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Old 03-16-2017, 11:17 AM
happydude happydude is offline
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Default S&W not doing repairs

Long story short sent a 3rd gen smith in for repair has safety issues. Three months later they are shipping the gun back not repaired with the parts to supposedly fix it? Talk about some liability issues...
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Old 03-16-2017, 11:29 AM
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This makes no sense at all for S&W not to repair it unless they figured you were responsible and even then it still makes no sense as you noted about liability issues.
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Old 03-16-2017, 11:34 AM
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Sounds odd....had the gun been modified in some way?
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Old 03-16-2017, 11:35 AM
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Do you have third party parts in the gun?
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:15 PM
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I remember recall a discussion here that S&W was running out of 3rd generation parts, and support will end. Like 5-screw revolvers.
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:18 PM
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Tell me about it . No parts not S&W in it .Safety disconnect snapped off buggering some stuff up. Let me say I have NEVER encountered this from Smith before . Wonder if things are changing since merger?
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:21 PM
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Also it is the 4516-1 is still kinda from what smith says current production as they still make a 4516-3?
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:30 PM
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Yeah, the end of support for 3rd Gens was mentioned here a couple of years ago. At the time, there was a thread that went into some detail about alternative 3rd party sources, to keep your 3rd going. Perhaps the usefulness of these old links is still valid, and you'll still be a "happydude" in the end.

Good luck.

3rd Gen parts - I'm afraid we're on our own Gents
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Old 03-16-2017, 02:12 PM
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I just found out Ruger doesn't provide written warranty. It's more like "Bro, jus' give us a call. Maybe we can hook you up."
I certainly hope S&W doesn't follow suit!
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Old 03-16-2017, 05:29 PM
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Yep, Smith & Wesson of today isn't the company I grew up with and that ISN'T a good thing for consumers. I can understand not wanting to inventory expensive major components such as barrels, slides, frames and cylinders but common service parts such as side plate screws, hammer nose kits and bushings, oversize hands and cylinder stops, proprietary springs? For instance, literally millions of k-frame revolvers which share common parts remain in service but Smith & Wesson no longer supports them. Ditto for 1st, 2nd and 3rd generation all metal autoloaders.



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Old 03-16-2017, 06:25 PM
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Yup $90 for mag disconnect . I have hear so many storis from so many reps it is sickening...Pretty much what I am catching send us your gun we then will hold it hostage..So pay or wait three months and get a broken gun back. What ticks me off is they called last week to confirm shipping address to supposedly ship it back. Well I confirmed my ship address not my mail so they sent a bill that got returned because I have a p.o. box. Might point beighn is yeah it is fixed sending to you now and then a bill not a gun shows up?
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Old 03-16-2017, 06:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 686-380 View Post
I just found out Ruger doesn't provide written warranty. It's more like "Bro, jus' give us a call. Maybe we can hook you up."
I certainly hope S&W doesn't follow suit!
Okay, I am not comparing Ruger guns to S&W guns (new or old) and for the record, I am a S&W addict through and through. HOWEVER... if S&W were to "adopt" Ruger's customer care style and reputation... from day one through tomorrow, this would be the best thing that ever happened to S&W customer service, Bro.
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Old 03-16-2017, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Sevens View Post
Okay, I am not comparing Ruger guns to S&W guns (new or old) and for the record, I am a S&W addict through and through. HOWEVER... if S&W were to "adopt" Ruger's customer care style and reputation... from day one through tomorrow, this would be the best thing that ever happened to S&W customer service, Bro.
Hopefully, my new 22/45 Lite Mark IV won't need any customer service!
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Old 03-16-2017, 08:37 PM
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Yep. This is the new Smith. It's pretty clear they don't want to support the older stuff anymore. They'd much rather you trade in that old 3913 for a new M&P. I'm almost afraid to send them any of my guns (say a 952) for fear they will keep it and replace it with a plastic M&P or mimmed out new 686.
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Old 03-16-2017, 08:50 PM
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I honestly do not know of any good place to send a 952 that might need service but it would be my opinion that one of the absolute WORST POSSIBLE PLACES that you could send a 952 would be back to S&W in the year 2017.
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Old 03-16-2017, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by happydude View Post
. . . Wonder if things are changing since merger?
What merger?
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Old 03-16-2017, 09:09 PM
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I would hope that is not the case as they currently have our M&P AR15-22 in for repairs.
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Old 03-16-2017, 09:34 PM
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It almost makes me wonder if everyone at SW that knows anything about 1st.,2nd.,or 3rd gens. has retired....
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Old 03-16-2017, 09:46 PM
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Now is the time to rid yourself of these once and for all. No question period.


