Finally, 4516-1 to the range

[smitholdtimer]

And the experience was not good. I had loaded all three magazines and was ready to begin. After the first round was in the chamber I pulled the trigger after sighting the target and the 45 caliber bullet was down range but the hammer remained back in a cocked position and would not fire until the hammer was lowered back down to double action position, could fire again but not a very satisfactory self defense situation. Only fired two rounds and put the pistol back in it's case and brought it home, very disappointed!
I am not gunsmith and not a semi-auto person (grew up on revolvers) but have been trying to find something in semi-auto with which I can become somewhat proficient, this one isn't it.

[Green Frog]

I hear ya smitholdtimer. I’m another long-time revolver guy myself and am just beginning to dip my toes into the water of S&W auto pistols. One thing I will insist on his thorough servicing and TLC of a new acquisition, followed by extensive testing and familiarization before I trust it for anything beyond a casual outing at the range. I feel like this is sound practice for any firearm.

Actually, most autos are pretty simple compared to revolvers, so both of us will probably be able to overcome our difficulties soon... at least I hope so! Good luck with it.

Froggie

[GerSan69]

Hi oldtimer, I'm trying to understand your situation.
So the gun fired properly, but you could not pull the trigger on a second shot?
As a TDA gun, the hammer is supposed to cock after the first round. In other words, double action 1st round, single action after that.
Was there anything else obvious, like the slide was out of battery?
Looking forward to more info....

[smitholdtimer]

This pistol has a bobbed hammer and made me think it's a DAO but when the hammer stayed back but the trigger could not be pulled I was confused & disappointed.

Need to add that the first Magazine I loaded was an extra that fits the M-4516-1 but not the original, which I didn't try. Both are S&W Mags but not M-4516-1 specific. The original says it's only for this model. You think that may have been the problem?

Appreciate your support Froggie, not an easy transition for me being of Geeser Age.

[Jeppo]

Wild guess...magazine disconnect issue?

[jjfitch]

The serial number of this model determines the correct magazine by the color of the follower. I sold my 4516 years ago and don't recall the specifics!

Google is your friend!

Smiles,

[Redwood32R2]

You will find that Smith used three different mags during the 4516 series production identified by the plastic followers colors. Generally the 4516 no dash used orange follower mags that can be found marked For use in m4516 only. The three that came with my 4516-1 are yellow followers marked This magazine must have a yellow follower with no mention of model on it. My 4516-1 also came with three black follower mags without any markings at all. I have seen on this forum that the black follower mags are the best design and seem to work best. My gun works just fine with both the yellow and black ones. Some members have stated that they have no problems with any color. I would try all your mags starting with your original to the gun mag. Hope this helps.

[18DAI]

Smitholdtimer if you have any time next week, I would be happy to meet up with you and see if I can figure out the problem with your 4516-1.

I'm not a gunsmith and can't fix it if its broken, but I know my way around a 4516 and might be able to diagnose the problem. Let me know! Regards 18DAI

[Jeppo]

If you’re anywhere near Davidson County, you’re welcome to come over and try your gun with my yellow follower 4516-1 specific magazines.

[smitholdtimer]

My original magazine has the Yellow Follower, the recently added two have black followers. I also noticed while loading the Mags that the yellow follower (original) has a weaker spring than the two new that I purchased not specific to the Model 4516-1 if that makes any difference.

[smitholdtimer]

I appreciate your offer, let me sort out some of the things I should have already addressed and get back to you before accepting your kind offer! Much Obliged, 18!

[smitholdtimer]

My wife & I have been holdup since February 3 when she had her knee replaced, we were mobile but only to her therapy and then the Covid 19 hit and we have been hunkered down ever since. She is improving but we haven't shopped in public and I'm not allowed to mingle. She's not all that much worried about me, she doesn't want me to bring it home. Now you understand my reluctance to travel plus I'd be embarrassed shooting the semi-auto.

[18DAI]

No worries my friend. Stay safe and contact me when all of this blows over. At your convenience. I am semi retired now, so there is some flexibility in my schedules these days.

