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Old 06-16-2017, 07:01 AM
Gros21 Gros21 is offline
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Default Model 41 jamming up

Well I have 2 model 41's one new 7" and one older 5" (not original series but came in a early blue hard case) . The 5 had a weeksr spring g when I got it so I installed a new one.

The 5" has all sorts of failures stove pipes and jams. The 7" does this as well but not as bad I think I'm either over or under lubing it. I pretty much just lube the rails with either rem oil or hopes oil.

Any ideas or a best way to lube\maintain these
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Old 06-16-2017, 07:12 AM
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Lube isn't critical on these guns.Your issue is most likely related to your choice of ammo.( I suspect that your five inch is actually a 5.5)

Last edited by Camster; 06-16-2017 at 07:37 AM.
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Old 06-16-2017, 07:22 AM
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Along with the right ammo, the 41 requires a firm handshake to operate properly.
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Old 06-16-2017, 07:31 AM
Gros21 Gros21 is offline
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My 7" had minimal issues. I only use cci sv in this gun.

What the other spring u get from wolf for. Is there any parts I should check to see if it's wet or dry?

It's serial 756xx what year would that make it.
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Old 06-16-2017, 09:54 AM
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They are very ammo sensitive, The slide is very heavy.

If you do not want to try all kinds of ammo, get the recoil spring KIT from Wolff Springs. to "tune" it.

https://www.gunsprings.com/SMITH%20&...1/mID58/dID261


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Old 06-16-2017, 04:44 PM
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I put a new standard spring in from them and I would of thought cci sv would of been happy with a new stock spring.

I also find it weird that my 7" is doing it now.

I have some cci mini mags here should I try them.

How stupid laws just make it hard as I can legally only use it at the range
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Old 06-16-2017, 09:56 PM
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These pistols generally call for CCI SV ammo only. You do not need high powered HV ammo in this gun at all. Give it a good cleaning and re-lube the rails and the safety slide area only. Watch whats happens with straight CCI-SV after that.
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Old 06-16-2017, 10:07 PM
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Safety slide? Also just a oil such as remember oil. Can you use to much?
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Old 06-17-2017, 09:11 PM
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Yes which will cause it to draw more dirt and dust into it which can create some jams. You only use a small amount on the slides and safety area. Myself I suspect ammo problem unless you are useing CCI-SV.
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Old 06-18-2017, 07:31 AM
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I find that a combo of a 7 pound Wolff Spring (standard Factory is 7.5 lbs) and CCI standard velocity ammo works just about 100%. I'd stay away from the Remington & Winchester ESPECIALLY in the M41.
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Old 06-18-2017, 10:15 AM
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Use of mini mags or other HV ammo is an attempt to overpower the problem and will accelerate wear. I would advise against it.
Any place where you see the blueing worn is a wear area and needs a thin coating of oil. Do you have a manual?
Wolfe springs should not be necessary to make the gun work properly.

Last edited by andyo5; 06-18-2017 at 10:26 AM.
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Old 06-18-2017, 10:43 AM
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The gun should function fine with CCI standard and a factory spring,as has been stated.To give it a little test,if the gun functions fine with high velocity, I'd say that the current spring in it, is too strong for CCI standard velocity.
Also check for a firing pin peen on the breech face.That could cause the hulls to drag out and stovepipe.
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Old 07-05-2017, 04:11 AM
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Hi All

My 41 BRAND NEW - Made 2016 June MAS US. Import to AUS 2017 - Just put 600 rnds through past 2 weeks. Following results
CCI SV 40gn x 400 = 10 eject/feed fails. Started at round 4.
SK yellow 40gn x 100 = 20 eject/feed fails. @ 25m both show good groups.

Then moved onto what thought was copper coated Fiochi SV = 1 fail through 150rounds.....STOP!!!