Actually between my dad and I and the 3rd Gens we own, I can't remember needing to send one to S&W for repair. However, I have been able to replace a broken lever or trigger play spring when needed. I guess the good news is they don't break much, and many repairs are fairly simple with a little knowledge, which I think is worth learning to keep these things running.
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Old 03-16-2017, 10:13 PM
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^Agreed and to add a fine extra point to the above...

S&W made massive shiploads of these pistols and MANY of the parts are shared across models which mean many many parts are out there. Less barrels, slides and frames for sure, but the fact is that those are also out there sometimes too.

One other thing that we have seen countless examples of...

S&W customer service seems to give wildly different answers depending on the day you call them. We can come to SOME conclusions every time someone offers an example of a recent interaction, but it doesn't mean it is the law going forward.

S&W has always been a mixed bag when it comes to getting help.
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Old 03-16-2017, 10:28 PM
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Personally, I'd like to hear more details of what was wrong, what S&W said, did they offer a good deal on a new pistol (which they have in the past), and other details before I panic and sell off all of my 3rd Gens.

OTOH, there is likely to be a cottage industry for industrious gunsmiths keeping these guns running.

BTW, the OP has six posts. Everyone of which has a complaint about S&W.
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Old 03-16-2017, 10:29 PM
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This is why I haven't bought any more 3rd gen smiths, and why I won't even try their M&P series.

It's hard to believe there are still companies that don't recognize the internet. It's not like the old days.
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Old 03-16-2017, 10:37 PM
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I have owned maybe 50 S&Ws since 1972 and never had to send any back.

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Old 03-16-2017, 10:46 PM
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If the "happydude", or previous owner removed the magazine disconnect, they may have decided to write this one off. (decline working on it)

Would be interesting to take a look at the repair sheet when the gun comes back.
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Old 03-16-2017, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by happydude View Post
Yup $90 for mag disconnect . I have hear so many storis from so many reps it is sickening...Pretty much what I am catching send us your gun we then will hold it hostage..So pay or wait three months and get a broken gun back. What ticks me off is they called last week to confirm shipping address to supposedly ship it back. Well I confirmed my ship address not my mail so they sent a bill that got returned because I have a p.o. box. Might point beighn is yeah it is fixed sending to you now and then a bill not a gun shows up?
Obviously there is a communication problem here.

If you send in a gun that needs repair and it is not covered under warranty, they send you a quote and you have to authorize repair.

Your comment about your PO Box and the "bill" being returned suggests they did that and thought you would not authorize the repair since their quote (or "bill") was returned to them, and then they contacted you to verify your address so they could return your gun.

If your communication with them was anything like your post above, how can you blame them for the confusion?
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Old 03-16-2017, 11:01 PM
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The only one I ever had to send back was an early 442-1 in Satin Silver. It had a frame crack under where the barrel screws into the frame. Not an uncommon problem with the alloy J frames.

S&W replaced it with a brand new 642 (no lock) at no cost. All I had to pay for was the transfer, and I suspect that the shop double dipped on that one.

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I have owned maybe 50 since 1972 and never had to send any back.
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Old 03-16-2017, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sevens;p139512914
I honestly do not know of any good place to send a 952 that might need service but it would be my opinion that one of the absolute WORST POSSIBLE PLACES that you could send a 952 would be back to S&W in the year 2017.
I've stopped shooting mine for that reason. I own a bunch 952s and put a lot of rounds through a couple of them. Shoot a gun enough and it will eventually need something done. There was a time when the pc would treat you beyond good when you returned one their guns for a tuneup. These days....

They are committed to their new plastic stuff and seem to want to distance themselves from the older guns. Maybe that's a good business move as I think they are making more money than ever but it sucks for their longtime customers.

The whole things seems cheapened these days, from the quality of the revolvers to the quality of support.

I realize I sound like a grumpy old man but I say these things as a longtime customer and fan boy.
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Old 03-16-2017, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryS View Post
Personally, I'd like to hear more details of what was wrong, what S&W said, did they offer a good deal on a new pistol (which they have in the past), and other details before I panic and sell off all of my 3rd Gens.

OTOH, there is likely to be a cottage industry for industrious gunsmiths keeping these guns running.

