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Old 08-06-2018, 09:11 PM
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Default Disappointed in answer from S&W, the Mothership

I sent a question to S&W on line:

I have a question(s) about S&W's 1911Sc Commander. I realize that the frame has Scandium added for extra strength. Does S&W still anodize the frame in spite of the extra strength Scandium?
Second question.....on the same firearm, what is the black finish on the frame? It appears that the finish used is not very robust.
Thanks,

Here was their answer:

The finish is described as an anodized black. Despite the scandium frame the anodize does not add additional strength to the frame.

Smith&Wesson values its customers and we are happy to have served you today. Please do not hesitate to contact us should you require further assistance.

Regards, Richard

Please use the link below to check out the all new S&W M&P 380 Shield EZ.

Is it just me? Am I the AH? It is obvious that the finish is some black finish and is NOT anodizing and they completely blew off my question about anodizing.

Maybe I stuttered or spoke a foreign language? I thought my 2 questions were very clear?? Again I am disappointed with the staff at S&W......
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Last edited by Notary; 08-06-2018 at 09:13 PM.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Notary View Post
Am I the AH?
Yup. They answered the question . . .
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:26 PM
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Welcome to 2018, nothing personal, just business.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:28 PM
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If you are stuttering online you need to clean your keyboard.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:32 PM
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"Please do not hesitate to contact us should you require further assistance."

They didn't answer what the black finish was. I'd ask again.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:38 PM
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Default Anodizing doesn't add.....

Anodizing doesn't add strength, it is a surface treatment like bluing is to steel.

Scandium is added to aluminum which significantly increases the strength of the alloy.

The alloy is actually aluminum-scandium, as aluminum is the predominant element by far. A little scandium goes a long way in making aluminum stronger. Scandium is rare and expensive. Plain aluminum is frequently anodized in different ways and colors and aluminum scandium is no different. In fact, it anodizes better than many aluminum alloys.

I have a scandium 5943 third gen. It's hefty enough to make it easy to shoot but much lighter than steel.


PS: Good gravy. The finished is described as black anodized which doesn't add strength to the alloy.

My conclusions are:

The finish is black
The finish is anodized
Anodizing doesn't add strength.

I didn't get at all that they were pulling a fast one by painting the gun black to save money on anodizing it, so it's not as strong as it should be.
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Last edited by rwsmith; 08-06-2018 at 09:45 PM.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:44 PM
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It looks to me like they answered the question.

- The finish is described as an anodized black

I looked up the gun, and that is exactly what the review descriptions say. Having once been a CS person, I'd say they met spec, but failed on form.

"The SW1911Sc’s a Scandium alloy-framed black anodized finish bobtailed 1911. It’s designed to compete with the rest of the Commander length (4.25″ bbl) 1911’s.
The two-tone model sports a stainless steel slide, bringing the gun’s unloaded weight to 29.6 ozs. The sister pistol’s steel slide is Melonite treated, weighing in at 29.7 oz. At 7.95″ snout to tail, the SW1911Sc’s an easy choice for concealed carry."
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:47 PM
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Default He gave a good answer....

...but you needed an explanation more. Misunderstanding and that is all.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:53 PM
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S&W answered your question. You didn't understand it.

Anodizing can be in various colors (blue, red, green, black, etc.) and is a protective finish. It is thin and can be easily scratched. It adds no strength to anything.
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Old 08-06-2018, 10:05 PM
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...and that's why sometimes it's just better to pick up the phone. I usually get better & clearer info from a conversation that way,
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Old 08-06-2018, 10:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Notary View Post
I realize that the frame has Scandium added for extra strength. Does S&W still anodize the frame in spite of the extra strength Scandium?
Their response was correct, though they chose not to educate you on the misconception inherent in your statement.


Your not the first person posting on this forum who was disappointed in the ability of anodized Scandium to maintain it's cosmetic appearance. They seem to require special attention and delicate handling to stay looking new.
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Old 08-06-2018, 11:28 PM
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I called them last week about refinishing a model 39, and they told me they don't do anodizing any more..........??
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Old 08-07-2018, 12:27 AM
John Fugate John Fugate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Notary View Post

Smith&Wesson values its customers and we are happy to have served you today. Please do not hesitate to contact us should you require further assistance.

Regards, Richard
To the OP, with all due respect.
Whatever you missed in Richard's concise answers to your vague questions, has ultimately been explain once again this time even in further detail. See the caption above for an more in depth explanation to your questions .

Regards,

Last edited by John Fugate; 08-07-2018 at 12:28 AM.
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Old 08-07-2018, 12:48 AM
GerSan69 GerSan69 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogerwnuss View Post
I called them last week about refinishing a model 39, and they told me they don't do anodizing any more..........??
S&W may not, but it's available from some refinishers. Here's what a quick google for "firearms anodizing" returned:
firearms anodizing - Google Search
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Old 08-07-2018, 07:15 AM
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A question was presented to S&W and they answered the question.

Anodizing does not add strength. Anodizing is a process in which, at least in firearms, adds color, corrosion protection, and surface hardness to aluminum. The anodizing does add a tiny amount of thickness to the surface of the aluminum and also slightly penetrates the surface.

Re-anodizing can sometimes be performed, but the original anodized layer must first be removed. The removal of this layer may enlarge the holes in the receiver to the point that they will be slightly oversized even after re-anodizing.

At least that is my understanding of the process.
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Old 08-07-2018, 07:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rwsmith View Post
I have a scandium 5943 third gen. It's hefty enough to make it easy to shoot but much lighter than steel.:
When did S & W make 5943s with Scandium frames?

I have two and never was there any mention of the frame(s) containing Scandium.

Was this a particular production run or are they all supposedly Scandium?
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Old 08-07-2018, 07:46 AM
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Good question, as I thought only 4040PDs were scandium.
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Old 08-07-2018, 09:00 AM
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Like others have said, I think they answered the question fully. Why would they give any more details about anodizing? What more could you want to know? If they use a proprietary method in-house or send it out for the finish, they are not obligated to divulge that information. And seriously, they don’t care if you buy the gun, keep the gun or sell the gun...
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Old 08-07-2018, 09:15 AM
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I recall reading years ago that S&W was alloying the aluminum they used in frames with 7% scandium, and that scandium came from Russia. Scandium alloy frames still stretch, shimmy, wiggle, and shake, but it makes the frame return to its original dimensions much better after firing a scandium alloy gun versus one that's not. An aluminum frame will get "sloppier" dimension wise compared to a steel frame with the same number of rounds. A scandium alloy will cut down on the slop and the gun will stay tighter longer.

Anodizing hardens the surface of aluminum and makes it more corrosion resistant. It also makes the surface non-conductive.

Bill

Last edited by CA Escapee; 08-07-2018 at 09:18 AM.
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