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Old 02-14-2017, 05:50 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Default "414" project(422/2214)

I picked up a trashed out 6" 422 recently. It was undoubtedly the dirtiest gun I have ever seen, looked like it spent a few years under a car seat, lint, dirt, rust, and the muzzle was beat up and the sight was broken. Rather than pull it a part and throw the parts in a box I decided to build a "414". I really like shooting my 2214 and 2213 but the 8 round mag cuts the fun short. I run 12 rounders in them, but don't like the short grip with the long mag, and haven't made the time to produce a mag sleeve yet. So I looked at this trashed out 422, and one of the extra 2213/2214 barrels I have laying around and came up with the crazy idea of a "414". Time will tell if it works as I expect, I will dovetail a front sight onto it like the 2213 and 2214.



I like the overall look of it already!

Last edited by shoot summ; 11-23-2017 at 04:03 PM.
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Old 02-15-2017, 05:31 PM
Barrie Barrie is offline
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More pics as you progress Please with this project. Hope it turns out great for you.
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Old 02-16-2017, 12:15 AM
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Hell, why not Summ. You have everything else. The only thing left is for you to build your own variants. Good Luck.
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Old 02-16-2017, 07:13 AM
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Hell, why not Summ. You have everything else. The only thing left is for you to build your own variants. Good Luck.
Ha, I'm still missing a 4.5"VR!!!

They are just too expensive IMO, so it's likely I will never have one, for a guy that is slightly OCD it is a bit of a struggle...
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Old 02-16-2017, 01:33 PM
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Default Keep Us Posted Please

Shoot Sum, looks like an interesting project, hope you can make it work and please make a photo progress report you can share. This design continues to be of interest to several of us and the variation you are proposing seems feasible.
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Old 02-16-2017, 02:46 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Shoot Sum, looks like an interesting project, hope you can make it work and please make a photo progress report you can share. This design continues to be of interest to several of us and the variation you are proposing seems feasible.
Thanks, I will post pics.

I hit my first unexpected challenge last night.

The muzzle is bored to .395" until about 1/4" from the end of the bore, then it drops to .350". The barrel OD is .344".

So when I cut the muzzle I no longer have that "shoulder" which centers the barrel and obviously contributes to accuracy.

So now I have to find a way to reduce the bore in the remaining muzzle to .350", I have several ideas, just need to think about it some more to make sure I am headed down the best path.
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Old 04-30-2017, 08:43 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Finally made some progress. I designed a holding jig for some of the machining operations I need to do, and some for other pistols.



Counter boring the muzzle for the barrel nut:



Test with 2214 barrel installed using EWK threaded adapter:


Last edited by shoot summ; 11-23-2017 at 04:05 PM.
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Old 05-01-2017, 02:07 PM
skjos skjos is offline
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Did you end up using a bushing to reduce the bore to .350"?
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Old 05-01-2017, 03:05 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Did you end up using a bushing to reduce the bore to .350"?
That's the plan so far, need to counter bore for the bushing, then make it.

I've toyed with the idea of tapering the leading edge of the EWK adapter to cause it to "self center" in the bore. I like the idea of the bushing better though.
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Old 05-07-2017, 09:27 PM
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Cut the dovetail for the 2214 front sight today.


Last edited by shoot summ; 11-23-2017 at 04:06 PM.
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Old 05-08-2017, 01:29 PM
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I'm at a point where I would like some opinions.

I've looked at many different ways to mill the muzzle to make it look less like I just chopped a longer gun down. While I have no intention of trying to pass this off as a factory oddity, I do want it to appear to be factory as much as possible. The front sight is off of a 2214, the slide and rear sight will also be off of a 2214. What I've come around to is that I want the muzzle to look like a 2213/14 also. This means I will have to fill the small machined areas to get a perfectly flat surface there. I've attached a 2213 muzzle picture for reference, what are your thoughts?


Last edited by shoot summ; 11-23-2017 at 04:06 PM.
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Old 05-08-2017, 03:03 PM
skjos skjos is offline
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This thread comes to mind:

Finally scored a 1066, but....look what somebody did!
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Old 05-10-2017, 05:07 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Decision made, took it to the Welder to day for the fill work.

If I do another one of these I will have it welded first, would have been better to do it then. Hopefully I wont have any burn through into the counter bored area.
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Old 05-12-2017, 10:36 AM
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Fill work done, learning experience on this build, next time I will have the fill work done before the muzzle is cut and counter bored as there was some blow through I will have to clean up.




