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Old 10-07-2018, 12:01 AM
antilamr antilamr is online now
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I was reading a post by mrcvs on the Antique forum:
partial quote:
"How do I state this emphatically? There is little to no upside to grey guns, guns with patina, guns without condition, etc & etc, unless extremely rare or extraordinary provenance. And how can there be? You are lucky if the under 40 set even wants to pick up a gun, and when they do, it is unusual that the interest is anything other than "black guns". Very few younger folks show interest in this stuff--walk around an antique firearms show and note all the grey hair!"
Here's the link for full context;
Smith and Wesson New Model #3
It struck a nerve that has been bothering me for a while now.
Is the younger generation only interested in plastic fantastic's?

Are most of the S&W semi auto all metal fans in the over 50's crowd?

Disclaimer, I'm over 60 and just now at a stage in life where I'm able to get back into appreciating firearms. Most of my "collection" was from 30+ years ago and I'm just now starting to add to it. Just wondering if I'm part of a dying breed and only able to relate to those of the ex LEO or military types of similar age as me. I guess I'm concerned that there's not going to be many of us left to appreciate the art and workmanship of these fine pistols.
Anyone out there in the under 50 crowd?
Any insight on the future of my obsession would be appreciated.
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Old 10-07-2018, 12:19 AM
Sevens Sevens is offline
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I'd say it is possible to actually notice such a "trend" but not on any large scale. It seems to me that by the time is has "trended" that far gone... we'll be either too old to care, or we'll be gone.

That's really just my longer answer for "yeah, this isn't something that I'm worried about."

I will say one specific place where I have noticed such a trend -- PPC revolvers. As these are all non-original guns, collectors and those who invest or speculate in guns almost completely ignore these. And what I see is that the folks who actually competed with PPC guns are either finally clearing out their life's collection or perhaps sadly... their survivors are doing that work.

PPC guns don't seem to get justly appreciated in today's market, and that's merely one reason that I'm ALWAYS on the lookout for them. They are fantastic, almost always have a ton of use and finish loss, and they sell for cheap and shoot like champions.

Maybe ^^^ that is what we have to look forward to, rather than worrying what "those darn kids" like or appreciate.

I'm 46, for the record. Watching the cops shoot PPC every Saturday morning at my Sportsman's Club was my every Saturday from 88-90. And then we shot after that, usually til 6 or 7pm, depending on the season.
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Old 10-07-2018, 12:20 AM
reddog81 reddog81 is offline
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I'm under 40 and not really interested in S&W semi autos. I'm more interested in the 100 year old or older revolvers. My last couple of S&W purchases have been some of the newer models such as the 929 and .460 XVR, and have been pleasantly surprised given the complaints about the new guns. The only S&W semi I own is a 39-2. I'd be interested in a 1006 but not many other S&W semi-autos interest me.
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Old 10-07-2018, 12:23 AM
viney266 viney266 is offline
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Some of it may be price as well. I know I didn't have the extra cash till my mid 30's for any guns other than what I needed to hunt. Our "hobby" has not gotten any cheaper.

I fear the high cost of ammo may do more damage than any other single factor.
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Old 10-07-2018, 12:35 AM
antilamr antilamr is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddog81 View Post
I'm under 40 and not really interested in S&W semi autos. The only S&W semi I own is a 39-2. I'd be interested in a 1006 but not many other S&W semi-autos interest me.
Is it just S&W semi autos your not interested in or all autos in general? Trying to get a feel for the younger crowd(never thought I'd be calling a under 40 year old the younger crowd!).
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Old 10-07-2018, 01:00 AM
Krogen Krogen is offline
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My tastes in firearms and shooting sports have varied all over the map since I was a kid. In my 20's I had no use for kids' 22 LR rifles and pistol. Now I do. I shoot classic Bullseye. One handed. Yeah, I know I was given two hands, but it's a tradition doncha know! Tried plastic 40 cal pistols; 2 of 'em. Don't like them very much, but I'm not selling either. I may get around to it someday. One of these days, I may join up with the PPC guys at the club. Some call it a dying discipline, but I think it's fun to hang around with the old cops and revolvers.

So yeah, we're part of a dying breed. It's ok. Do what you enjoy. Shoot, black powder and archery were supposed to be replaced by cartridge firearms. That hasn't happened.

It's all good fun. I might even try 3-gun one of these days. That is, if this 60+ flabby body can still run. It can be shuffle and gun for people like me! I guarrantee I'll have fun trying. I wouldn't be stunned to see todays kids eventually get an interest in our "antiques."
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Old 10-07-2018, 07:40 AM
kbm6893 kbm6893 is offline
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I went shooting with some friends who brought their high school age kids with them. I took out the AR and the kids went right for it. They fired a mag or two and then asked what else I had. Out came the M1 Garand. BOING!!! Eyes nearly popped out of their heads. Probably from Call of Duty, but who cares? Let them shoot two clips each. PING!! Grins ear to ear. Their dads have ARís so theyíve shot them before. But now my friends are being hammered at by their sons to get M1ís. I also let them shoot a few revolvers. They really liked them.

