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Old 07-07-2018, 10:51 PM
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Default 5906tsw vs. Regular 5906

So I have 2 tsws both in .45. I would like one in 9...a 5906tsw.

But I am wondering if there is enough difference between the way they shoot to be noticeable to a decent but not great shot. My 5906 is in great shape, shoots like a champ, not like me, and I only want it because all the rest seen to be 40s or two, except for a 3913.

Wondering if I should focus resources elsewhere if it won't be a noticeable difference.
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Old 07-08-2018, 08:24 AM
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In my opinion, you wont notice, and I bet I wouldnt if blindfolded either. The 5906 is a fantastic pistol, made only better by constant shooting and cleaning, and if there is a price difference between them it isnt worth it.
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Old 07-08-2018, 08:48 AM
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I don’t like the tsw pistols. Don’t like the two toned colors, the giant logos on some of the slides, and definitely don’t like the riveted on rail that looks like an after-thought on some of them. They supposedly were made better, and that might be, but a bone stock third gen is fine by me.

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Old 07-08-2018, 08:58 AM
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IIRC the only real difference is the heavier box rails that were originally introduced by the Performance Center. You already have an all stainless 5906......... I'd look for an alloy frame gun for carry ..... maybe even a 915 if you want to save a few $$$$s


Like KBM I don't care for the "billboards" on my guns.... none were designed or intended to be "target pistols"
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Old 07-08-2018, 10:39 AM
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While I like the contrast of the black small parts against the stainless slide and frame, the gaudy billboard lettering is wildly unattractive. The attached rail is also unsightly and of no use to me whatsoever.

I don't believe the larger rails or the (supposedly) "matched" upper and lower are of any advantage whatsoever and I have a LOT of experience with true, elite Performance Center pistols, the TSW series should never be mentioned in the same sentence as PC.

I will say that the lastest MIM hammer/trigger is definitely an advantage over the very earliest flash chromed 3rd Gen hardware, but while all the TSW's have them, you don't need a TSW to get them.

I cannot say that I hate the TSW 3rd Gens, I just personally find them to be a less attractive, over priced, over hyped, hollow "evolution", a product not of a creative design team but rather the product of an advertising committee.
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Old 07-08-2018, 01:22 PM
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I picked up a 5906TSW a short time ago and do like it better than the 5906 I owned years ago but it's difficult to express why. It is still a brick - the main complaint I had for the 5906. My 915 has always felt much better in that respect. I never liked the billboard before but it has grown on me. Mine came without the rail so no issues there. It has Novak adjustable night sights that still glow. I got it for right around $400 because it was broken - replacement of the plastic disconnector (which came out in 3 pieces) and sear spring and it was back in business. I think it's a great gun for what I have in it but I might not feel the same if I paid much more.
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Old 07-08-2018, 06:01 PM
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I own both a regular and a TSW 5906, and I personally like the TSW version better. It's a little bulkier, but the main thing I like about it is the front strap checkering in hand. The loaded chamber indicator is convenient, and I actually like having the ugly rail for the option of putting a light on when used as my house gun.

Aside from the larger box rails, your also getting the option to convert it to decock-only, as well as the delayed-blowback timing and matched slide and frame for a tighter fit. Hard to say that I can notice a big difference in accuracy or perceived recoil between the two versions, though I've never really done a direct comparison at the range. I will say that my later railed 3913TSW/3953TSW's are noticeably more accurate than their earlier predecessors.

The 5906TSW seems much sturdier, especially with it's thicker-walled barrel. Aesthetics are pretty low on my list of what's important with a gun, but personally I like the looks of the TSW's over the regular 5906's.
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Old 07-08-2018, 06:06 PM
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Thoughts inspired by a couple of comments in posts above...................


If you want a great range gun..... I'd skip the TSW and if you ever get the chance grab a Performance Center DPA 5906..... w/ the decocker.

