So, thanks to you nut jobs, 3rd generations autos are multiplying like rabbits. I might be partial to my 3953, but I need more range time with all of them. That said, I have a question.

I was various tactical videos and what stood out the most was the importance of the slide release, something that stood out the least on my 3913s. Reloading, any one of numerous potential malfunctions, etc., all call for the use of the slide release. IMO, there's an excellent video, which explains the tactical significance of using the weak hand to engage the slide release. Practicing that with my 3913, I noticed that one of my 3913s, the one with a black trigger and hammer, has a more pronounced slide release - we'll call it the black gun. They all look the same and have the fit to frame clearances, except the one on the black, which appears to have an extra ridge of depth and is much easier to engage.

Has anyone ever noticed that on their models? The slide release looks to be factory, so I doubt it's an upgrade.

Are upgrade slide releases readily available for the 3913?

Perhaps as disappointing is that the slide release on my P239 is almost non-existent. The slide release on my 1911 is shallow, like the 3913, but much easier to engage.

A couple of points. First, it's actually a slide stop, not a slide release. I say that to put things into perspective for the rest of my comments.

The proper way to release the slide on the 3rd Gens is to pull it back and let it go forward on it's own.

As to the releases, there are two types. One has five steps and one has three steps. The five step version is the most common. I have half a dozen 3rd Gen 9mm guns, and I have a mix. My non rail 3913TSW came with the five step, but my railed 3913TSW came with the three step. My 6906 has the three step, but my 5906 has the five step. And so on.

The five step version seems to be available most of the time. Numrich usually has them. The three step version shows up once in a while, but they go fast. As of about three weeks ago, Numrich had some three step in both black and stainless.

Another alternative is to contact member BMCM here and ask about having him machine a five step down to three. He also does "dehorning" and does a great job.

The two styles are completely interchangeable.

There are also two styles of safety/decocker lever. One has five steps and one has four. The four step version is far more rare.

The reason for the thinner version, I think, was just to slim the profile a bit. That might even be why S&W made a number of frame mounted decocker versions.

BMCM also will shave and dehorn the safety/docker levers. He did a nice five to three step shave and dehorn on the ambi safety/decocker on my rail 3913TSW. The thread can be found in this sub forum.

Hope that helps.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

I didn't find it in my search here, but a Google search took me back to this forum. apparently, the older 3913s has the slimmer/flatter release and the newer models had the fatter slide release. I prefer the flatter, so now that hunt begins...

First, GaryS, thanks for the response and the excellent information on acquiring a replacement lever. Much appreciated.

With all due respect, and I REALLY don't want to offend, or start a huge debate, but I use the term slide release and here's why:

A slide stop is passive and a slide release active. During a reload, performing the release of the slide, by grabbing the slide and releasing it, requires the shooter to relay on the proper functioning of the slide stop- hoping it will drop. If the shooter slingshots the slide and the slide stop doesn't work correctly, the shooter now has to start over and physically engage the slide release lever. Time wasted, when bullets are coming at you. I might also argue that using your weak hand to engage the slide release and begin shooting is a more natural and streamline motion, then sling-shotting the slide. I feel like it takes your weak hand closer to where it needs to be, once the slide is forward.

The theory I happen to agree with is that the shooter should take control over as many aspects of the engagement as possible, especially their weapon. During a reload, do NOT rely on the empty magazine to fall, rather pull the magazine from the gun, then reach for a fresh mag. Otherwise, there's a chance that when your weak hand arrives at the mag well there will be an empty mag blocking your new mag and it then becomes a clumsy affair. Took me a while to wrap my head around removing the magazine, rather than letting it drop, but I'm good with that. some techniques have the shooter actually retain the mag, when it's known that the mag is not yet empty.

Do NOT pull the slide and hope the slide stop releases, rather engage the stop and make sure it releases the slide forward. If the slingshot technique fails, it could cost as much as 2 seconds.

Again, I don't take credit for the theory, but do agree with it. I'm certainly not telling you, or anyone, how they should reload, just posing an option. Rather than hope everything works perfectly, then having to deal with it if it doesn't, this theory says assumes Murphy's Law and that the shooter should practice taking control from the start.

could be a personality thing. Glass half full vs half empty.

Hmmm. Might be best to call it what the mothership calls it... ... along with every other pistol manufacturer that I'm aware of.

Just a thought. Could help avoid confusion.

Parts Listing for Model: M3913

Part no. 208940000 SLIDE STOP ASSY
part no. 233570000 SLIDE STOP ASSY (LS & NL)

From the parts manual.

