One thing I occasionally see discussed about the 3rd Gen guns, is "where would they fit now in today's market?"

While there are plenty of us old enough to remember the guns being sold, that was a couple decades ago, and the market prices have moved on things. And then there are also a lot of people who didn't price things then, and are curious what something cost at the time (and what it would be now).

I've been playing with 2 sites in conjunction;
The Handgun Informaton Resource
Genitron, which puts up a concise listing of various guns (including dates of production and MSRP when they can get it), and
Inflation Calculator | Find US Dollar's Value from 1913-2018
an inflation calculator. Pretty self-explanatory, you put in price and year, it calculates a "today price".

I'm using these to project a "Today MSRP" if the guns were continued.

For example, genitron says my S&W 915 had a MSRP of $467, and last date of production was 1995. In a contact email, they confirmed that's how they list the MSRP, if it's discontinued it was for the last year produced.

So I plugged those numbers into the calculator, and get a 2018 price of $759.54... which confirms to me that even the Value Line pistols weren't "budget guns"; and that had S&W continued their 3rd Gen and updated it, they would be competing with Sig in the price range.

I've seen Genitron before online, but they're working to improve the site. I now have a login and can keep my own list, and they recently added a couple guns to their database on my request (the 915, the CZ 75 pre B).

It's a cool little exercise; it's one thing to know the current used price range, but it's kinda fun to get a predicted "what would it cost new" price. I hope y'all find this info similarly useful for your own use.

Thanks for the info scoobysnacker.
Confirms that the 5906 TSW NIB I bought was a good buy.

I find your thread, this discussion and your conclusion quite interesting and great fodder for discussion... but alas, given the final word in your post... I don't find it useful beyond simple joy of discussion.

There's more that goes in to price, cost, value, etc. Sometimes it could be quite affected by what OTHER competing guns are being priced at.

I also find a two-way "value" in older models that were produced in high volume. First value is that regardless of what we might spend on one... it's fantastic that kept well and maintained properly, this small machine will last literally many decades. And in obvious relation to that point... the longer they make a model, the more volume they make, the more there are floating around the market, keeping prices in check. Price stays low -- usable value for the same item climbs.

I suppose the point of my post is two-fold. First is that I find these discussions compelling and second is that I don't believe we typically dig any further than the thin top layer when we talk about guns, prices and values.

I believe there is much deeper discussion here than most of us ever care to consider.

I'm in my 40's now and healthy (I hope?) and from the heart: if I never, ever, not EVER buy another new gun/newly produced or new to market, new design EVER again over the next (hopefully) 40 years... and I'm forever stuck at the used handgun market? Hell yeah! A dream: realized!

Scoobysnacker, I also need to mention that it was your "heads up" in a thread in the forum quite some time back that alerted me to an outfit that had gotten in some re-import formerly issued S&W Model 39-2 pistols from Israel. I don't recall at the moment but I will guess it was maybe two years ago.

Myself and two of my best gun buddies each grabbed one. All three pistols exhibited a lot of "exterior miles" in the finish. Of those three, one buddy didn't take to his and he only kept it about six months before selling it to a gent at a show that was thrilled to get it. The other two? Well mine is a fantastic "beater" and has given me nothing but fun... and the OTHER one, well, it has some ridiculous ability in small-group accuracy that is somehow well beyond it's pay grade. I'm not saying that a 39-2 "shouldn't" be a tight group shooter, but this particular one prints a tighter 12-yard group then anyone who owns true precision handguns should expect. My buddy knows the "golden rule" and since I brought this deal to our crew, he can't get rid of this particular one without giving me a shot at it.

Man, does this one shoot! All three of these were 1975-1977 produced, I don't know where the numbers would spit out for your MSRP and inflation calculator today.

Sevens- glad to hear you were able to grab a couple of those 39-2's, I thought at the time they were a good deal.

No, the Genitron+Inflation calculator absolutely isn't definitive, but it does provide you a reasonable basis to guesstimate. Probably best to find some other makes and models, start cross-referencing, and try to pin it down. I do think it's very helpful to determine relative value (not price).

Yeah, I just checked again, they don't have the 39 (or really, much of the 1st and 2nd Gen guns) listed. They added the 915 within a week of my request, maybe if others signed up and contacted them, they would add the others (I don't think they would move as favorably to all these requests coming from just 1 guy).

Part of the reason I started looking into this, is because of Lionheart. They are selling basically a brand new Daewoo DP-51, and they are MSRP around $7-800. I know it's a niche gun, but I wouldn't price a Daewoo pistol above a S&W (especially the 59xx stainless models).

I'm pretty sure if S&W did re-enter the metal frame game, they'd push Sig down in price. I don't think Ruger re-entering would.

