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Old 01-06-2020, 03:03 PM
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Default Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.

A friend at the gun club has offered Me a 52-2 with an experimental 9MM slide and a couple of different barrels. Said it was given to Him by a S&W employee that was in R&D or some such department. Has marked magazines and all the 52 stuff also. Any ideas on the validity of this and if legit, ideas on value. After I shoot it of course.
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Old 01-06-2020, 03:15 PM
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Does it also come with the original .38 Wadcutter top end or no? (Maybe it never had one...?)

As to validity, ANYTHING is totally possible. I would definitely want to see pictures and a serial number range and hear more details and even some name-drops if I were trying to come up with an argument for validity.

As the the idea of 9mm through a 52, we have discussed this a few times and there are a couple points I would make...

It will be my position that a 9mm target gun is a lot easier to find ammo for than a .38 Wadcutter and it will hold more rounds but itís my firm position that nobody is going to alter a 52 to make it shooter 9mm more accurately than it would with .38 Wadcutter unless itís some absolute craftsman genius and if he can do it for less than a couple two or three grand, let me see it! And before we forget, I really want to know about the magazines this pistol will be using. Thatís a side discussion that matters.

And it cannot be ignored ó but the S&W Performance Center did a pretty great job of (somewhat, nearly) doing this project and the result is the Models 952, 952-1 and 952-2. And I own two of them and neither will do on paper what both of my 52-2ís will do, at least not without some magical ammunition elixir that I have not yet discovered.

952ís are phenomenal but if you HAVE one, donít race a 52-2 for pink slips unless your junk gets hauled around in a dump truck.

These are merely my opinions!
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Old 01-06-2020, 03:19 PM
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Oops, value.

If the 9mm stuff is added and at it’s worst you have a complete original 52-2 with .38 slide and barrel and a magazine or two, I can help with market price/“value” of that. The 9mm additives are a shot in the dark for what is likely to be one-off parts that are custom made.

If I were in your shoes and the guy can bring it to a range and you can try both .38 and 9mm out of it, I’d be pretty excited at the range trip. My opening dollar would be based squarely on the known stuff — the original .38 setup. I’d be working upward in $$ from that point.
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Old 01-06-2020, 04:23 PM
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Very interested in seeing pics.
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Old 01-06-2020, 07:51 PM
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Two weeks ago a friend of mine bought a 52 .38 Special Wadcutter pistol. It came with a Model 39 upper in 9 MM. The previous owner had been on the Illinois State Police Officer who had been on their pistol team. Nice piece and it shoots very well with the 52 upper on it. Not as well with the 39 upper.
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Old 01-07-2020, 02:28 PM
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My friend said that once I shoot the 9MM I won't go back to the 38WC as it is that accuraste. The gun has both uppers + xtra barrels and mags. As soon as I get it I will post pics as I am as curious also. Could be a month out, but I am trying for sooner. Thank for Your responses, much appreciated.

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Old 01-07-2020, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sevens View Post
Does it also come with the original .38 Wadcutter top end or no? (Maybe it never had one...?)

As to validity, ANYTHING is totally possible. I would definitely want to see pictures and a serial number range and hear more details and even some name-drops if I were trying to come up with an argument for validity.

As the the idea of 9mm through a 52, we have discussed this a few times and there are a couple points I would make...

It will be my position that a 9mm target gun is a lot easier to find ammo for than a .38 Wadcutter and it will hold more rounds but it’s my firm position that nobody is going to alter a 52 to make it shooter 9mm more accurately than it would with .38 Wadcutter unless it’s some absolute craftsman genius and if he can do it for less than a couple two or three grand, let me see it! And before we forget, I really want to know about the magazines this pistol will be using. That’s a side discussion that matters.

And it cannot be ignored — but the S&W Performance Center did a pretty great job of (somewhat, nearly) doing this project and the result is the Models 952, 952-1 and 952-2. And I own two of them and neither will do on paper what both of my 52-2’s will do, at least not without some magical ammunition elixir that I have not yet discovered.