Plastic guns are cheap. They hold lots of ammo. Itís hard to justify spending $600 for a metal high cap 9MM when they can buy a plastic one for $200 less. But I have yet to see one person who has handled a classic firearm not be impressed by them over a plastic gun.
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Old 10-07-2018, 08:32 AM
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Short answer, no one knows.
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:02 AM
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IMHO; What part of the USA you live in, determines how you look at all firearms in general. These young people have NO concept of HISTORY,or what the 2nd Ad. is. They can tell you all models of a I phone but they look at a firearm and ???. We are in DEEP DO DO with the N.E., Calf., Washington, Oregon,and big city college educated left leaning young adults.Hold on tight because it is going to be ONE HELL OF A RIDE.!!!!
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:24 AM
Ackley1952 Ackley1952 is offline
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Someday I'll hear the words "they just don't make polymer like they used to"
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:24 AM
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I'm only 30 and I can say that I'm very much interested in older guns. Milsurp and muzzle loaders and the like. My most desired purchase actually is a authentic 1858 Remington New Army because of the Clint Eastwood movies I would watch with my father as a kid.

The problem for the younger people like me that DO have this interest is simple : Money. The cost of everything has risen significantly since you have gotten into the hobby, especially firearms. When the choice comes between my electric bill and a new firearm, the choice is simple.
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:37 AM
antilamr antilamr is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skoll View Post
The problem for the younger people like me that DO have this interest is simple : Money. The cost of everything has risen significantly since you have gotten into the hobby, especially firearms. When the choice comes between my electric bill and a new firearm, the choice is simple.
Now I can relate to that!! That's why I took a 30+ year break from the "hobby". 3 kids, wife, mortgage, car payments, college payments etc... all while living in costly So. Ca. Not everyone is fortunate enough to have a silver spoon in their mouth while coming into this world.(poor me)
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:42 AM
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I think by sheer numbers, most plastic guns being sold are for home/carry protection, a larger group. The older steel guns are being bought by collectors, a smaller group.

There will always be gun collecting even by the young ones today. Don't think the plastic guns will be much as collectors. Steel guns will be the collectible ones, at least until they come out with the neutron laser blaster.

As with anything collectible (guns, toys, doorstops, etc.) condition is everything. So I think for the collectors that take a beating from the guns are made to shoot crowd will have the last laugh .
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:48 AM
antilamr antilamr is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auburn4 View Post
IMHO; What part of the USA you live in, determines how you look at all firearms in general. These young people have NO concept of HISTORY,or what the 2nd Ad. is. They can tell you all models of a I phone but they look at a firearm and ???. We are in DEEP DO DO with the N.E., Calf., Washington, Oregon,and big city college educated left leaning young adults.Hold on tight because it is going to be ONE HELL OF A RIDE.!!!!
I think I'll have to agree with you on this. In my experience living in SO CA the majority of persons involved with firearms of any type are the "salt of the earth" types. Unfortunately, they've been fleeing CA for the last 20+ years for red states.
It's the chicken or the egg syndrome, did the state get farther left due to all the "normal" folks leaving or did all of them leave because it turned far left!? (I know high taxes, loss of jobs etc also pushed them out)
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:49 AM
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I had no interest (read money) in older guns until I was in my 50s.The ones I owned were just tools for hunting and plinking.
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Old 10-07-2018, 11:08 AM
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Short answer to OP, probably. Will there always be some like me who
will buy only steel/metal guns? Answer again, probably.
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Old 10-07-2018, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antilamr View Post
Is the younger generation only interested in plastic fantastics?
Handgun-wise, for the most part it sure seems that way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by antilamr View Post
Are most of the S&W semi auto all metal fans in the over 50's crowd?
Well I sure am! Hell, I can't even remember my 50's anymore!
Quote:
Originally Posted by antilamr View Post
Disclaimer, I'm over 60 and just now at a stage in life where I'm able to get back into appreciating firearms. Most of my "collection" was from 30+ years ago and I'm just now starting to add to it. Just wondering if I'm part of a dying breed and only able to relate to those of the ex LEO or military types of similar age as me. I guess I'm concerned that there's not going to be many of us left to appreciate the art and workmanship of these fine pistols.
Like you, I originally got into collecting in my mid-20's after college, my first job and after I bought my first house, thus qualifying without any problem for a MA License-to-Carry. But that first interval only lasted about 7 years before the harsh reality of divorce and child support set in. It wasn't until 2008 (25 years later) that I was able to afford to buy a firearm once again. Then in 2013, I bought my first new handgun in 30 years. I've been trying to make up for lost time ever since.
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Anyone out there in the under 50 crowd? Any insight on the future of my obsession would be appreciated.
I've stopped worrying about it. I went through my own plastics phase a while back and am now in the process of dumping all those mistakes. But I'm also pretty much done with S&W semi-auto collecting for now (the safes just won't hold any more) and have refocused principally on premium blued "pre-IL" S&W revolvers for the foreseeable future. I don't expect to buy a ton of them, but it's where my interest is for the time being.