BTW, the OP has six posts. Everyone of which has a complaint about S&W.
eh Gary.. I may want some of those 3rd gens... my pm is down... email me at my sig..
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Old 03-17-2017, 01:34 AM
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No snapped off.
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Old 03-17-2017, 01:39 AM
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I have said that in the past never has a problem with smith doing repairs etc in past one was a barrel bushing in 5906 and the other was a 4006 2 times to get that one straight.....Both those were no problem! Minimum to fair or no charge
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Old 03-17-2017, 01:48 AM
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I bought it for my wife for x-mas . She called them and told them what was broke they said no problem send it in. She did at first of year and has got the runaround ever since. So I called them last week and ask them what the hold up was .They say get back to you tomorrow. Following day they call and say hey gun is done confirm your physical address. Come Tuesday no gun so wife calls again . She gets e-mail bill.
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Old 03-17-2017, 05:35 AM
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I called them about a problem with my 39-2 last week. I wasn't surprised when they said they don't work on them anymore. It's what? A 40-45 year old gun? (I'm older than that, and I expect my doctor any day to say they don't work on models as old as I am anymore.)
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Old 03-17-2017, 07:17 AM
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But why not pursue good communication???????????? At least an email or text. No-it can be so difficult to get a straight, consistent answer from them that we are left to "speculate" here on the forum. I remember having some work done sometime back before these issues got as bad as they are now. I just decided to do everything by email so I could continue a dialogue with the same individual at S&W. We went back and forth several times with questions and clarifications I needed. It went well in that case, but it was several years ago. As stated-Ruger has always been tops in my book. I remember sending a Mark II back that was probably 25 yrs old at the time back to them with ejector problems (beau coup rounds out'a this great gun) and they basically just went through the whole gun, no charge. Another time I sent and old Super Black hawk back that had some really ugly grips on it, and when I got it back, it had a new pair, nothing I had asked for. Now, the place where they draw the line is when the gun has obviously been abused-and I can't fault them for That!
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Old 03-17-2017, 08:30 AM
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"QUOTE=happydude;I bought it for my wife for x-mas."

My friend, I think you meant to say Christmas. Hope you find a way to get your gun fixed. Like you I think guns make a great Christmas gift, especially when someone gives me one.
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Old 03-17-2017, 09:26 AM
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My comment was more tongue in cheek than serious. I only have a 3913 for sale. It's listed on another forum that's more MA centric.

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eh Gary.. I may want some of those 3rd gens... my pm is down... email me at my sig..
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Old 03-17-2017, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by happydude View Post
Long story short sent a 3rd gen smith in for repair has safety issues. Three months later they are shipping the gun back not repaired with the parts to supposedly fix it? Talk about some liability issues...
I talked to CS at Smith and was told on the 3rd Gen Smiths if I was the 1st owner repairs would be covered under there warranty, other than that they would check the gun see what parts are needed and contact me with a repair cost , I must assume at that point I would need to place the charges on my credit card prior to any work is started on my gun , Sounds to me like there is a lot more going on here than whats in your post
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Old 03-17-2017, 11:23 AM
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It's just the trend in business these days . When my Harley got past 15yrs old my local ( at that time ) Harley shop told me take it elsewhere to be worked on . Later when I decided to sell it , they weren't interested in buying it , said they had no one w/experience to work on it . It was a 1990- Softail Custom , in immaculate shape .
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Old 03-17-2017, 12:21 PM
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I'd be interested in hearing the other side of this, maybe seeing some redacted paperwork.
Barring that, on with the Salem witch trials, ironic since S&W is in Mass. 😀
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Old 03-17-2017, 01:48 PM
malph malph is offline
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Originally Posted by cowboy4evr View Post
It's just the trend in business these days . When my Harley got past 15yrs old my local ( at that time ) Harley shop told me take it elsewhere to be worked on . Later when I decided to sell it , they weren't interested in buying it , said they had no one w/experience to work on it . It was a 1990- Softail Custom , in immaculate shape .
I think you hit the nail on the head. It's the times we live in. Somebody figured out its costs to support the older stuff and made a calculation it's not worth it.

While the official policy at Smith may be lifetime to the original owner, the out for Smith is they won't have the parts or expertise to do the work.

I apologize I'm just venting a little. I'm a long time Smith customer and maybe I'm more disappointed in them than anything else.

I am not specifically referring to the original posters case as it's hard to tell what actually happened there.
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  #40  
Old 03-17-2017, 06:20 PM
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HOWEVER... if S&W were to "adopt" Ruger's customer care style and reputation... from day one through tomorrow, this would be the best thing that ever happened to S&W customer service, Bro.
There was a time when Smith & Wesson operated under an entirely different philosophy and it wasn't so long ago either. My first Smith was a Model 57 No-Dash. After a few hundred rounds, it developed gas cutting on the top strap. At the time, their service department removed the barrel, laid steel into the top strap by welding, refinished the frame, re-installed the barrel and returned the revolver-as a warranty repair. Smith & Wesson has always sold most repair parts on the consumer level. This is something they seem to be moving away from-mostly for product liability reasons I assume. It's my understanding that Ruger has never sold repair parts "over the counter". So now S&W should mirror Ruger as an upgrade to their former service policies? NOT HARDLY IMO!

Bruce

P.S. Newer S&W products offer a lifetime warranty to original owners. It's also my understanding that Ruger has no written warranty policy other than what is mandated by Federal and State laws. So essentially many "warranty" repairs could be at Ruger's discretion-which could either be good or bad.