952’s are phenomenal but if you HAVE one, don’t race a 52-2 for pink slips unless your junk gets hauled around in a dump truck.

These are merely my opinions!
Try these 150 gr LSWC:

09mm 150GR SWC .356 - 1000 count

They work great in my 952 as long as I don't use mixed brass as accuracy suffers. They shoot just as good as anything in my 52 did.

Last edited by RGPM1A; 01-07-2020 at 02:58 PM.
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Old 01-07-2020, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave1918a2 View Post
My friend said that once I shoot the 9MM I won't go back to the 38WC as it is that accuraste. The gun has both uppers + xtra barrels and mags. As soon as I get it I will post pics as I am as curious also. Could be a month out, but I am trying for sooner. Thank for Your responses, much appreciated.
Buy the gun, not the story. Testing it out would be your best and safest bet! If you do pick it up please post pictures so we can dissect it!
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Old 01-07-2020, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RGPM1A View Post
Try these 150 gr LSWC:

09mm 150GR SWC .356 - 1000 count

They work great in my 952 as long as I don't use mixed brass as accuracy suffers. They shoot just as good as anything in my 52 did.
Heh, I may try that, thanks!
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Old 01-08-2020, 10:40 AM
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RGPM1A;
What is your load data for the 150gn LSWC bullets you refer to? Do they shoot as "soft" as .38 full wadcutter loads in a 52?
Thanks in advance;
Mike
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Old 01-08-2020, 06:10 PM
RGPM1A RGPM1A is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmande View Post
RGPM1A;
What is your load data for the 150gn LSWC bullets you refer to? Do they shoot as "soft" as .38 full wadcutter loads in a 52?
Thanks in advance;
Mike
150gr Meister LSWC over 3.5 grains of Power Pistol in Winchester case and Federal Primer. OAL 1.120", 870 FPS. They have a bit more recoil than my Hornady 148gr HBWC over 3.3 of Win 231 loads for the 52 going at 780fps. I always preferred slightly faster loads for bullseye because of less reliability issues when the gun got dirty. Also I liked the faster cycling of the slide which for me (at least in my opinion) made up for my sometimes sloppy follow through.
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Old 02-02-2020, 05:10 PM
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Default 52-2 9MM prototype

Mentioned this gun a couple of weeks ago. Got it today. It's a 52-2 ser#A237437 ( DOB please). Has the 38 wadcutter bbl and slide. The 9MM slide looks like a 52 slide with the machining marks still on it. Has a 52 front and rear sight. Has barrels marked Bar-Sto 9MM P. Three like this. 5 inch, 5 1/2, and 6, all marked alike and also a like marked 38 super. Bar Sto claimed They didn't make these. Gentleman I got it from said it came from a smith working on the 952 project. He's had this over 20 years and said He got it from this smith at a large trade show or Shot Show. I'll be taking pictures and posting this coming week. Just hope I can get good ones.
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Old 02-02-2020, 05:20 PM
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Please include close ups of the different magazine lips.
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Old 02-03-2020, 02:12 PM
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You won't believe it but it uses a standard magazine for all.
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Old 02-03-2020, 02:51 PM
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Default 52-2 9MM prototype pics

Here are pictures of the 52-2 9MM prototype. Anyone with input is more than welcome.
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Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-002-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-003-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-004-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-005-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-006-640x480-jpg  

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Old 02-03-2020, 02:55 PM
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Default More Pics

More pics. Any input appreciated.
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Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-007-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-008-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-009-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-010-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-011-640x480-jpg  

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Old 02-03-2020, 02:57 PM
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Default Still more pics.