Am I worried about slumping values for vintage all-metal S&W handguns long-term? Not at all. If values ever start to trend downward, I'll just buy even more!
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Old 10-07-2018, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antilamr View Post
Is it just S&W semi autos your not interested in or all autos in general? Trying to get a feel for the younger crowd(never thought I'd be calling a under 40 year old the younger crowd!).
S&W semi's don't really interest me at all. I've got half a dozen 1911's, half a dozen random 9mm's, a couple of 100 year old Colt auto-loaders, and a small mix of other semi's. Nothing S&W makes today or in the recent past interest me at all. Based upon reviews I've read and personal tastes there is always a better option than the comparable S&W semi-auto.

For revolvers S&W is right at the front of the pack and I wouldn't have a problem recommending one to anyone. For pistols the competition is more fierce. S&W probably makes some decent guns for the entry level shooter on a budget, but I guess that's just not a market I'm interested in.
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Old 10-07-2018, 01:31 PM
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I'm 48.
I've always loved antique firearms, because that's what my dad collected.
I cut my teeth on DA revolvers.
One of my favorite rifles is the SMLE. When my friends were buying ARs and AKs, I was buying #4Mk2 SMLEs and M38 Swedish Mausers.
I only use plastic guns for SD/HD because I won't cry if cheap plastic **** sits in an evidence locker for a month of Sundays.
If my metal framed guns got all scratched/rusted up in an evidence locker, I'd be a bit heartbroken.

I was 28 before I bought my first cheap plastic gun.
I'm not a bandwagon kind of guy. I like what I like, and it usually goes against the flow.
I still don't own a Glock, and don't plan on changing that.
I carry an early 1970s Model 36 more often than any other gun.

Guess I'm just a dinosaur.
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Old 10-07-2018, 01:38 PM
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Been hearing it for years...along the same lines, still waiting for those cheap Colt Saa’s & antique ‘92’s to start making themselves available.

I don’t think 3rd gens will appreciate as much as antiques & novelties, but they ain’t gonna get any cheaper.

Here’s a thought, maybe you don’t see the younger crowd looking at steel guns because they do most of their shopping online; gunbroker & such?
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Old 10-07-2018, 01:39 PM
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MY GUNS WERE NOT OLD WHEN I BOUGHT THEM.........NEITHER WAS I.



now the guns are old.....and so am i.
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Old 10-07-2018, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddog81 View Post
S&W semi's don't really interest me at all. I've got half a dozen 1911's, half a dozen random 9mm's, a couple of 100 year old Colt auto-loaders, and a small mix of other semi's. Nothing S&W makes today or in the recent past interest me at all. Based upon reviews I've read and personal tastes there is always a better option than the comparable S&W semi-auto.

For revolvers S&W is right at the front of the pack and I wouldn't have a problem recommending one to anyone. For pistols the competition is more fierce. S&W probably makes some decent guns for the entry level shooter on a budget, but I guess that's just not a market I'm interested in.
The 3rd Gen S&W autos are some of the most reliable autopistols ever made.
So, I have to strongly disagree with you about there being better all metal choices available, because there really aren't.
There are more popular choices available.
There are more expensive choices available.
But, you will not find the combination of design/build quality, and reliability with a wide variety of ammo for anywhere near the current price of a 3rd Gen Smith.
I am happy to agree to disagree with you, because you're one less person I have to compete with, when it comes to buying classic S&W autos.
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Old 10-07-2018, 01:43 PM
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I don't think there's one answer. We'll just wait (we have no choice on that unless you want to end things early) and we'll see.

Things change sometimes rapidly.

The majority of people who live in Ca., Or, N.H. etc. are working class folks and it's in our interests to defend the 2nd and the Bill of Rights against the clamoring of the liberal left which holds a good deal of power. That bill will come due.

While the economy is picking up wages and benefits remain very low. The choice between a $1,500 collectible piece or pay your rent is a real one. Many, many folks work 2 jobs or more.

Reports indicate that more people are actively involved in the shooting sports than used to be. There are more sports as well today. Some like three gun take real money to be involved in. Others not.

There is a class divide here as well. I meet a good number of techies who make close to two hundred grand a year who like to shoot and buy high end gear. Most of what they know they learn from the internet. Some have gone into collecting. I also know a good many younger shooters who don't have, at present the financial resources. My nephew owns three guns and has for years.

There is no more panic buying. Which is good but has effected the industry.

So long as guns are made and used there will be folks who collect and shoot them.

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Old 10-07-2018, 02:03 PM
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I think it comes down to a few things.Many who have little to no experience with guns tend to follow advice from internet forums and shop owners.Most won't find a forum like this one right off the bat, so they are in a general firearms forum. Most of the advice I see given in those types of forums is semi autos are better because you have more firepower. Also prevalent is that whatever police and military are using tends to be a better seller.

After some time in the hobby they gain more experience and hopefully get a chance to shoot more guns from friends/ranges.They learn quality over quantity is better and are more discerning with their money.
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Old 10-07-2018, 02:05 PM
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Old guys tend to like to collect old things, or from a certain time period that they deem to be superior usually because it is associated with their youth or a particularly happy time in their life. There will always be people interested in history and historical firearms in general. I see a lot of folks that are collecting Glocks and there's nothing better or worse about collecting them than any other firearm IMO. Some of the first models command pretty breathtaking prices upwards of $20,000. Here's a special model that went for $14,500 https://www.gunbroker.com/Item/769342281
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Old 10-07-2018, 02:47 PM
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I thought we were, till I started working in a local gun shop. The new 1st time shooters all buy the plastic striker fired guns. And handguns like that in the below $600 range make up the bulk - probably 65% - of our handgun sales. But the other 35% of our handun sales are hammer fired, metal frames Sigs, CZs, Berettas and high end 1911s.