Good mate had put Federal bulk ammo in some fiochi boxes for a tidy ammo box... Turns out the 41 loves the Federal bulk copper coated.
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Old 07-05-2017, 06:21 PM
Karl in NY Karl in NY is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gros21 View Post
I put a new standard spring in from them and I would of thought cci sv would of been happy with a new stock spring.

I also find it weird that my 7" is doing it now.

I have some cci mini mags here should I try them.

How stupid laws just make it hard as I can legally only use it at the range
My bought-new M41 would never function with CCI SV or any other SV ammo. It was back when guru "Vito" was still working on M41s at Springfield, and his 3 attempts to get it to work as a bullseye gun were futile...never functioned with SV regardless of factory work and various spring-kits.

I gave up, decided it would be a field-gun, had barrel machined to ventilated-rib design (think High Standard) and then had it matte hard-chromed with custom grips. 100% with CCI Mini-Mags, and accurate, too...
with them.

Now, probably one-of-a-kind custom.

Last edited by Karl in NY; 07-05-2017 at 06:22 PM.
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Old 07-06-2017, 02:55 PM
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Karl in NY We would love to see pics of your gun Please. WE Love all 41's and M46's. Thats pretty well all of us on here.
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Old 07-06-2017, 05:51 PM
Karl in NY Karl in NY is offline
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I'll try to get to it, but just had inpatient surgery and am still pretty doped-up.
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Old 07-06-2017, 09:09 PM
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The Best to you and your recovery and when you have time and feel better Please do it then. My wife of almost 50 years now is having open heart surjury on July 24th. She has only a 50/50 chance of surviving even the operation which has us very concerned needles to say.
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Old 07-07-2017, 12:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrie View Post
The Best to you and your recovery and when you have time and feel better Please do it then. My wife of almost 50 years now is having open heart surjury on July 24th. She has only a 50/50 chance of surviving even the operation which has us very concerned needles to say.
My thoughts will be with you and your wife and will pray that all works for the best.

Graydog
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Old 07-12-2017, 12:03 AM
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Hey Barrie... thoughts and prayers for both you and your wife at this time.
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Old 07-15-2017, 08:57 AM
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Hi All - UPDATE eject/feed fails. Also RE; failure with action closed NO STRIKE.

Shoot today NO FAILS!!!
200rnds = 100 Federal 525 Champ Copper coat 36grn. 50 CCI SV 40grn round lead. 50 Eley Club round lead.

Was it because i didn't clean thoroughly after last shoot???? Who knows??
I did find on 2 occasions failure with action closed (no strike)
I do believe i did not reset trigger properly?? I didn't depress trigger enough to reset.

Gun cycled setting firing pin although pulling trigger had no strike.
I waited 20 secs...muzzle down range, pulled trigger, gun fired.
When first occurring it confused me.... I am a novice so each failure is met with caution and curiosity.
One for the knowledge bank.
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Old 07-15-2017, 09:26 AM
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Any gun you put a new spring in expect to begin a break in period. You can shorten it by racking the slide a few hundred times, and/or lock the slide back while in storage(couple weeks).

This works with most any new semi auto, or new springs.
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Old 07-15-2017, 11:55 AM
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S&W Model 41 / 46 are very sensitive to ammo. Any good quality standard velocity .22LR should function fine.

Model 41 / 46s are straight forward. No rocket science in service and cleaning here. These S&Ws are of the finest target pistols ever made by S&W along with the Model 52 Master and others. You will rarely find an "accurized" model 41/46 or 52 because they were so finely crafted, there's really nothing much a good gunsmith to do to improve them.

I cannot comment on anything newer than 1990 because I feel the finer made 41s were the earlier ones. I've read horror stories on the newer models and, surprisingly, the Performance Center 41s.

As barrels and slides are interchangeable, make sure you have a correctly matched set. The cuts and angles of the frame, barrels and slides varied over time. Somewhere in this forum is a thread topic about this very subject. Square cut, rounded cut, etc. Check Barrel to frame fit Check the slide to barrel fit. While it would be very unusual, make sure you don't have a lightweight slide on a .22LR barrel (the lightweight slide would be for the very scarce .22 short barrel).