If its far enough down the road, maybe we can meet up with Mr Jeppo too! Regards 18DAI

[GerSan69]

OT, I just want to acknowledge your reply. That's an issue I've never heard of, personally. The only guesses I can make would be to make sure the slide is completely in battery by pushing it forward with your thumb. I'd also make sure that the lever isn't turned slightly somehow. Last, as far as magazines, I'm one of those that puts any magazine in and have no problems, so I can't duplicate the issue that way. Only other thing I can think of is if our resident master machinist, BMCM, might come along and give you a long-range diagnosis. Good luck, 'll be paying attention to this thread since I have a 4516-1 myself.

[18DAI]

I'm another who uses all the different 7 round mags with different followers in my 4516s - at the range. For carry, I only use the newer mags with the black followers.

I'm guessing that Jeppo may have diagnosed the problem. The only time I recall a similar problem with a 4516 is when I didn't slap the mag in hard enough and the mag safety did its thing - with the hammer back.

Of course not being lubed or a weak recoil spring, keeping the gun from going into battery would result in the same type of "malfunction". As would a slightly oversized reload round.

Anyways, it should not be a big problem to cure, what ever it is. The 4516s are well made guns. VERY accurate too. Regards 18DAI

[smitholdtimer]

I revisited the range today with the M-4516-1 and it was a enlightening learning experience. There seems to be nothing wrong with the pistol after all. Operator Error Entirely.
This morning I used the original magazine and loaded it three times & chambered one and loaded another one into the magazine and fired the first double action and the remaining 7 by single action. Ran just fine and I even hit the target a few times (6"X 6") from 10 yards (didn't actually measure it). I sure hope the noise will be a deterrent since my accuracy wasn't worth bragging about. I was able to see the rounds hit the berm behind the target stand so I'm a Vicinity shooter at best.

Thanks for all the offers to help and to troubleshoot the pistol but it was just me putting my ignorance on display.

Nope, not very happy with the double action trigger pull or the single action, for that matter. Sure hope there are those gifted individuals who can work their magic and improve both but the single action at least. I'm sure I wouldn't be very effective trying to fire this pistol with my weak hand.

Thanks to Lee for allowing me this space to enjoy my meal of "CROW"!

[Jeppo]

I’d bet money you’d be able to get plenty of hits if you ever needed to fire that gun in a SD situation.

If you lose interest in it, maybe the best solution is to sell the gun to a hungry guy not too far up the road from you?

[18DAI]

Or trade it to me for a revolver.

Glad it worked out for you! BMCM does a great trigger job. And based on my dealings with him, he is not adverse to old timers! Best regards, 18DAI

[stansdds]

I second the motion to send your pistol to BMCM, he does quality work.

[jjfitch]

Originally Posted by smitholdtimer

I revisited the range today with the M-4516-1 and it was a enlightening learning experience. There seems to be nothing wrong with the pistol after all. Operator Error Entirely.
This morning I used the original magazine and loaded it three times & chambered one and loaded another one into the magazine and fired the first double action and the remaining 7 by single action. Ran just fine and I even hit the target a few times (6"X 6") from 10 yards (didn't actually measure it). I sure hope the noise will be a deterrent since my accuracy wasn't worth bragging about. I was able to see the rounds hit the berm behind the target stand so I'm a Vicinity shooter at best.

Thanks for all the offers to help and to troubleshoot the pistol but it was just me putting my ignorance on display.

Nope, not very happy with the double action trigger pull or the single action, for that matter. Sure hope there are those gifted individuals who can work their magic and improve both but the single action at least. I'm sure I wouldn't be very effective trying to fire this pistol with my weak hand.

Thanks to Lee for allowing me this space to enjoy my meal of "CROW"!

The traditional DA/SA is a bit of a pain for dry firing but "in practice" you get to practice mag and slide manipulation at the same time. Do a little dry fire practice a few minutes daily for a few weeks. Eventually you will master it!

Smiles,

[Doc1500]

Originally Posted by jjfitch

The traditional DA/SA is a bit of a pain for dry firing but "in practice" you get to practice mag and slide manipulation at the same time. Do a little dry fire practice a few minutes daily for a few weeks. Eventually you will master it!

Smiles,

Before you dry fire make sure you put a rubber o-ring or a piece of eraser in the hammer channel so you're not slamming the heck out of the gun.

[HOUSTON RICK]

I guess that I have been lucky with my firearms. One time ammo was the problem in that a police trade in had a spring job that I did not know about and stronger ammo fixed everything, other than that; I could always find the problem - in the mirror. Happy, safe shooting Smitholdtimer!