For a full size carry gun;make mine a 915 with the straight backstrap grips (mine are stippled in a snake skin/fish scale pattern)....add some..... Mec-gar 17rd mags...... and you are GTG

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Old 07-08-2018, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sevens View Post

I will say that the lastest MIM hammer/trigger is definitely an advantage over the very earliest flash chromed 3rd Gen hardware, but while all the TSW's have them, you don't need a TSW to get them.
To each his own. Mim parts were not used because they were better. They were used because they were cheaper, & easier to make. Some say they feeL better because they are smoother. But the minute I find a 45 stainless Chief's Special, I will remove the mim trigger parts, throw them in the trash, & install a flash chromed set from a 4506. GARY
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Old 07-09-2018, 12:32 AM
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Absolutely "to each his own", I wouldn't have it any other way.

For this "each", I have never seen nor have I even read or heard of a 3rd Gen MIM related failure... and there is zero doubt that the (more precise) MIM hammer/trigger parts in a 3rd Gen make for a noticeably smoother trigger pull, most easily noticed in the double action trigger stroke.

In the world of firearms, we have certainly witnessed some problematic, poorly done MIM. All evidence has shown (with no doubt) that the MIM used in S&W 3rd Gen pistols is amongst the finest MIM yet used in firearms.

If I were so inclined, I would be the guy to swap you the older flashed-chromed stuff for the MIM you don't want.
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Old 07-09-2018, 12:39 AM
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BAM-BAM, it's a little silly to suggest a gun so extremely rare and extremely high priced as a DPA-5906 in this discussion.

One of these guns runs $1500 or beyond and finding one is five times more difficult than locating a 952.

jsbethel-- a plastic disconnector, say what?! Since when did S&W use a plastic disconnector? We are talking specifically about the part inside the frame, in the middle between the ejector and the decocker levers, yes? Protrudes just a tip through the top of the frame and the slide rides directly over it and interacts with it?

Plastic...?
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Old 07-09-2018, 01:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sevens View Post
jsbethel-- a plastic disconnector, say what?! Since when did S&W use a plastic disconnector? We are talking specifically about the part inside the frame, in the middle between the ejector and the decocker levers, yes? Protrudes just a tip through the top of the frame and the slide rides directly over it and interacts with it?

Plastic...?
Absolutely correct - the plastic disconnector (239070000) is actually on the 5906TSW parts list. I replaced it with a metal disconnector (104210000) of which I had an extra. I believe the only other plastic piece on the pistol was the mainspring plunger cup.
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Old 07-09-2018, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sevens View Post
BAM-BAM, it's a little silly to suggest a gun so extremely rare and extremely high priced as a DPA-5906 in this discussion.

One of these guns runs $1500 or beyond and finding one is five times more difficult than locating a 952.
Well if he's looking for the best 59xx he can get.......go for the best.... we don't know his budget.......... some guys here buy and shoot Registered Magnums that sell for over $5000. But ya; maybe it was a bit over the top!!!!
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Old 07-09-2018, 09:17 AM
MattyD380 MattyD380 is offline
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I heard that the 5906TSW was, more or less, a 4006 chambered in 9mm. That's why the barrel is thicker... I think the area around the dustcover is a bit thicker, too (and not just because of the rail).

I kinda like things that are overbuilt and over engineered. And I'm sure the extra weight and (slightly) more precise build would translate to some shooting benefits.

That said, from aesthetic standpoint, it's hard to beat the old-school look of a regular 5906. And it shoots nearly as well. So... I dunno. You can't really go wrong.
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Old 07-09-2018, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsbethel View Post
Absolutely correct - the plastic disconnector (239070000) is actually on the 5906TSW parts list. I replaced it with a metal disconnector (104210000) of which I had an extra. I believe the only other plastic piece on the pistol was the mainspring plunger cup.
I definitely learned something here. The disconnector looks like a letter "j" but with little prongs on it so that the levers can actuate it. It is a part that gets used with every single cycle of the slide, but I wouldn't call it a high stress part. Even still, I can't agree with making them metal for FIFTY YEARS and then deciding to go with plastic on a (not insubstantially) more expensive "upgraded" model. These damn TSW series guns were knocking on the door of a Grand MSRP back when they rolled out.

