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Old 08-23-2018, 07:01 PM
mikeb33 mikeb33 is offline
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Default 422 Obsolete?

New to the forums here, came for some help.
I bought my 422 back in the late 80's and have shot it sporadically over the years. There's been 10 year gaps where it just sat in the case, but when I finally get it out, I remember how much I like it.
Earlier this summer I took it to the range and it refused to feed a round. I unloaded the magazine, reloaded, tried different ammo, just nothing happens when rack the slide. I contacted S&W and they made a repair ticket and sent me a Fed Ex label. I sent it in and 5 weeks later it comes back with a note stating: "Your handgun does not require any service for the reason indicated below". There was many boxes unchecked, but at the bottom under "other" it simply said in handwriting "OBS Model".

I emailed back asking what this meant, was it in fact repaired, is it safe to fire, etc. The response is: "OBS model indicates that this is an older firearm that is obsolete and we no longer manufacture."
So I'm pretty sure I knew they didn't make this one any more, the wasn't my question. Was it repaired? Well I got out a box of .22lr and answered my own question. It wasn't. Still won't feed a round into the chamber.

They knew it was a 422 when I sent it in? Why did they waste my time? Can anybody explain this to me or have advice to get it repaired? I would hate to scrap it.
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Old 08-23-2018, 07:25 PM
GeoJelly GeoJelly is offline
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Sounds like, maybe, a bad magazine. Did you try new or different magazine? I think SW M41 megs will also work. I have two 622’s, a four inch and a six. They both have butter-smooth feeding. Maybe you could also dis-assemble and look at the breech face – check to see if something is under the extractor or the extractor is broken maybe. The head/rim of the .22 round has to slide up underneath the extractor in the feeding process. Hope you get it fixed - I love both of mine.

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Old 08-23-2018, 07:47 PM
Rick H. Rick H. is offline
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I have to agree with Geojelly. Try a known good magazine and see if it helps cure the problem. also give the gun a good cleaning and look for any buildup of crud on the face of the bolt or barrel and clean and lube as you should. There is one other thing I would do as a matter of course and that is to replace the recoil spring asap. I can't tell you how many times simply replacing the recoil spring makes all sorts of problems disappear. Springs, especially recoil springs must be replaced on a regular basis regardless of rounds fired. Now if you shoot a lot they should be replaced sooner, but a recoil spring will loose power just sitting assembled in an unused handgun and is probably the most neglected part of many handguns. It may be OCD on my part, but I disassemble and remove the recoil springs on my semi-autos if I don't intend on using them for long periods of time. I'll bet it helps your situation if you install a new recoil spring.


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Old 08-23-2018, 08:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeb33 View Post
New to the forums here, came for some help.
I bought my 422 back in the late 80's and have shot it sporadically over the years. There's been 10 year gaps where it just sat in the case, but when I finally get it out, I remember how much I like it.
Earlier this summer I took it to the range and it refused to feed a round. I unloaded the magazine, reloaded, tried different ammo, just nothing happens when rack the slide. I contacted S&W and they made a repair ticket and sent me a Fed Ex label. I sent it in and 5 weeks later it comes back with a note stating: "Your handgun does not require any service for the reason indicated below". There was many boxes unchecked, but at the bottom under "other" it simply said in handwriting "OBS Model".

I emailed back asking what this meant, was it in fact repaired, is it safe to fire, etc. The response is: "OBS model indicates that this is an older firearm that is obsolete and we no longer manufacture."
So I'm pretty sure I knew they didn't make this one any more, the wasn't my question. Was it repaired? Well I got out a box of .22lr and answered my own question. It wasn't. Still won't feed a round into the chamber.

They knew it was a 422 when I sent it in? Why did they waste my time? Can anybody explain this to me or have advice to get it repaired? I would hate to scrap it.
How incredibly frustrating that must have been. Someone should tell the mothership that proper handguns generally don't go obsolete in 25 years. They should know that, but apparently they don't.