Since we struck a deal with CZ and are getting more of their product, CZ sales are on an uptick. They are seriously nice guns and fairly priced. Especially for what you get for your money.

And I see quite a few folks who entered the shooting world recently, who decide that they want to purchase a TDA or DAO metal framed hammer fired gun because they tried one a friend or relative let them shoot and love the better trigger and lesser recoil of a heavier gun.

So yeah, we may be dinosaurs. And the meteor may be coming. And our once favored manufacturer may be catering to mob rule and care less what we want to see and buy.

But there is still TDA hammer fired metal framed guns being made by other manufacturers. And they are selling well. Thats a good thing, for all of us. Not only is the Fat Lady not singing yet, I dont think she is even in the building. Regards 18DAI
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Old 10-07-2018, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
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I was 28 before I bought my first cheap plastic gun.
I still don't own a Glock, and don't plan on changing that.
I got ya beat, but only half beat!
I was 36 when I bought my first cheap plastic gun.

Half beat because it was a Glock.
I carried it for 7 or 8 years, it was a phenomenal tool for the job and it still runs and hits like a champ when ask it to, even though I don't carry it anymore. In my defense, it's truly the only Glock I ever wanted and though I did move a couple in and then out again due to circumstances, it's the only one I wanted and enjoyed and kept.

And these days, I own just four pieces of tupperware. They are useful, but they don't have a place in my heart like the handguns that I love.
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Old 10-07-2018, 03:15 PM
Sevens Sevens is offline
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Old guys tend to like to collect old things, or from a certain time period that they deem to be superior usually because it is associated with their youth or a particularly happy time in their life.
Seriously good point ^^

I can tell you that in Smith & Wesson revolvers, the ones made from 1985 to 1995 are the ones that I am most attracted to. I'm not dumb enough to even suggest that S&W revolvers from '85 to '95 are the best they made because that isn't the truth, but these are guns from my formative years and dang near any S&W revolver from that era specifically is one I am drawn to. (Unless it's a J-frame, then YUCK, haha...) To me, those revolvers look right, they SOUND right when you work the action, they have a familiarity that some others don't replicate and even that one-piece cardboard box is, in my pea brain, the RIGHT box.

Those particular guns take me back to a day when I had enough money to buy a gun magazine from the drug store and stare at all of those and actually buy none of those. (well, not totally true, I did manage to sock away $315 from paper route money and my first "Real" job to fund my 6-inch 686-3.)
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Old 10-07-2018, 03:45 PM
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I thought we were, till I started working in a local gun shop. The new 1st time shooters all buy the plastic striker fired guns. And handguns like that in the below $600 range make up the bulk - probably 65% - of our handgun sales. But the other 35% of our handun sales are hammer fired, metal frames Sigs, CZs, Berettas and high end 1911s.
.......
But there is still TDA hammer fired metal framed guns being made by other manufacturers. And they are selling well. Thats a good thing, for all of us. Not only is the Fat Lady not singing yet, I dont think she is even in the building. Regards 18DAI
Good to hear. BTW, I LOVE your signature!
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Old 10-07-2018, 03:53 PM
antilamr antilamr is online now
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I got ya beat, but only half beat!
I was 36 when I bought my first cheap plastic gun.

Half beat because it was a Glock.

And these days, I own just four pieces of tupperware. They are useful, but they don't have a place in my heart like the handguns that I love.
Got you both beat. Just bought my first plastic piece 2 months ago. A Shield 9mm. Only reason was due to it being less than half price with all the extras it came with as well as only having 250 down the pipe. Haven't shot it yet. Probably try and trade it off for another 3rd gen or 1911. 1911's also have a soft spot in my heart.
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Old 10-07-2018, 03:59 PM
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Seriously good point ^^

I can tell you that in Smith & Wesson revolvers, the ones made from 1985 to 1995 are the ones that I am most attracted to. I'm not dumb enough to even suggest that S&W revolvers from '85 to '95 are the best they made because that isn't the truth, but these are guns from my formative years and dang near any S&W revolver from that era specifically is one I am drawn to. (Unless it's a J-frame, then YUCK, haha...) To me, those revolvers look right, they SOUND right when you work the action, they have a familiarity that some others don't replicate and even that one-piece cardboard box is, in my pea brain, the RIGHT box.