Oh, definitely. A 5906 can often go around $300 or so nowadays. I my 915 for about $250 all said and done.

There are $300 new guns on the market, but you'd be hard pressed to find a stainless steel hi-cap new for that price. Or twice that.

Same principle applies to other used pistols; you can get a Star BM for around the same price as a new Shield. I suspect in 5, 10, 20 years, the BM will hold it's price, and the Shield will be much less.

My experience would suggest that the inflation adjusted calculation of current value is only worth it as a mental exercise. People get a home appraisal of value prior to listing a home for sale and hang onto that number as if it came from God. But the market will always dictate its value as to the sale price. Too high and the home sits there. And sits and sits and sits...... Finally the seller throws in the towel and gets less than they would have if it had been appropriately priced in the first place. Same with guns. Go on GB and look at the selling prices for a model you’re interested in. The average of many sales is a better rendition of value than an inflation calculator.

The gun traders guides also offer reasonable prices at various degrees of finish on these guns. It's harder for the small batch rares. But even those seem to be going decently when you adjust for inflation. Just wish I'd started trying to get PC guns years ago. lol

Well, yeah. And to be honest, gunbroker (sales, not listed price) is the best, because it reflects the market (I know it tends to undercut most of the LGS around me).

But that wasn't what I was doing. Quite simply, we run into waves of discontinued guns on the used market. S&W's, Stars, etc. What I did was try to place these guns into the context of where they WERE, when they were new. I translate it to today's dollars, in an attempt to get a 'real' indication, because if you see an MSRP without context, that can be deceiving. The Star BM has a MSRP of $415. That's not a high price, that's budget list. But it was from 1991; in 2018 dollars, that is $755. That's NOT a budget gun... but it IS around what you might expect from a small/compact all-steel 9mm in the 1911 style, from a European maker. A little pricier than the MSRP for a RIA 1911 Compact, about the same size.

I'm glad you agree that Gunbroker is an effective place to get a valid, real-world view of the market. Sure, I know what a lot of folks think of Gunbroker and all the very loud complaints they have... but anyone in the conversation is doing the subject an injustice if they choose to ignore Gunbroker.

Put simply: there is no more active single marketplace on the globe for S&W 1-2-3rd Gens (and PC guns) than Gunbroker. There exists no store or shop or gun show or annual event that sees more offering, more buying and more selling of these particular guns in one place than Gunbroker.

For sure, anyone's local market can and will (and SHOULD!) be somewhat different from what we in Gunbroker sold/ended auctions, but if you want a strong gauge of prices, generally speaking, it's ludicrous to ignore Gunbroker.

Let us all accept the fact that inflation increases the cost of an item over time. But a gun manufactured in 1995, with it's production costs from base materiel to labor factored in, cannot be forwarded in valued due to manufacturing efficiencies and regulatory controls present today. Where was CNC milling in 1995? Where were MIM parts? How about health care labor related expenses? On and on it goes. Material cost basis and efficiencies of production confine the inflation factor to marginal real world value.

The value guns are and were budget guns.

The value line 457 and 908 did not use the same metal treatment or finishing that the 4 digits lines did. Furthermore they rust and show wear a LOT faster.

They were durable, however, the fit and finish though good for a working gun were not as great as the TSW series or even standard guns.

I don't think you can project costs forward like this. A gun's price is related to desire of the public to buy it. Bluntly S&W 3rd generation autos were not that desirable or more police agencies and civilians would have purchased them.

Price is based on cost of production and market demand.

There is little market demand for metal framed handguns. Professional gun carriers have a lot of other demands for weight and speed. SO lighter guns that are just as easy to shoot like polymer firearms win out.

I look at the Glock Gen5 and see a new product that delivers on reliable performance, effective use of modern manufacturing and materials and clear response to customer demand.

S&W and Ruger are doing that too, that is why they are not bankrupt like Remington. Profitable but not overextended, we hope.

I usually find the original purchase receipt in the old blue boxes and guns usually don't appreciate much. NOT at the rate of inflation.

A Daewoo is the closest thing you will find in appearance and materials to a new 5906. Sigs are their own kind of animal. IF I wanted a metal framed handgun today that was NOT a beretta or 1911 I would buy a Sig.

But a Daewoo gives someone a vague idea of what a new S&W would have been like today.

I would find out where Sig was and use a compass to determine 180 degrees and head THAT way. If I had to a buy new metal frame semiautomatic (non-1911) pistol today, my top three choices would be CZ, CZ and CZ.

am I wrong? I thought the inflation calculator only gave you an idea of the actual buying power of the dollars you spent in 1975 for that brand new model 60 ( 125.50) when compared to todays dollars. Not any kind of reference to current market value, in any way....