Last edited by BruceM; 03-18-2017 at 01:23 AM.
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  #41  
Old 03-17-2017, 07:56 PM
1775usmarine 1775usmarine is offline
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I traded a pretty beat up 5946 for a Gen 2 Glock 19. I noticed the plastic frame rails were cracked or broken off completely in most spots. I emailed Glock and he asked for pics. After the pics he said better send it back.


They got it on March 1st for a cost to me of $19.15. On the 10th I got a call telling me the frame was no good and if I would like they would replace the frame under warranty but I would have a new serial number in addition to 2 different numbers on the slide and original barrel. Or I could pay $180 plus tax for my choice of any 9mm, or 40 glock minus the longslides. I chose the swap and I got it back from them last Thursday. I got a 2012 frame, 2004 slide, and an original 1989 barrel. I also got the old trigger group for who knows why?


I was never the original owner, but was amazed by the customer service I got. I'm sure S&W sees this forum and knows the demand for 3rd gen smiths. I just wish they would all be on the same page when we call looking for parts or whatnot. I have gotten multiple answers to my question in the course of 1hr and several different reps.
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  #42  
Old 03-17-2017, 08:08 PM
Sevens Sevens is online now
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There is no way that S&W sees this forum. And the small rabid bunch of us make up not even a crumb of the buying market. Regularly visit any all-encompassing gun forum and you will find that 3rd Gen chatter (let alone 1-2 Gens) is a rarity. Heck, even on this site we have more activity in the open forum for yelling jokes and talking about cars or complaining about movies than we have discussion on 3rd Gens.
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  #43  
Old 03-18-2017, 01:12 AM
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gunny4053 gunny4053 is offline
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Originally Posted by shawn mccarver View Post
What merger?
I think they're talking about the re-branding from S&W holding to Outdoor Sports.
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  #44  
Old 03-18-2017, 05:14 AM
firescout firescout is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceM View Post
...It's my understanding that Ruger has never sold repair parts "over the counter"...
...It's also my understanding that Ruger has no written warranty policy other than what is mandated by Federal and State laws. So essentially many "warranty" repairs could be at Ruger's discretion-which could either be good or bad.
Ruger does offer most parts for sale at the consumer level. It is just a few major parts (barrel, cylinder, bolt, etc) that you need to send the gun in for. Yes, Ruger has no 'official' written warranty. But most Ruger owners report excellent service when sending their guns in for repair.
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  #45  
Old 03-18-2017, 07:36 AM
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It is frustrating to hear that s&w is taking this route with things and it will hurt them as a company. There is a reason that glock is the firearms empire that they are. You could send them a 1987 first gen pistol for service and they would take care of it.
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  #46  
Old 03-18-2017, 05:22 PM
familyman357 familyman357 is offline
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I'm not sure why S&W's inability or unwillingness to work on 3rd Gen and older handguns is such a surprise. S&W told us years ago that they were no longer going to stock parts and service would be spotty.
I'm not a hater. I *just* bought a like-new 3953, because I like 3953s, but I did it understanding that I'm pretty much on my own for parts or service. That's also why I haven't gotten rid of my Glock pistols.
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  #47  
Old 03-18-2017, 05:48 PM
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duncan duncan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malph View Post
Yep. This is the new Smith. It's pretty clear they don't want to support the older stuff anymore. They'd much rather you trade in that old 3913 for a new M&P. I'm almost afraid to send them any of my guns (say a 952) for fear they will keep it and replace it with a plastic M&P or mimmed out new 686.
Well, at least Smith & Wesson is still refinishing the 3rd gen's. Sent them a scratched up 4506. Guy had tried to polish the flats. Otherwise, shoots like a dream.

Sent it to them and 2.5 months later, and got back a factory new looking 4506!

Guess gun refinishing is different than gunsmithing? But you have to disassemble the gun to refinish it. So why not "swap" out parts from customers????
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  #48  
Old 03-19-2017, 01:11 PM
TercGen TercGen is offline
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Seems like a good argument for learning how to do basic work yourself on these 3rd Gens. Parts are still being made and readily available, just ordered some from S&W a few months ago and Midway is pretty stocked up.
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  #49  
Old 03-19-2017, 06:30 PM
wendal wendal is offline
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I sold my 5906 because of this.
I do regret selling it. I want to replace it.
It kinda makes me not want to buy anything else but I can see their point.
But they are not like they used to be. Maybe most of them are like this.
Not a glock fanboy but their CS was pretty good when I called them.
Anyway I am hoping I don't need anything other than a spring when I decide to get another 5906
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  #50  
Old 03-19-2017, 11:19 PM
HOUSTON RICK HOUSTON RICK is offline
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I will "limp" forward with my second and third generation S&W semi-automatics. I expect my children to still be using them when I am gone.
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