My post above makes it obvious that I have never been a TSW fan, but upon learning this about a plastic disconnector, I am even less so a fan now.

I appreciate your insight on this!
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Old 07-09-2018, 01:50 PM
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If it were me ...

If I had the choice of choosing between an older 5906 and a 5906TSW, I'd opt for the TSW.

The TSW included some nice enhancements, including beefier box-type frame/slide rails, delayed unlocking and a loaded chamber inspection port.

The thicker frame rails were designed to help aid potential accuracy, and the delayed unlocking was claimed to reduce felt recoil.

We were told that in one point during 5906TSW production, the chamber wall angled received a 1 degree change to enhance extraction (if "variable" tolerances of case dimensions were encountered and made extraction "sticky"). This change was supposedly identified in the barrel revision where the caliber designation on the barrel hood read 9MM in large alpha /numerics, versus the previous 9mm Parabellum in small alpha/numberics. The barrel hoods were thicker in the TSW's, too.

The revisions and improvements in overall manufacturing were occurring pretty often, and the TSW's benefitted from all of them. Better drawbars and more cleanly machined inside surfaces, as well as the enhanced MIM triggers, sears and hammers.

The plastic/nylon disconnectors and mainspring plungers (cups) were good things, too.

I remember when an armorer instructor told us (in one of my 3rd gen pistol armorer classes) that before changing from stainless steel to plastic disconnectors, the factory conducted endurance testing on the plastic disconnector concept. The plastic ones demonstrated durability at least rivaling that of the steel ones, and the testing went out beyond 25,000 rounds, we were told.

The consistent dimensions and tolerances on the plastic ones were better than the older steel ones, too. The problem described in an older armorer manual of "long tail disconnector" was no longer included in the subsequent manuals, for one thing. Also, the inherent reduced friction of the plastic part resulted in less draw against the drawbar's disconnector tab.

The edges of the plastic mainspring cup made for a smoother stacking of the mainspring, too, as the individual coils rubbed much more smoothly against the lip than in the older metal cups. A minor detail, but many years ago you could rear of how some smiths offered radiussing/smoothing of the metal cup edges to help DA trigger feel, so the coils didn't catch on the sharp metal cup edge during compression. (My finger's not that sensitive, I think.)

I actually replaced the steel disconnectors with the newer plastic ones in my own issued 5903/6906's, and most (if not all?) of my own personally-owned 3rd gen guns. That was many years, and many thousands of rounds ago.

Also, the newer MIM sear was called (in-house, we were told), the "super sear", because it was made to very good tolerances and could be used in both new model TDA (DA/SA) and DAO models that used the new MIM parts. One of the factory guys told us how the original, and very expensive, MIM molds were made using language to ID the MIM sear's application before the engineers had finished designing the new style DAO, and realized they could now use one sear in both designs. (older DAO guns used a designated DAO machined sear.) Hence, the in-house reference to it being a "super sear" , even if the language of the first mold no longer applied.

I never cared for the riveted accessory rail, myself, but the later production 5906TSW's could be ordered with the machined integral frame rails (full-size models in all 3 calibers could be ordered that way, at no additional cost, during the end of LE production, BTW).

There's probably various other minor things I've forgotten since those days (I took 4 classes for the 3rd gen guns, and had a lot of phone conversations with various guys at the factory while supporting them as an armorer), but those are the things that stick out in my memory, off the top of my head.

Oh yeah, as the guns were being made with new CNC machines, and some laser cuts, the inside of the frames and slides were benefiting from much cleaner cuts and surfaces. Even the barrels of the TSW's were benefiting from some ongoing revisions right up till the end of production. I saw that exhibited in some 4566TSWs during the last couple year's of production.
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Old 07-09-2018, 02:00 PM
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Oh yeah, I forgot a bit of plastic disconnector trivia in my last post ...

