His 845 just went for $3,052. It's safe to say that none of the "regulars" among us in these pages was willing to spend three grand to get an 845, but I can say this and I will stand by it:

An 845 is one of the finest pistols S&W ever made and one of the finest in history. And if you are buying sight-unseen and you want hope that the seller isn't hiding anything and you will be happy with the (very rare!) pistol, Haris is one of those guys you WANT to be buying from.

That it went for over three grand was a surprise to me, but it sure isn't a shock. And maybe we could agree that it's "worth" $2,500 or so... but the guy who bought it is probably not too concerned about $500, or maybe that $500 was totally worth the idea that his seller is a stand-up operation and he's going to be happy with what he's getting.

Sincere apologies for the length. This is just how I see it with nearly a decade of Gunbroker playing. Please feel quite free to disagree in many ways!

The buyer has almost 4000 posts on this forum.

Guess I should have left my 645 in the box and never fired it.

Nah! What fun would that be?

__________________
"Shall not be infringed"

One for sale on my local site, no box, looks new, hogue wood and original grips - $550.

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__________________
Just hanging with my dogs

Well said Stevens, well said!


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Vietnam Veteran, 68-69

For more information on the 645, here's a draft of an article I wrote that later appeared in Dillon's Blue Press.

John

The story of the S&W Model 645

__________________
- Cogito, ergo armatus sum -

A 645 was my first issued duty weapon. When we switched to the 4006 in 2000, we were able to buy the old 645's (and some later 4506's) for $230. Some were never issued, never fired, and still in the box. I wish I had bought a truckload of them.

I've been VERY lucky in 2015 for deals on Smith's.

I got this one from a friend that was just interested in getting rid of it. Came with 5 factory mags. Very nice shooter, especially for 280 bucks!

http://smith-wessonforum.com/attachm...6&d=1407627639

I bought one of the first ones that came out. They were a big deal at the time. Nobody thought S&W would ever make a 45 semi-auto (although they had been making match grade 45 1911 barrels for the Army Marksmanship Unit since the 1960s!).
I was lucky to get mine for wholesale!
They were pretty accurate, not custom bullseye match accurate, but way better than anything else out of the box including the Gold Cup. They were also very, very reliable with an amazing range of handloads. While I generally used 185-200 gr. SWCs, and 3.5-4 gr. of Bullseye, it was another load that got my attention. That was with 255 gr. Lyman "Keith style" SWCs! They fed great, were pretty accurate (1.5-2" @ 25 yds), and hit silhouettes with real authority.
I was generally a blue steel revolver shooter, and the 645 was my first centerfire semi-auto and first stainless gun. For some reason, I sold it, maybe to buy a T/C Contender?

Odd how they seemed to be a real sleeper on the market for so long. Now, seems like they're experiencing a renaissance!
Glad to see them appreciated! $1000 for a nice one in today's market seems pretty good.

Ha!.... another fun thing about the 645 (at least mine!), it would feed empty cases out of the magazine if you cycled it by hand!

If you got one, shoot it, and enjoy!!

Jim

I attached a cover photo from July/August 1984 issue of American Handgunner. It shows an engraved prototype of the 645, serial # EXP0001. The article is just a teaser, with a pic of an early production sample, serial #AB70109.

Funny thing, the same issue has an article on the 44 Special, with an announcement for S&Ws impending release of the "Target .44 Hand Ejector Fourth Model of 1950".
Seems the then new owners of Smith and Wesson were not wasting any time with their plans to introduce new guns that people actually wanted!

Jim

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Well, I was finally starting to feel pretty good about my latest acquisition when I saw the title of this thread.

Then I saw your 2 posts.

Now I'm back to crying again!

As I told the good wife, I have never seen such a crazy wide range of prices paid for any other pistol ever.

Don't feel bad about your acquisition, I've helped my friend out enough that he was cool with selling me the pistol for the price he did. I should also mention that he's not hurting for $$$ in the slightest sense either.

Maybe I should take mine out of the carry rotation and replace it with the 4506 range gun if they are getting so desirable.

Too late. I know I overpaid and it's eating my brain out. It's not a matter of whether or not I overpaid. It's just a matter of how much I overpaid.

But it's so damn pretty!

Well, I turned down a last generation Model 4506 so that I could buy the Model 645... so there may be something to your thought.

For those craving a 645 for a lot less than $1000+, I just posted mine for sale in the Classifieds.