Last edited by shoot summ; 11-23-2017 at 04:07 PM.
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Old 05-12-2017, 02:36 PM
skjos skjos is offline
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Too bad on the burn through.
I'm looking forward to see how it looks after it has been re-milled.
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Old 05-12-2017, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
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Too bad on the burn through.
I'm looking forward to see how it looks after it has been re-milled.
Still have some work on the counter bore, I think the muzzle looks great.


Last edited by shoot summ; 11-23-2017 at 04:08 PM.
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Old 05-19-2017, 12:30 PM
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Made some progress on the muzzle bushing. Two parts to fitting this, the OD has to match the counter-bore size(15/32") and the ID has to match the barrel OD(.3435") or the original muzzle ID(.349"). Full disclosure, I am teaching myself machining as I go along on this project, I'm open to any machining feedback from those with more experience. So I ordered a .3480" reamer for the ID of the bushing. Somehow I ended up a little loose at .350" so I'm going to step down to a smaller reamer as I'd like this to be tighter than the factory fit.

Here is the first try on some brass rod for the bushing:



One of the issues with an "all in one" machine like I currently have is the effort to change over from lathe to mill. So I didn't have to remove the lathe tool post and install the mill vise I just used the counter bore on a piece of aluminum rod.



The fit of the bushing OD to the rod ID is also a little loose relative to what I expect. This is my issue as I got impatient, and of course took just a hair too much off. All good though to check my process, and get familiar with the tooling. Next round will be more focused, and more patient. In the interim I turned a taper on the EWK adapter to center the barrel in the muzzle bore. I'm going to finish building the gun as a mock up, shoot it, and see how it is from an accuracy perspective.

here is the bushing to counter bore fit:


Last edited by shoot summ; 11-24-2017 at 08:07 AM.
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Old 05-19-2017, 11:11 PM
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If you don't get good chip removal in aluminum you can get a slight over bore. I'm not a machinist, but the mechanics in our shop encounter issues like this if the tooling doesn't provide adequate chip clearance.

Another thing we use for bushing installation is liquid nitrogen, probably not necessary in your application, but cooling the bushing in your freezer may help with the installation.

The progress so far is great, the welded area looks seamless in the pictures; I was anticipating some discoloring, but it looks perfect.
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Old 05-20-2017, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skjos View Post
If you don't get good chip removal in aluminum you can get a slight over bore. I'm not a machinist, but the mechanics in our shop encounter issues like this if the tooling doesn't provide adequate chip clearance.

Another thing we use for bushing installation is liquid nitrogen, probably not necessary in your application, but cooling the bushing in your freezer may help with the installation.

The progress so far is great, the welded area looks seamless in the pictures; I was anticipating some discoloring, but it looks perfect.
Thanks!

Under good lighting you can actually see a very slight difference in the color of the weld. I had planned to have this pistol coated anyway, I'm trying to decide black, or silver, well full disclosure, I'll probably build 2 so I guess I will have one of each.

I have used the hot/cold method in the past when installing bearings into aluminum engine cases. I thought I would likely do the same with the bushing install, I need to determine the correct interference fit for brass to aluminum. Good call on chip removal, in both instances, the counter bore, and reaming the bushing I probably overfed the tool and created that condition. I need to slow down a bit with machining, I'm typically more of a woodworking guy dealing in measurements you can actually see...

Last edited by shoot summ; 05-20-2017 at 07:38 AM.
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Old 05-22-2017, 09:40 AM
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I enjoy watching your project make progress! You have great skill and patience. And it's good to see a work-in-progress thread as opposed to a "my gun shoots low left" thread!
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Old 05-26-2017, 06:26 PM
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I enjoy watching your project make progress! You have great skill and patience. And it's good to see a work-in-progress thread as opposed to a "my gun shoots low left" thread!
Thanks Bob!! I'm enjoying this, it's a learning process.

I didn't make much progress this week, had to spend the week in Orlando with my fellow Tech Geeks at a conference. I did order some smaller reamers, and just snuck out to the shop for a few to do some testing. I am much happier with the fit I am getting now. I also changed my drilling method, I drilled several holes getting gradually larger instead of just using the bit closest to the reamer size.

Hopefully this weekend I will get some time to bore the muzzle for the bushing, and fit the OD of the bushing to the muzzle and install it.

Pics will follow if I do.
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Old 07-05-2017, 01:02 PM
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Not much progress on this lately, got the bushing done, trying to get several pistols ready to Cerakote.

Photobucket's new policy killed all of the photos, I have them all still, will work on a new way to get them active again.
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Old 07-07-2017, 10:03 PM
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Quote:
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Not much progress on this lately, got the bushing done, trying to get several pistols ready to Cerakote.

Photobucket's new policy killed all of the photos, I have them all still, will work on a new way to get them active again.
I have found that you can still view the photos if you right click on the photo and select "open in a new tab". click on the new tab to view the photo. glad you are still working on the project.