Cheers
Bill

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Because they don't make a .46

No doubt. So far, I've read slide stop, slide stop assembly, and slide catch lever (not for 3913), though they do appear somewhat different. Honestly, I like the lever term better than stop. The slide stop, to me, would appear to be the portion of the slide release lever that actually holds the slide back!

However, I agree with what you're saying.

No reason for any indigestion about the name of the slide stop assembly, guys. It's called a slide stop by the factory, and in factory armorer training. Its primary function is to stop the slide and lock it back when the magazine is empty.

Yes, some folks who have been around for a while (especially 1911 shooters ) have trained to use it to release the locked-back slide. I'm among that group.

The last time a S&W factory trainer was at our range, he said that current training methods taught releasing a locked slide using the overhand method involving the use of the support hand. Well, that's unsurprising, as it's pretty much become a current standard practice in the training industry. The same thing is currently taught by at least one other major gun company, and it's found all over commercial training.

I can teach both, depending on the desires of the people making the decisions regarding agency training. No biggie.

Those of us (older 1911 & 3rd gen shooters) who generally default to using the slide stop to release locked slides usually find it quicker, even with the pistols that have the smaller and slimmer slide stop lever tabs, and it doesn't require that extra manipulation by the support hand. (If you're reduced to only being able to use one hand for a loading/reloading manipulation, it's a good idea to be familiar with using the slide stop lever to release the locked-back slide, regardless of whether you're right or left handed, or which side of an ambi lever assembly you normally use. )

I've seen people manage to perform both methods sloppily or incorrectly, and cause themselves grief on the firing line. The ones who have caused me some puckering moments have been the shooters who use the overhand method ... but get excited in their manipulations and unconsciously allow their support hand to slip forward and drop over the front of the muzzle as they're searching to reacquire their 2-handed grip.

There's something to be said for the slingshot method, in that respect, as that means the shooter's support hand isn't "recoiling" forward from releasing the slide "overhand", and isn't likely to drift as close to the business end of the barrel after performing the manipulation.

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Ret LE Firearms inst & armorer

In my experience (not as extensive as many here), the 5 step slide release/stop lever is more common on the single stack Smiths while the three step is prevalent on the "wide bodies."
When I was learning to shoot centerfire 40+ years ago, it was with a Colt 1911. The "old dudes" back then thumbed the release and let the slide slam forward. My thumb isn't sufficiently long and I had to shift my grip, which wasn't good. I learned to use my support hand to release the slide as I re-acquired a firing grip.
As times changed, everybody seemed to go to the slingshot method and so did I. In my book, overhand is bad pistolcraft. I teach English, however, not the safe handling of firearms.

When it comes to the older metal-frame pistols, it's not all that bad of a thing for the shooter to have to let the pistol slightly twist/cant in their hand in order for them to manipulate the slide stop lever. That way, since their thumbs fall short of reaching the rear of the lever's tab during normal shooting, using their normal grip, they're less at risk for unintentionally bumping it up (or holding it down) and inducing premature slide-lock or failure-to-lock open on an empty mag.

The introduction of metal guns like the SIG, and the wealth of newer plastic guns, is that the positioning of the slide stop levers are located much farther to the rear than some older designs, putting the lever tab under a shooter's thumb.

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Ret LE Firearms inst & armorer

BTW, the older slide stop levers and manual safety levers were sometimes argued to be too slim to easily find and manipulate under stress, so the lever surfaces were revised and widened, and had more serrated "steps" to make it easier for the shooter to find and engage them.

You just can't please everyone, huh.

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Ret LE Firearms inst & armorer

Agreed, not right or wrong here. Using the overhand method, the shooter does cover the ejection port and I can't see that ever being a good thing. Might not always be bad, but I can't think of it ever being good.

The other concern with the overhand method is that the shooter now has two full hands, doing different things, trying to accomplish one task and if the overhand wins, things don't work out so well. Under the stress of a shootout, the weak side could come across the top of the slide with enough force to displace the gun from the shooter's grip, especially if the strong side hand has not yet regained full control after the magazine is inserted, or has possible been grazed by incoming fire, etc. As we walk through the steps it all seems intuitive, but when under stress things could become rushed.

Using the slingshot method, the shooter only has a thumb and finger on the slide, so the dominant hand will always win that battle, which usually means things work out just fine.

Lastly, take a look at some of your rear sights. Most of guns would not be an issue, but I have a Witness that would split my hand like a canoe if I ran the overhand method too quickly or recklessly. Then it's just a bloody mess.