In my last armorer class (2010) we were told that there was some discussion occurring within the factory about maybe going back to the steel disconnector, but the reason wasn't what you might expect.

As it turned out, while the plastic disconnector did great during endurance testing and normal use in the 3rd gen guns, their "Achilles heel" was .... armorers.

Since the disconnectors in the TDA guns have to be carefully installed and removed by shifting their tails around the drawbar disconnector tab, which involves using a pin punch to move the tail around the tab, it was observed that an inattentive, inexperienced or "rushed" armorer might push against the tail of the disconnector too hard, at the wrong moment, and break it off. It didn't happen during actual live-fire ... but during armorer inspection and detailed disassembly while repositioning and pushing on the tail.

The "read between the lines" comment I heard expressed was that they'd discussed trying to make steel disconnectors again (but with better dimensions and tolerances than the old ones) in order to make them less susceptible to damage by armorers.

Dunno. Maybe so. Funny, though.
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Old 07-09-2018, 02:17 PM
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I can attest to the steel disconnector units not always having "perfect" dimensions... a 639 that I still have gave me fits until I figured out what the issue was. The disconnector itself had a rough edge and it would catch on the edge and stay UP, locking the slide open in the middle of a magazine.

At first I figure it was my thumb inadvertently hitting the slide stop -- but holding the pistol with the slide locked open, the magazine half full and the slide stop DOWN had me thoroughly mystified for a long stretch on that range day until I was able to replicate the problem at home.

This was a 2nd Gen. Neat guns and the link between where it all started and the pinnacle of the design, but still the red headed stepchild in the Three Generations of the S&W pistol.

As for another good upgrade of the TSW (as much as I hate to admit! ) there are some subtle ergonomic improvements also, a big one for me is that they did more detail rounding and de-horning where the bottom of the trigger guard meets the front of the grip.

Like the BIG upgrade from 2nd to 3rd Gen, S&W made this area even a bit better for a more comfortable, secure hold on the pistol.
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Old 07-10-2018, 01:05 AM
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Many thanks to all who commented here. I learned a lot, including that unless I find a super deal on a TSW I'll keep my regular 5906 and stay on the lookout for some of the other guns on my wish list.
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Old 07-10-2018, 03:36 PM
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If you love third generation S&W 9mms like I do, and you want a great house gun, with a light on it and night sights, get a 5906TSW with a Mec Gar or factory 20 round magazine, like I did. If you want a great full sized carry gun, get a 5903, like I did. 6906s make great carry guns too and 3913s go very nicely under a shirt in the Summer, from my personal experience. If you want a very nice range gun/house gun, a 5906 with a 20 round Mec Gar magazine, and night sights, is hard to beat, like the one that sits in my home office.

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Old 07-11-2018, 01:39 AM
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My Smiths are a 5906 for the range and fun (Sig .45 250 at my bedside), 6906 I sometimes carry, a 39-2 'cause ya gotta have at least one, a 639 to have a shiny one, 3 Shields for carry (.380, 9 and .45) and 2 M&Ps one in 9c and the other .45c and there's a 4513tsw on the way to join my 4566tsw.

I'm good on S&W pistols for now. I think. Maybe. Unless I find a nice deal on a 745.
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Old 07-11-2018, 01:03 PM
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My Smiths are a 5906 for the range and fun (Sig .45 250 at my bedside), 6906 I sometimes carry, a 39-2 'cause ya gotta have at least one, a 639 to have a shiny one, 3 Shields for carry (.380, 9 and .45) and 2 M&Ps one in 9c and the other .45c and there's a 4513tsw on the way to join my 4566tsw.

I'm good on S&W pistols for now. I think. Maybe. Unless I find a nice deal on a 745.
Personally, I think your collection probably ought to include a 3913, or a 3913TSW, myself.
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Old 07-11-2018, 05:19 PM
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Personally, I think your collection probably ought to include a 3913, or a 3913TSW, myself.
Hmmmmm......
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