Well crud ... they fixed that end run around loophole.
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Old 11-23-2017, 12:13 AM
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Quote:
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Not much progress on this lately, got the bushing done, trying to get several pistols ready to Cerakote.

Photobucket's new policy killed all of the photos, I have them all still, will work on a new way to get them active again.
Have you made any progress on this project shoot summ?

Switched my photo's to Imgur, it's actually as easy if not easier than PB.
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Old 11-23-2017, 09:44 AM
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Have you made any progress on this project shoot summ?

Switched my photo's to Imgur, it's actually as easy if not easier than PB.
Working on getting them ready to Cerakote, not much that is interesting, just detailing areas like the rounded trigger guard, shortened beaver tail, etc.

I think I signed up for Imgur, just need to spend some time and get everything back in order.

Thanks for checking in!

Last edited by shoot summ; 11-23-2017 at 09:45 AM.
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Old 11-23-2017, 12:33 PM
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Default shoot sum

The Photobucket problem has prevented any of your photos from being viewed so far, at least on this computer. Sorry it hasn't worked out but good luck with your projects.
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Old 11-23-2017, 03:50 PM
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The Photobucket problem has prevented any of your photos from being viewed so far, at least on this computer. Sorry it hasn't worked out but good luck with your projects.
They were view-able until PB changed their terms. With the new terms I could pay $300 yearly for the ability to link them. That was way more than I was willing to cough up. In addition it really ticked me off, so I removed all of my content from their site, and deleted my account. Their change affected me across many sites/interests with pictures from well over a decade.

ETA: OK, I did it, updated this thread with most of the pics now hosted on imgur, thanks for the push to get me to do this. I'll get some new pics up this weekend.

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Old 11-23-2017, 05:07 PM
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Default shoot sum

I appreciate your effort and the photos I could view, looks really good so far!
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Old 11-23-2017, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
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They were view-able until PB changed their terms. With the new terms I could pay $300 yearly for the ability to link them. That was way more than I was willing to cough up. In addition it really ticked me off, so I removed all of my content from their site, and deleted my account. Their change affected me across many sites/interests with pictures from well over a decade.

ETA: OK, I did it, updated this thread with most of the pics now hosted on imgur, thanks for the push to get me to do this. I'll get some new pics up this weekend.
I'm thinking something still isn't right. I'm still seeing the Photobucket Image Not Available place-holder instead of your pictures....
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Old 11-23-2017, 10:25 PM
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I'm thinking something still isn't right. I'm still seeing the Photobucket Image Not Available place-holder instead of your pictures....
Only post #17 should still have the PB message, all of the others are there now.

If it isn't showing any of them for you it's an issue on your end, you are getting a cached version of the site. You might try closing your browser, you can refresh the page while holding the shift key, clear your temp files, or if all else fails restart your machine.
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Old 11-23-2017, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
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Only post #17 should still have the PB message, all of the others are there now.

If it isn't showing any of them for you it's an issue on your end, you are getting a cached version of the site. You might try closing your browser, you can refresh the page while holding the shift key, clear your temp files, or if all else fails restart your machine.
Yup, the only post with the PB place holders is #17.
I guess I misread the OP's statements about "most of the pictures working" to mean ALL of the pictures should be working...
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Old 11-24-2017, 08:07 AM
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Yup, the only post with the PB place holders is #17.
I guess I misread the OP's statements about "most of the pictures working" to mean ALL of the pictures should be working...
All are fixed now.
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Old 11-24-2017, 12:52 PM
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Just found this thread for the first time today shoot summ. If you do another project, let me know if you need help with anything. I am a tool & die maker of 40+ years. If you are in this area, I can help more than just answer questions.
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Old 11-24-2017, 03:17 PM
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Just found this thread for the first time today shoot summ. If you do another project, let me know if you need help with anything. I am a tool & die maker of 40+ years. If you are in this area, I can help more than just answer questions.
WOW! Thank you! That is what I really enjoy about forums, the willingness of members to share their knowledge.

I make it to KC occasionally, and will likely be there alot in 2018/2019 as my oldest son is doing a fellowship in KC for a year.

My biggest issue machining is going from woodworking where 1/16" is good enough, to machining and measurements you can't see. That plus patience...
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Old 04-15-2018, 06:14 PM
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A little update on the 414, youngest son was over yesterday and we were talking about the custom 422's I'm building for he and his brother. We were toying with a dark slide on a light frame with wood grips, kind of liked the way it looked so I decided to mock up the 414 with the same scheme.




Last edited by shoot summ; 04-15-2018 at 06:15 PM.
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