Those particular guns take me back to a day when I had enough money to buy a gun magazine from the drug store and stare at all of those and actually buy none of those. (well, not totally true, I did manage to sock away $315 from paper route money and my first "Real" job to fund my 6-inch 686-3.)
Almost all the guns I collected from years ago are all S&W revolvers still new, un-fired in original boxes. Only 2 are not, a PPK and a 1911.
BTW, my first real job was having 2 paper routes (one AM and one PM route) also. Guess it shows our age.
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Old 10-07-2018, 04:07 PM
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Met a young man in his 20s who started working at a local gunatorium just recently. He has his eyes out for third gen S&W semis. Anything in the 39 series of guns gets him going. I don't see as many of those around as I used to. Folks have been buying them up.

tipoc
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Old 10-07-2018, 04:55 PM
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I was reading a post by mrcvs on the Antique forum:
partial quote:
"How do I state this emphatically? There is little to no upside to grey guns, guns with patina, guns without condition, etc & etc, unless extremely rare or extraordinary provenance. And how can there be? You are lucky if the under 40 set even wants to pick up a gun, and when they do, it is unusual that the interest is anything other than "black guns". Very few younger folks show interest in this stuff--walk around an antique firearms show and note all the grey hair!"
Here's the link for full context;
Smith and Wesson New Model #3
It struck a nerve that has been bothering me for a while now.
Is the younger generation only interested in plastic fantastic's?

Are most of the S&W semi auto all metal fans in the over 50's crowd?

Disclaimer, I'm over 60 and just now at a stage in life where I'm able to get back into appreciating firearms. Most of my "collection" was from 30+ years ago and I'm just now starting to add to it. Just wondering if I'm part of a dying breed and only able to relate to those of the ex LEO or military types of similar age as me. I guess I'm concerned that there's not going to be many of us left to appreciate the art and workmanship of these fine pistols.
Anyone out there in the under 50 crowd?
Any insight on the future of my obsession would be appreciated.
I'M OLDER THAN YOU BY LEAST A DECADE, I WOULD GUESS......

MOST OF THE YOUNG PEOPLE THAT I SEE AT THE RANGE ARE SHOOTING HI-CAP, 9MM, TUPPERWARE. THIER AREA OF THE RANGE IS LITTERED WITH BRASS, AND THEIR TARGETS ARE COVERED WITH HOLES FROM EDGE TO EDGE......

EVERY NOW AND THEN---ATTRACTED BY THE BOOMING REPORT OF MY BIG BORE REVOLVER, AND MY TARGET BEING ROLLED IN WITH ONE RAGGED HOLE IN THE BLACK---ONE OR TWO OF THEM MAY WANDER DOWN TO MY END OF THE RANGE, TO SAY HELLO TO THIS OL' GEEZER, AND TO LOOK WITH WONDER AT WHAT I AM SHOOTING......

YES, WE ARE A DYING BREED ! ! !
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Old 10-07-2018, 05:19 PM
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I also as is the case with others currently posting live and collect in California. I rely heavily on my COE and CR to stay on top on the game. Not going into the political aspects of how we collect out here since the end result will be a thread slide.
Are we a dying breed? I don't believe this is the case.
Speaking as a salesperson you have to know your customer and you have to see the market as a whole. I watched the Rock Island Auction a few weeks ago. There is definitely no shortage of people spending money when you see a Winchester hit over a million dollar hammer. All the guns I wanted during this auction went double to four times what I would have paid short of a nickel 1891. The Smith hit at 30% more than I wanted to spend at the high-end. Then again it is nickel and my first in this finish so I am not complaining - glad to have it.
Firearms of various types fall in and out of favor. If you’re into flintlock and wheel locks there is probably no better time to buy then now. Me? I don’t buy to make money. Then again, I do have to make smart decisions. My choices on new add-ons today are about enhancing my collection – not always about the gun as a standalone item. No one wants to throw their money away in the garbage can. I preface my next statement by saying I have never sold a gun. There is definitely one truism – it is easier to sell a very special gun at 5k than three average guns at $1,700.
Recently I have been deep into antiques. This guns are interesting, an added learning experience and for the most part reasonably priced for very special things. I don’t care if I make money in the long run and at the same time it isn’t costing me the farm. Then there are those that I cannot pass. In a few minutes I will post in a new thread as a great example of how too. As a general rule, I buy at wholesale prices with a few exceptions. I’m not going into how I do this (not relevant to this thread), but let’s just say there is a strategy.
Buy because you love something and regardless of the value if it brings you pleasure even if we are in a dying field of interest. Buy smart if want to build a collection. Building a collection can start with a few hundred dollars and two guns. If you study your area of interest and buy smart, a few hundred dollars can turn into a few thousand and four fine firearms in a short period of time if you are a true collector.
Antilamr – I am turning 60 next year and I am a very active collector. I strongly believe there are many people that think the way I do hence the reason for my long post. I see and talk with them, there are those that watch and learn from others. If I am correct collecting fine firearms is not a dying breed. The hard part just ask the SWCA is bringing in new blood. In order to do this you and I have to mentor and allow the newbies a home and do so with open arms. We have to invite them in not alienate them. I go to the shows and communicate with a network of collectors and dealers all the time. I can say with great confidence have no fear because there are some very smart young people out there who are serious about collecting firearms and they are not all plastic guns. We just have to treat them kindly and given them direction. Thanks for the post…

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Old 10-07-2018, 05:58 PM
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I can say with great confidence have no fear because there are some very smart young people out there who are serious about collecting firearms and they are not all plastic guns. We just have to treat them kindly and given them direction. Thanks for the postÖ
Hear hear! ^^ Good man!

My Dad passed away when I was 15 and he'd been sick for years and never got around to teaching me to shoot. So when I jumped in to this world of guns and shooting, I went HARD at age 15 and made up quickly for lost time. I was handloading 20 gauge shotgun before my 16th Birthday and metallic handgun ammo not long after.