CCI Standard Velocity or Match ammo is excellent but rather pricey. I have recently used Federal Auto match which is quite reasonably priced and functions flawlessly.

As .22LR ammo is dirty, a good cleaning of the Model 41 after a FULL disassembly would be the first thing you should do especially if the gun is new to you, give it a good "once over".

Personally, don't believe anyone who tells you NOT to clean a .22 LR pistol, revolver or rifle. Yes, I know I am setting myself up for some harsh criticism here but this is "my" advice and opinion from 40+ years of knowledge.

To test the "don't clean" theory I had intentionally shot over 100 rounds through a Model 41. These were lead projectile CCI standard velocity. I did this in succession, 5 rounds per magazine, 10 magazines in line. Not super speed just normal aim / shoot. Stop to reload and repeat. After about 100 rounds I notices the bullet hits on the target were getting longer as if the bullet was tumbling (because the bullets had been tumbling). At 125 rounds I stopped to dismantle and clean.

I removed (and saved for awhile) a lead "tube" that I pushed from the barrel with a wooden dowel and a light hammer. It came out in one long length with an exact impression / mold of the barrel rifling. The hole in the center was so narrow it was amazing the bullet was exiting at all. Was it that the lead was soft and the gun hot ? most likely !

After that test / experience ... with an .22 LR pistol, revolver or rifle, I will go 50 rounds (brass jacketed or lead even though less likely to occur with a brass jacketed) then brass brush the barrel with either CRC / Corrosion-x / Rem-Oil or similar, followed by a patch wrapped around the brass brush ... repeating until the patch comes out clean. The patch wrapped around the brass brush is a winner. It gets into the lands & groves better than the patch "bit". That's my technique and it works.

Springs ? I've never needed to change one in any of the 41 / 46 models but I'd recommend only standard OEM S&W spring or similar from a good manufacturer.

Completely disassemble the pistol. Remove firing pin too, inspect and clean well. Check and clean the extractor mechanism to make sure the "hook" is sharp and not rounded and sufficient tension on the extractor spring. DO NOT LUBE the firing pin when reassembling as it will just attract and hold the burnt powder residue. I found teflon paste / lube (sort of looks like petroleum jelly but it is NOT anything like PJ) on semi-auto slides and / or slide rails works well, but just enough to lightly coat, don't pile it on. Just a light coat with a q-tip does wonders to reduce friction. Oil and other lubricants left in these areas will attract the burnt powder residue like a magnet.

Check the bullet seat face in the barrel(s) to determine if you have dry-fire strikes.
Visually check the face for overly impression-ed damage from many year of use may leave an impression. Over the years of use the face of the barrel, if impression starts to get deep, will need to be resurfaced by a good gunsmith.

Light impressions likely will have no effect on the function however deeper impressions can likely cause you all sorts of issues. If you do have a deeper impression, you should send it to a good Gunsmith to remedy. On some of the older, well used, model 41s you will notice a rather deep impression from the slide strikes on the barrel breach face.

Always leave a fired .22LR brass case or a snap cap (the plastic / disposable type are cheap but sometimes get stuck in the barrel) to protect firing pin and barrel from dry strikes which could cause all sorts of issues. Always use a wood or solid plastic dowel or brass cleaning rod to make sure the barrel is clear before loading / firing. Sometimes the spent .22 LR brass won't extract ... especially after it had been dry fired (on the same, spend .22LR brass case) so you will need the dowel or brass cleaning rod to extract it. DO NOT USE A POCKET KNIFE to try to pluck out the spent .22LR brass case or plastic snap cap from the breach face side . Use a wooden dowel or a brass cleaning rod (with no tip on it) from the muzzle end.
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