This past year, I bought two used but "as-new-in-box" Model 422 pistols, one very recently. I'm a fan for sure. But now I'll know enough not to expect anything from the mothership in terms of support. We're on our own with these guns (and with many others). It's the nature of the firearms business today, or at least it is with Smith & Wesson.
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Old 08-23-2018, 09:03 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Clean it first.

Let's define "refused to feed a round".

You load the first round, fire it, and subsequent rounds wont load?

If yes can you cycle through the mag manually?

If no is the mag seated fully?

Pretty unusual issue, but based on your usage pattern, and others who have had issues with similar usage patterns, I suspect your pistol needs a good cleaning.
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Old 08-23-2018, 09:07 PM
Sevens Sevens is offline
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Wait now, hold the phone. That is a crappy experience but from all we know about the "S&W lottery", it could be an isolated experience. I don't think it's fair to say for sure that S&W is going to reject any/all work on the 422/622/2206 period based on this (obviously awful) example.

Probably some turkey dropped the ball on this one.

Now me, because of how I am and how my mind works... I never would have contacted them in the first place because I believe that S&W of 2018 isn't some glorious, wonderful place loaded with craftsmen. I believe it's a low wage, low skill group of assemblers much like those that assemble display furniture.

But then, I'm crabby and don't much like almost any new guns from anywhere.

Almost just for the pure sport of it, I'd give the pistol to a close friend and have him call them for service and see if someone at S&W that has both a pulse and a heart can make it run again.

But honestly... if I really wanted it fixed, I'd consider learning about it and getting my hands dirty.
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Old 08-23-2018, 09:12 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sevens View Post
Wait now, hold the phone. That is a crappy experience but from all we know about the "S&W lottery", it could be an isolated experience. I don't think it's fair to say for sure that S&W is going to reject any/all work on the 422/622/2206 period based on this (obviously awful) example.

Probably some turkey dropped the ball on this one.

Now me, because of how I am and how my mind works... I never would have contacted them in the first place because I believe that S&W of 2018 isn't some glorious, wonderful place loaded with craftsmen. I believe it's a low wage, low skill group of assemblers much like those that assemble display furniture.

But then, I'm crabby and don't much like almost any new guns from anywhere.

Almost just for the pure sport of it, I'd give the pistol to a close friend and have him call them for service and see if someone at S&W that has both a pulse and a heart can make it run again.

But honestly... if I really wanted it fixed, I'd consider learning about it and getting my hands dirty.
The only reason I can see for sending it to S+W is for repair of a factory defect that they would cover. Beyond that there are MANY competent Gunsmiths who could have repaired the pistol in less time, and with less effort. IMO

I'm still betting a good cleaning will fix it though, would have thought S+W would have at least done that.

Last edited by shoot summ; 08-23-2018 at 09:13 PM.
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Old 08-23-2018, 09:49 PM
hogblue hogblue is offline
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Did it sit in storage with the magazine loaded. If so the spring probably took a set and is no longer serviceable. If it was left empty try cleaning the magazine and action also. Years of old oil turn to gunk and slow things down considerably. Try a new magazine as suggested. Model 41 magazines are what were used in them. I have a 6” 422 and enjoy it immensely. Don’t give up!
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Old 08-23-2018, 09:55 PM
Sevens Sevens is offline
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Well S&W needs to save money, they can't afford to service older guns. And why do they need to save money?

Well, it costs them a lot of money to ship guns two ways JUST so they can refuse to work on them!!!

That's the dumbest thing I'll hear today. If they really honestly are too inept to fix a 422... why didn't they just say that on the phone?! Why pay shipping two ways and take five weeks just to mail back a form saying "sorry that we are inept" ?!

Am I mad? Am I sad...?!
Both, really.
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Old 08-23-2018, 09:58 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Quote:
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If so the spring probably took a set and is no longer serviceable.
I'll just say that isn't the issue, not going to start an argument over whether it could in fact ever happen.

Of all of the likely things that could happen, that would be the lowest on the list, many things to do/check before blaming a mag spring.

Let's start with "does it cycle manually", that will determine which path to take.