And I got treated like dreck in gun stores, especially (and most memorably) the local gun store, which was my only local access to tools and components. I can assure anyone that it wasn't my attitude, it was my age. (If anyone's local area is Flint, Michigan then a friendly shout-out to GUNS GALORE in Fenton as the absolute kings of obnoxious in the late 1980's. They are better these days, and I contend it's because some of them kicked off.)

Often similar experiences at gun shows, though not always. It's what I remember every single time I hear crusty old guys on this forum complaining about younger shooters and their preferences today.

Younger guys are still buying guns and (hopefully) registered, active voters.

Crusty old guys need to retire the chip on their shoulder and their decades perfected sneer directed at the whipper snapper that is two lanes over at the range. If you read this and you wonder... it could be you.
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Old 10-07-2018, 06:25 PM
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Depends on the dying breed...

There are some under 40 hipster guys into vintage guns. I bought a 1960’s vintage Stetson off a younger guy I know who likes classic steel, but auto-pistols.

The under 40 crowd is the majority of the pipe hitters fighting the longest U.S. war to date. They went to war with criminally inadequate Beretta M9s, a 1960s design, and a 1950s-era designed, 1970-80s produced M-16s. Many of those claptrap black guns have been replaced in the last 17 years, but 60-70 year old designs are old. Gaston Glock’s brainchild is turning 40, old enough for grandkids.

Those kids rightfully look at a revolver that has minor improvements since the Colt Lightning and ask if 150-year old technology is what they want. A S&W 3rd Generation is mostly remake of a gun Hitler shot 80 years ago.

It is all about perspective.
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Old 10-07-2018, 09:16 PM
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I also as is the case with others currently posting live and collect in California. I rely heavily on my COE and CR to stay on top on the game. Not going into the political aspects of how we collect out here since the end result will be a thread slide.
Are we a dying breed? I don't believe this is the case.
Speaking as a salesperson you have to know your customer and you have to see the market as a whole. I watched the Rock Island Auction a few weeks ago. There is definitely no shortage of people spending money when you see a Winchester hit over a million dollar hammer. All the guns I wanted during this auction went double to four times what I would have paid short of a nickel 1891. The Smith hit at 30% more than I wanted to spend at the high-end. Then again it is nickel and my first in this finish so I am not complaining - glad to have it.
Firearms of various types fall in and out of favor. If you’re into flintlock and wheel locks there is probably no better time to buy then now. Me? I don’t buy to make money. Then again, I do have to make smart decisions. My choices on new add-ons today are about enhancing my collection – not always about the gun as a standalone item. No one wants to throw their money away in the garbage can. I preface my next statement by saying I have never sold a gun. There is definitely one truism – it is easier to sell a very special gun at 5k than three average guns at $1,700.
Recently I have been deep into antiques. This guns are interesting, an added learning experience and for the most part reasonably priced for very special things. I don’t care if I make money in the long run and at the same time it isn’t costing me the farm. Then there are those that I cannot pass. In a few minutes I will post in a new thread as a great example of how too. As a general rule, I buy at wholesale prices with a few exceptions. I’m not going into how I do this (not relevant to this thread), but let’s just say there is a strategy.
Buy because you love something and regardless of the value if it brings you pleasure even if we are in a dying field of interest. Buy smart if want to build a collection. Building a collection can start with a few hundred dollars and two guns. If you study your area of interest and buy smart, a few hundred dollars can turn into a few thousand and four fine firearms in a short period of time if you are a true collector.
Antilamar – I am turning 60 next year and I am a very active collector. I strongly believe there are many people that think the way I do hence the reason for my long post. I see and talk with them, there are those that watch and learn from others. If I am correct collecting fine firearms is not a dying breed. The hard part just ask the SWCA is bringing in new blood. In order to do this you and I have to mentor and allow the newbies a home and do so with open arms. We have to invite them in not alienate them. I go to the shows and communicate with a network of collectors and dealers all the time. I can say with great confidence have no fear because there are some very smart young people out there who are serious about collecting firearms and they are not all plastic guns. We just have to treat them kindly and given them direction. Thanks for the post…
IN CAREFULLY READING YOUR INTERESTING POST, I REALIZE THAT WE COME FROM TWO DIFFERENT DISCIPLINES WITHIN THE FIREARMS HOBBY. YOU ARE PRIMARILY A COLLECTOR. I AM PRIMARILY A SHOOTER.......

I WOULD VENTURE TO SAY THAT THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE "NEW BLOOD" IN THE COLLECTING GAME IS 15-20 YEARS OLDER THAN MOST NEW SHOOTERS THAT I SEE AT THE RANGES. I DESCRIBED MY EXPERIENCES IN THE POST ABOVE YOURS.....