There is some excellent training about how to rack the slide, when one hand is disabled - so the shooter can neither release the slide, or slingshot it. One solution involves possibly using a duty belt, which most citizens would clearly not have. Other options are tables, perhaps a bed rail, but again I think it's best to train with what you know you will have and what you can control. Kneeling and using the heel of the shoe works for most outdoor scenarios. A bed rail, banister, etc. are indoor options.

I'm by no means an expert. Simply presenting food for thought. I think a lot of us train to be fast and most drills are timed, but I'm becoming more concerned with sending rounds down range until the threat is eliminated.

One of my favorite lines from the one-armed guy in Unforgiven, "I just don't wanna be killed for lack of shootin back."

Actually, done properly, the overhand method should NOT cover the ejection port. It should cover the slide to the rear of the ejection port, over the sights, but stopping short of moving over the ejection port.

Why? To help prevent a serious injury if a live round goes off while trying to clear a chambered round, or removing a "stuck" round during a double feed, etc.

First of all, you need to have the ejection port clear so the round(s) can clear it. (This is where the retract, turn/tip technique is handy, too, but that's another discussion. )

Second, you don't want your palm or fingers covering the ejection port if a live round goes off while trying to clear (unload) the chamber or addressing a stoppage.

If the slide is forcefully retracted in this sort of clearance technique, and the round trying to be cleared (unloaded) has slipped out from under the extractor ... and if it's "captured" within the tight confines of the ejection port during the rearward movement of the slide being forcefully retracted ... and if the rear of the round tips and finds its way so the primer aligns with the tip of the ejector ... the ejector could act as a firing pin. Yes. it's happened, and it can be nasty.

In one of our armorer classes they showed a rather graphic picture taken of a shooter's seriously injured hand, sans some significant parts of the little and ring fingers, which was the result of him having covered the ejection port with his offhand while trying to retract the slide to clear a round out of the chamber. The ejector found the primer. Bang.

Naturally, there was some discussion reminding the students of the importance of never covering the ejection port with their hand when trying to clear a round while manipulating the slide to clear a round from the chamber/ejection port area. (This also means not trying to catch the ejected round in your off-hand's cupped palm while manipulating the slide.)

Now, imagine someone thinking that "grasping the slide" is "always grasping the slide", for all reasons and simplicity of technique. They do it a lot more often for freshly loading the chamber from slide-lock than for any other reason. They may easily become lazy and "automatically" let their hand cover the ejection port the next time they need to unload the chamber or address a double feed.

However, if the stars align just right (against them), and they use the same cover-the-port hand position for unloading the chamber (or trying to clear a stoppage) ... and the loose extracted round tips, slips out from under the extractor and has its nose blocked by the leading edge of the ejection port, trapping it within the port ... and the slide shoves the round back against the ejector ... Oops.

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Ret LE Firearms inst & armorer

Here's a good video on the topic. Its pretty simple. You have either a proactive mindset or a reactive. Again, I'm not preaching that either is right or wrong, but this guy makes a good case for my position.

It's 25 minutes and worth a watch, but if you want to skip forward, at 11:00 he covers this topic.

"During a gun fight, the number one shooter-caused firearm malfunction is the premature dropping of the slide, during a reload." He could be making that up, but I'd be willing to bet he isn't.

As to whether to release the slide by sling-shoting or using the slide stop, the S&W manual for 3rd Gens says to insert a loaded mag, pull the slide back, and release it by pressing the slide stop. Their words.

Moral of the story: it makes no real difference. Do it however suits you.

For anyone who might be interested, there's a low profile 3913 slide stop listed on Ebay. No link, since it's an active listing, but shouldn't be hard to find.

NOTE: It's not mine, I don't know the seller, and I have no pecuniary interest in the sale.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

Yes, I have seen the different widths. My 3913 had the wider slide stop and safety levers. I milled them thinner, and re bead blasted them, to match the low profile factory versions supplied on some guns.

LE firearms instructors have taught the sling shot method for years, but I admit that I have resisted. I still use the slide stop to release the slide. It seems natural and efficient to me. Range personnel have called me on it for years, but use of the slide stop to release the slide has never caused me an issue. During training and qualification, I have seen more people bobble using the sling shot method. And definitely covering the ejection port, and coming dangerously close to covering others during their contorted efforts to get their gun back into action.......ymmv

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NRA Life, COTEP 640

We were trained to release the slide by using the slide stop too (1911s, 3rd gen 45s).

IIRC the slingshot method came about after Glocks were authorized and later issued. I still use the slidestop to release the slide. Works, for me. Regards 18DAI

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7 +1 Rounds of hope & change

The two designs of the slide release.

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