Notice you are S.W MO, Tulsa here, pass through your parts regularly.
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Old 08-23-2018, 10:41 PM
spad124 spad124 is offline
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I’m not sure what you exactly mean by refusing to load a round, but were you able to load a round after it came back from S&W? If not, as a WAG, if you cleaned it after you last shot it 10 years ago could it be that you didn’t quite assembly it correctly? Maybe check YouTube for a refresher and on post cleaning assembly. I know that i shoot my M&P 22 pistol infrequently and like to refer to the instructions for disassembly.
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Old 08-23-2018, 11:33 PM
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The 422 is a fairly simple design and I can't image anything short
of damage to the frame or slide proper that couldn't be fixed
easily. Won't chamber a round? Would almost have to be a mag
problem. I would single load a cartridge and fire it. If this fires
and ejects then you know it's mag. Then I would strip the pistol
and give it a good cleaning. The one thing on them I have never
messed with because there was no reason to, was the barrel. I
suppose if barrel nut was loose and allowed it to move it could
cause problems. I've had several of them and they preformed well.
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Old 08-24-2018, 06:36 AM
mikeb33 mikeb33 is offline
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Thanks for the replies, it's nice to share my frustration.
When I say it won't load I mean I can put one or a full load of rounds in the magazine and insert it. I pull back the slide and nothing happens. No round goes into the chamber.
It wasn't 10 years since I last shot it, I just meant that it has been very seldom used over it's lifetime and it still looks new.
When I had the problem and S&W sent me a Fed Ex tag I didn't bother to try to fix it myself, but since it is beyond their capabilities I will disassemble and clean/oil this weekend. Also I'll try to insert a round into the chamber and fire it to see what happens to the next round. Thanks.
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Old 08-24-2018, 07:28 AM
M29since14 M29since14 is offline
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Thoroughly cleaning and a very light lube job might cure your problem. And there’s always a chance that when you disassemble you may find something obvious, like a broken recoil spring, or something like that. In any case, very poor customer service from S&W, that’s for sure. If you can’t figure it out, don’t scrap it. Take it to a competent gunsmith. I’d bet your 422 is easily repaired.

Did you try to lock the slide back, insert a loaded magazine, and then manually releasing the slide with the slide release lever?

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Old 08-24-2018, 08:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeb33 View Post
Thanks for the replies, it's nice to share my frustration.
When I say it won't load I mean I can put one or a full load of rounds in the magazine and insert it. I pull back the slide and nothing happens. No round goes into the chamber.
It wasn't 10 years since I last shot it, I just meant that it has been very seldom used over it's lifetime and it still looks new.
When I had the problem and S&W sent me a Fed Ex tag I didn't bother to try to fix it myself, but since it is beyond their capabilities I will disassemble and clean/oil this weekend. Also I'll try to insert a round into the chamber and fire it to see what happens to the next round. Thanks.
Not stripping a round off the mag manually is unusual.

No need to manually load a round and fire it just yet, it's not going to prove anything at this point.

Check that the mag is seating properly.

Check that barrel nut, hard to tell it's loose, but the barrel should be nearly flush with the nut when you look at it from the front.

Try a different mag.

Post up some pics with the slide locked back, of the mag, and the mag inserted with the slide locked back and a round loaded in the mag.
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Old 08-24-2018, 10:29 AM
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My guess would be that S&W has to maintain parts for anything they've made for so many years ( similar to other manufacturers ). Being that this was an 80's design and they haven't made them in quite a few years they may not be required by law anymore to maintain parts for them. Revolvers are different as they tend to use the same parts in as many models as they can so the parts may not be specifically for the model you want fixed, but a newer revolver uses the same part #.

While the gun itself may not be "obsolete" that is the term they use to describe guns that they no longer carry parts for.

They should have a list though of guns they no longer repair to save the money and hassle that you dealt with.
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Old 08-24-2018, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
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While the gun itself may not be "obsolete" that is the term they use to describe guns that they no longer carry parts for.

They should have a list though of guns they no longer repair to save the money and hassle that you dealt with.
Oh boy! Wouldn't that be something. A PR nightmare.