I MUST ADMIT TO NOTICING A FASCINATION WITH NAZI WEAPONRY AND MILITARIA AT SHOWS, ON THE PART OF YOUNG PEOPLE. THE ATTRACTION TO LUGERS, AND WALTHER P-38s SEEMS TO SPAN THE GENERATIONS......
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Old 10-07-2018, 09:29 PM
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I am deeply interested in antique muzzleloading rifles. They’re my favorite guns to shoot and I love reading about their history. I’m only 27, so please don’t lump all young people into the same boat.
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:04 PM
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You can look at the classifieds on this forum, and see what is selling. Most of the sales are from revolvers, the market for S&W autos seems to be way down, don't know why. It just seems like interest in steel autos, has crashed. Could be because of price compared to the black plastic guns available, Mikey
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:32 PM
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I'm in my early 40s and have been collecting S&Ws for about 6 years. The oldest is from 1917 and the newest is from 2015 (a Shield, not really a collectible). Highlights have been finding a nice 624 Lew Horton with combats and a pre-39. I've found some other rare ones but the prices were in the stratosphere.

The main cause to the "gray hair effect" I see is not age, but money. Many of my clients at work (I am an insurance agent and financial advisor) are retirement age. Most either barely get by, or through savvy planning have plenty of disposable income. These are the guys who show up and buy a $40,000 fishing boat with a check. Collecting interesting and old [fill in the blank] is not difficult for them. They simply seek them out and break open their wallet.

Younger guys like me, who don't have a paid off house, who do have kids who might want to go to college someday, we just can't do that. The 40-somethings I know with lots of disposable income are more into seeing the world, nice cars, and eating out. Hunting down rare guns, maybe some, but it's not very common. Which is good...if everyone wanted them they'd be a lot harder to get!
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Old 10-07-2018, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by reddog81 View Post
I'm under 40 and not really interested in S&W semi autos. I'm more interested in the 100 year old or older revolvers. My last couple of S&W purchases have been some of the newer models such as the 929 and .460 XVR, and have been pleasantly surprised given the complaints about the new guns. The only S&W semi I own is a 39-2. I'd be interested in a 1006 but not many other S&W semi-autos interest me.
You may like the 4506-it is "the same" gun as the 1006, but in 45 ACP.
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Old 10-07-2018, 11:42 PM
antilamr antilamr is online now
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Originally Posted by bigl1911 View Post
I rely heavily on my COE and CR to stay on top on the game.

Looking into COE and CR.

I donít buy to make money. Then again, I do have to make smart decisions.

Neither do I. I'm just limited in funds and am trying to make smart decisions also(but on a limited level).

In a few minutes I will post in a new thread as a great example of how too.

Saw your post.

As a general rule, I buy at wholesale prices with a few exceptions. Iím not going into how I do this (not relevant to this thread), but letís just say there is a strategy.

Hopefully we can have a discussion in the future.

Buy because you love something and regardless of the value if it brings you pleasure even if we are in a dying field of interest.

Trying to but have a wife who has other priorities.
You are obviously in a different situation than me and I salute you and your passion. I've learned a lot from you in just the last few hours of reading some of your older posts. I only hope I can be as effective as you are in your pursuit of collecting and preserving firearms.
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Old 10-07-2018, 11:45 PM
Racer X Racer X is online now
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Yes, I'm over 50, but my first firearm purchase in '93 was a S&W 439, when I was 28. So there is one data point. I now have added a 5906 and a 6906. But I grew up with an original 1858 Remington in the house, as it was carried in the Civil War by an ancestor. Same with a VERY LOOOOOONG percussion cap rifle from the early 1800s, also from an ancestor.
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Old 10-08-2018, 12:28 AM
MattyD380 MattyD380 is online now
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And I love older semi-autos. Third gens most certainly included:

Are We A Dying Breed?-image1-jpgAre We A Dying Breed?-image2-jpg

My gun collection is entirely DA/SA and the only polymer gun I own is a Beretta PX4 Compact (not pictured--great gun, though).

The only guns I've bought new in recent memory have been my Beretta 92 compact and the aforementioned PX4. Aside from that, I like older German Sigs and third gens. My main CCW right now is the P245, pictured. I find it to be the perfect size and profile for carry, and it shoots great. The 6904 pictured here actually saved my dog's life last year, when she was attacked by a German Shepherd and a rottweiler. Such an underrated pistol.

Not to seem like some kind of a jaded hipster... but... there isn't a whole out there (currently being made) that excites me. Glocks, M&Ps... meh. Sig, to me, isn't what it was. Beretta is one of the few that's actually putting out new guns I'm into.

I know it's subjective, but older guns feel more like weapons, made to professional standards; so much of what's out there today feels more like a consumer product. Next gun on my hit list is probably a Browning Hi Power... or maybe a Colt Double Eagle. Suffice to say, Gunbroker is basically my LGS.

I've only been a gun owner for the past 6 years or so, and I didn't grow up around guns. So I guess you could say my interest in firearms was born of movies and TV from the 80s and 90s... hence the predilection for DA/SA, I suppose. And, as it so happens, carrying decocked in DA gives me a lot of peace of mind. If I end up with a Hi Power, we'll have to see how I feel about carrying C&L.