More pics again,
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Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-012-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-013-640x480-jpg   Model 52-2 with 9MM slide & bbl.-2012-01-01-005-014-640x480-jpg  
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Old 02-03-2020, 04:47 PM
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I will tell you that BarStow did in fact make 39 barrels at one time. 9mm, I had one that I returned in exchange for one in 9x21 in 1983.
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Old 02-04-2020, 01:10 AM
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dave1918a2, That is really neat set up, and likely unique. I remember when Barsto used to make barrels for S&Ws. Reference the 38 Super barrel, I was once shooting at a public range. The shooter next to me was shooting a model 52. We chatted about his 52, and the fact he was shooting 38 Super ammunition. IIRC, he was using the factory 38 WC barrel. The magazine was long enough to allow the 38S ammo he was using, and the 38S semi-rim was enough to headspace the round. I didn't notice any malfunctions. But having a barrel actually chambered for 38S is way beyond what that gentleman had.
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Old 02-04-2020, 10:08 AM
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It's pretty evident by the finish (still machine marks all over) that is is a tool room piece, probably a prototype, or a Lunch Box Gun a custom shop member built up. Nice piece.
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Old 02-12-2020, 12:11 PM
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I was told it was a prototype for a 952 being developed at that time.
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Old 02-12-2020, 06:00 PM
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Default I Remember This One . . .

Years ago - so doggone distant I'd forgotten about 'em until seeing this thread - I acquired two 5-inch 9mm barrels, slides (one SS; one carbon), recoil rods, appropriate recoil springs as well as one 9mm Model 52 No Dash magazine to use for both.

Inasmuch as I gotta go throw a Frisbee right now (YOU tell my weimaraner he'll have to miss today's session for a couple of Old-As-Job ((his words, not mine)) and Stinky Gun Thingies) I'll snap some pics later and hopefully buttress some of this story.

Later - DC
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Old 02-16-2020, 11:50 AM
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Bar Sto also made some barrels for PPC 9's with non standard twist rates.

Tom
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Old 02-17-2020, 04:35 AM
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Default The 9MM Model 52

With apologies, Fellow SWF Members:

Promised many days now past, finally here are 5-Inch slides and other ancillary parts arranged neatly (I hope) and named, starting on the far side (hmmm, reminds; time for a few tunes):

Okay, some notes that may turn into a full description. Hell, I don't know.

Note that when mentioned is "4-inch" or "5-inch" the reference is to the intended and coincidental barrel length, not the frame or slide lengths.

In my purchase notes, the seller described the slide's user as a "Smith & Wesson professional and a member of Team Smith & Wesson" (TSW) who wished to "practice with 9mmX19mm."

I neither remember hearing or asking for that professional's name, but he or she (should the latter exist as a part of TSW) sought lighter recoils and etc.

I tried the slide on my 52 no-dash, which would've been the Team Smith & Wesson's firearm of choice at the time, and it, as might most suspect, mates to the Model 52 no-dash without any hassles.

However, decided were to mount herein the 5-inch carbon slide (far left) on a nickel 39-2 frame and (far right) the stainless steel 5-inch slide on a 39-2 allow frame. Each slide is arranged so that one can see the rolled "Smith & Wesson" on each of those two slides. For reasons not clearly understood by yours truly, the intended frame for the slides' mount and practice use was the Model 39.

While we're on the subject of "frames," in the very middle, and squared to the front of the far-right frame, is a standard 4-inch 39-2 frame, laid so that up is down and down is up (get it?)

To the left of the middle frame and working back toward the far-left frame is a guide rod - the 5-inch variety - and a fully finished 5-inch barrel to which the slides were mounted; usually done the other way 'round, according to my purchase notes (also previously forgotten), this was done so as to keep expenses down, or, to facilitate easier equipment carries - the two thoughts being purely imagined by yours truly and not conveyed by the seller.

One last notable item on that 5-inch barrel: The chamber's top has the very same and perfectly arranged verbiage as is found on a Model 39's 4-inch barrel: 9MM CTG.

While the mated SS slide on the alloy frame (at right) doesn't show well at the rear, the slide mates all but perfectly (one supposes) there as well as at the front, where one can see how nicely the frame and slide cuts match. Insofar as the left-side composition is concerned, it accomplished much the same thing as at right; matching were both the cosmetics at the front and rear as well as all along the contact surfaces of the slide and nickel-plated frame.

Last but definitely least comes the 4-inch guide rod and spring.



Okay, you all, that's my story and I'm sticking to it. I'm interested in learning of my fellow Forum members' thoughts.

Later - DC
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