Hey folks, here is a list of all the guns we made that we no longer care about. Tough cookies for you folks who own them!
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Old 08-24-2018, 11:57 AM
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I had that same problem with my 422, the slide would just hang there. After a good cleaning it worked just fine.
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Old 08-24-2018, 02:00 PM
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The other question is what did you do to the pistol the last time before you stored it? We had a guy on here(I think) who had a stuck slide, pretty unusual, he finally discovered/disclosed he had used locktite on the sight screws after his last outing. Apparently he was a little too liberal with the locktite and it also locked the slide in place...
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Old 08-24-2018, 03:50 PM
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MikeB33 Welcome to the Forum and give it a real good cleaning. Even remove the grips as crud can build up under the extractor which may also cause problems like this. Buy a couple of new mags as well. It could well be the cause of this issue as well. They are a good model with many years of life left in it. It should outlive all of us put to-gether.
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Old 08-24-2018, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TTSH View Post
Oh boy! Wouldn't that be something. A PR nightmare.
Hey folks, here is a list of all the guns we made that we no longer care about. Tough cookies for you folks who own them!
Lesson is don't let your guns languish in a safe or sock drawer, wear them out shooting before times up!
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Old 08-24-2018, 04:29 PM
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In the sense that a 422 is no longer manufactured...yes it is obsolete.
In the sense that it is still very serviceable and shootable....no it is not.
Now, if it were chambered for a .30 caliber rimfire.....totally obsolete, but yours is in .22LR....not obsolete at all.

Randy
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Old 08-28-2018, 06:27 AM
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Lots of good advice in this thread OP, are you going to try any of it?
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Old 08-28-2018, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TTSH View Post
Oh boy! Wouldn't that be something. A PR nightmare.

Hey folks, here is a list of all the guns we made that we no longer care about. Tough cookies for you folks who own them!

Ruger has such a list on their website.
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Old 08-28-2018, 09:03 PM
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Ruger has such a list on their website.
Hopefully, there is a considerable difference between the discontinued models list and the "obsolete-so-we-no-longer-service-or-repair" list.

In fact, I know there is.
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Old 09-04-2018, 08:38 AM
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OP? What's the status of this??
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Old 09-04-2018, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
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OP? What's the status of this??
Sorry for the delay. I have a house in Wisconsin and all my cleaning stuff is up there. This last weekend I field stripped it and cleaned it well and lubed it up real good but to no avail.
Looking at some of the advice here, I do think the magazine is going in all the way, it won't come out without using the mag release button. The magazine seems ok, I can load it easily, and pup the rounds back out easily too. I may order a new one since I wouldn't mind having another.
When I cleaned it I did not take the handles off like recommended here, so I could still do that. Beyond that I guess I need to find a local gunsmith?
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Old 09-05-2018, 06:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeb33 View Post
Sorry for the delay. I have a house in Wisconsin and all my cleaning stuff is up there. This last weekend I field stripped it and cleaned it well and lubed it up real good but to no avail.
Looking at some of the advice here, I do think the magazine is going in all the way, it won't come out without using the mag release button. The magazine seems ok, I can load it easily, and pup the rounds back out easily too. I may order a new one since I wouldn't mind having another.
When I cleaned it I did not take the handles off like recommended here, so I could still do that. Beyond that I guess I need to find a local gunsmith?
Can you post any pictures, or links to pics?
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Old 09-05-2018, 10:38 PM
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I suspect there's guck sticking under the grips against the Extractor which could seize it in position. Pull the grips and keep cleaning. You have 000 to lose.
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Old 09-06-2018, 08:01 PM
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I left the gun in Wisconsin so I can't check until the weekend.
My contact at S&W replied by email that even though it is "obsolete", they had me send it in for a gunsmith evaluate and see if the parts are available.
Makes some sense but I would have felt a lot better if they had determined the failure and the part needed and communicated that with me, rather than a slip with "obs" written on it.
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Old 09-08-2018, 07:21 PM
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A little disassembly help if you need it:

422 / 622 / 2206 / 2213 / 2214 Disassembly - Reassembly Instructions
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Old 09-11-2018, 08:15 AM
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I took the handles off and cleaned some more but it didn't seem to help. I bought a new S&W magazine and it didn't help either. There is a gun repair place near where I am working today so I am going to bring it there.
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Old 09-11-2018, 09:20 AM
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Obsolete? Wow that makes me feel old. I just started to read this thread. I bought one of these before I left S&W. I never worked on these, they were made in Houlton Maine, so I think most of the parts were there and not in Springfield. I worked in outside repair just before I left and I only knew one guy at the time who would know enough about assembly and repair so I'm not sure they would have someone knowledgeable enough now. They are similar to the Model 61,
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Old 09-11-2018, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donk52 View Post
they were made in Houlton Maine, so I think most of the parts were there and not in Springfield

I have two 4.5” barrel, fixed sight, S&W 622 pistols. One is marked Houston, the other Springfield.
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Old 09-11-2018, 11:41 AM
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I left there 1989, I didn't realize they brought them to Springfield, anyone know what year?
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Old 09-11-2018, 01:08 PM
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I own a model 622, essentially a very similar pistol only I believe part of it is stainless steel. I use it every year to qualify. The course is 50 rounds. I have 10 magazines. It shoots great, and functions fine. I leave the magazines empty, and clean the gun and magazines well with a commercial gun cleaner. I then put them into the safe for another year. I carry another model S&W in a larger caliber. Check the gun and magazines after each each use. This pistol should work each time for many years to come, mine does.

Last edited by KSDeputy; 09-11-2018 at 01:09 PM.
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Old 09-11-2018, 10:29 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColbyBruce View Post
I have two 4.5” barrel, fixed sight, S&W 622 pistols. One is marked Houston, the other Springfield.
Based on my own research, and SN's of guns I own, and ones I've seen, I think the 422 started in Springfield, then moved to Houlton. The 422's from Houlton(for the most part) seem to have a better/nicer black finish on them.

I think 622's were the same from a start and move perspective.

It was the same for the 2206's too, my 2206TGT was Houlton, along with the 622VR's.

I have a 2214 from Springfield, and my 2213's are from Houlton.

So I would say it was later pistols that were Houlton. The SN range somewhat reflects it as the Uxx, while most of the SFD are Txx.
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Old 09-12-2018, 09:07 AM
donk52 donk52 is offline
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Maybe this should be a separate thread? Still eager to find out Mikeb33's solution to his problem is but...
I spent my first seven years fitting the Mod 52's and the next four years assembling mod 41's 645's and all the 9mm's. I don't recall the 422's being assembled at the Springfield plant before I left 1n 1989. I checked my 422 and found no markings on the gun or box that states where it is made?
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Old 09-12-2018, 09:14 AM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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Originally Posted by donk52 View Post
Maybe this should be a separate thread? Still eager to find out Mikeb33's solution to his problem is but...
I spent my first seven years fitting the Mod 52's and the next four years assembling mod 41's 645's and all the 9mm's. I don't recall the 422's being assembled at the Springfield plant before I left 1n 1989. I checked my 422 and found no markings on the gun or box that states where it is made?
For most of the guns it is on the right side, I've seen a few variations of that, but not on the 422.

Here is a random pic I snagged from a GB auction...
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422 Obsolete?-pix734812025-jpg  
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Old 09-12-2018, 06:37 PM
donk52 donk52 is offline
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Here is my gun and invoice, boy, at that price I should have bought a dozen! does anyone have a specific date as to when they were made/brought to Springfield? I know mine was from Houlton, the one with the oil, ammo and targets in the box, although it doesn't say so anywhere on the gun box or invoice. If they were made in Springfield at that time, I would have been building them..



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Old 09-12-2018, 06:57 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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I guess I just assumed since it says Springfield, MA on the side that was where it was manufactured.

Did S+W move their headquarters to Houlton at some point?
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Old 09-12-2018, 07:51 PM
donk52 donk52 is offline
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That "Marcas Registradas" is on most S&W's, even revolvers. I think that just notes that Smith & Wesson is based in Springfield.
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Old 09-12-2018, 10:10 PM
shoot summ shoot summ is offline
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What does it mean when they have Houlton, Maine on it then? Was S+W based there?
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