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Old 10-08-2018, 09:46 AM
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Great and interesting thread. I too often wonder where our sport of shooting, collecting, and favor over different types of firearms is going. Thought I could stereotype all younger shooters as "synthetic hi-cap fans" but not always the case. I believe the lower cost of some polymer models has made the sport more affordable to younger people. As far as rifles at my club I notice quite a few older guys [60s] shooting guns like synthetic stocked and matte finish Ruger American and Savage 110s. For myself I am glad I held onto the long guns I bought 40 years back. Just as accurate and darn nice to look at too.
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Old 10-08-2018, 10:26 AM
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My 16yr old loves to shoot my revolvers, specially the 357s. He is also a big fan of lever guns, 1911s (he could name all of the parts when he was 9 yrs old), and surplus guns.I gave him a TULA M44 for Chrismas last year and two crates of steel core. He's 6'4" and weighs 220, so he's got no problem handling it.

I feel confident that I can pass my collection down to him and he will appreciate it.
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Old 10-08-2018, 10:48 AM
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You can insert about any hobby into the "are we dying" discussion. Vintage cars, tractors, model planes and trains, coin collecting, fishing, guns, etc. All the above and many more are always lamenting about the lack of youngsters involved with their particular hobby. Been hearing it for years.

I tend not to put much stock into it. I just try to expose the young ones close to me to the different things that I'm involved in and maybe one will stick, especially as they age. Guns were a big part of my teen and early twenties years. My Dad wasn't really big on them but he did gift me a couple when I was younger and would take me shooting and hunting occasionally. My Grandfather and Uncle were big time shooters though, unfortunately they both passed very young and I never got to enjoy the hobby with them. But my Grandfathers Shooters Bibles from the 40's and 50's were in the gun cabinet at home and I would spend hours as a kid drooling over the pages. Like many others, along came mortgages, kids, and other interests, plus a lack of places to shoot as suburbia made its way to my once rural home kept me away from the hobby for many years. But as the kids got older my one son got more serious about it and we now share a common interest and spend time together at the range. And my 6 year old grandson is not a bad shot with his Daisy, so there's hope.
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Old 10-08-2018, 11:02 AM
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Hi Joe,

Thanks for the response. You are right I am primarily a collector; however I shoot as well on a regular basis. I mention this because as is the case with most shooters some of us concentrate time on tactical practice. I have no military service of police background. My evolution as a shooter has to be self motivated. What I can say is I would rather shoot a fine revolver all day long for enjoyment than a Glock any day of the week. I think this is true with most people both young and old. Thanks..

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Originally Posted by one eye joe View Post
IN CAREFULLY READING YOUR INTERESTING POST, I REALIZE THAT WE COME FROM TWO DIFFERENT DISCIPLINES WITHIN THE FIREARMS HOBBY. YOU ARE PRIMARILY A COLLECTOR. I AM PRIMARILY A SHOOTER......
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Old 10-08-2018, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by antilamr View Post
You are obviously in a different situation than me and I salute you and your passion. I've learned a lot from you in just the last few hours of reading some of your older posts. I only hope I can be as effective as you are in your pursuit of collecting and preserving firearms.
Thank you! Very kind..
I understand the wife with priorities. Been there.

Antilamr - Some of the best guns I've found and the ones that gave me the highest level of pleasure speaking as a collector were purchased in the few hundred dollar range. My last post is a good example. Every time I buy at a gun shop or show (again with some exceptions for very rare or important), my dollar spent increases same day in value as an investment in my collection. In other words if I was in it for growing a collection and my focus was strictly profit, an 800 stating point investment purchase will return an 800 profit and a new 1600 gun balance for the "collector's fund" if the items are bought right. I've watched dealers at gun shows turn the same gun three or four times between other dealers each stepping the cost point up a notch. If they can do it so can we. Thanks again for the kind words..
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Old 10-08-2018, 11:56 AM
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Yes, metal pistol owners are a dying (or at least greying) breed. The good news is that gun ownership is thriving in general.

I don't care if people appreciate a specific style of gun as long as they understand the value in owning guns in general.

The demographics of gun owners are changing, with more women in particularly owning guns. They want light, easy to carry, easy to shoot, firearms. That's why S&W introduced the Shield 380EZ.

I doubt anyone in this thread would consider that for personal purchase, but a lot of new gun owners would.

That's good news for all of us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by antilamr View Post
I was reading a post by mrcvs on the Antique forum:
partial quote:
"How do I state this emphatically? There is little to no upside to grey guns, guns with patina, guns without condition, etc & etc, unless extremely rare or extraordinary provenance. And how can there be? You are lucky if the under 40 set even wants to pick up a gun, and when they do, it is unusual that the interest is anything other than "black guns". Very few younger folks show interest in this stuff--walk around an antique firearms show and note all the grey hair!"
Here's the link for full context;
Smith and Wesson New Model #3
It struck a nerve that has been bothering me for a while now.
Is the younger generation only interested in plastic fantastic's?

Are most of the S&W semi auto all metal fans in the over 50's crowd?

Disclaimer, I'm over 60 and just now at a stage in life where I'm able to get back into appreciating firearms. Most of my "collection" was from 30+ years ago and I'm just now starting to add to it. Just wondering if I'm part of a dying breed and only able to relate to those of the ex LEO or military types of similar age as me. I guess I'm concerned that there's not going to be many of us left to appreciate the art and workmanship of these fine pistols.
Anyone out there in the under 50 crowd?
Any insight on the future of my obsession would be appreciated.
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