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  #1  
Old 04-14-2009, 11:58 AM
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Default 6906 in .356 TSW, Marlin Camp-9/.356 TSW, New Project - Ruger PC4/.357 SIG

Let me start off by saying, I'm hooked on the .356TSW caliber.

If I can find someone's extra 6906 barrel that they want to give up?
I'm contemplating having forum member RSnyder modifying the barrel for .356TSW.
He made me one for my 5906 and I put a 22# recoil spring into it to handle the power.
It all works well.

The factory spring for the 6906 is a 15#, stock for the 5906 was 14#'s and I did the Wolff 22# one.
I can only assume I would need at least the same % increase (about 157%).
I looked at Wolff's site for the 6906 and the stock is 15#'s and they only go up to a 20#.
I called Wolff and they gave me the specifications on the heavier springs for the 4013 and 4516
which will fit the 6906, I have the option of using the 17#, 19#, 21# and 23#.
Knowing what I have learned from the 5906, I would start with the 23# spring.

If anyone has an extra 6906 barrel that they would like to part with, please let me know.

I looked on the S&W site at the 6906 parts and it shows two different barrels listed.
P/N 200160000 and P/N 236940000.
I do not know the difference between the two.
Does anyone know the difference between them?
(Edited - I spoke to S&W C.S. - the 236940000 is the later one and has the wider hood.)
Thanks,
BM1

Last edited by bad_man_ one; 08-20-2010 at 09:32 AM. Reason: New Information in Title
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  #2  
Old 04-14-2009, 12:51 PM
handgunner356 handgunner356 is offline
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The 22# sounds pretty stiff, how far does it eject the spent brass? On the compact/SD 356 they used the same dual spring setup as the 40/45TSW compacts, which come out around the same 17# as used in the full size 3566. I would think that the 20# in the compact would be enough, but if you could get the smaller rod/bushing upgrade that S&W was putting in the earlier 4013/4513 that use the dual spring setup it would probably work the best. The dual springs are not available from Wolff, but the outer is the same as a 6906 which would give you some operating range. The barrel hood width is the main differance on the barrels, .260"vs.390".
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Old 04-14-2009, 12:57 PM
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The compact 356TSW models used a longer slide than the 6906, as well as a stainless steel frame. The 6906 is aluminum.
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:03 PM
handgunner356 handgunner356 is offline
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The SD has the longer slide but the compact uses the same, and both use the 3.5" guide rod/spring setup.
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Old 04-14-2009, 03:09 PM
RGAmos RGAmos is offline
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I have a couple of Super 9's and have questioned whether the supplied recoil spring is satisfactory for both the .356 and 9mm. S&w tells me the one spring is OK for both, but I still question whether it is.
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Old 04-14-2009, 05:02 PM
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BM1,
as we discussed on the phone, my .356 6904 has the stock recoil spring. It really throws the brass, but works flawlessly with the original 9mm mags. I bought a +2 and +4 springs, but haven't tried them yet. Keep us informed.


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  #7  
Old 04-14-2009, 08:26 PM
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With allot years in Manufacturing Engineering with Aerospace Machining,
I acquired an electronic scale that is capable of weighing out to .001 of a Pound or .016 Ounce.

That being said, I did some weight testing with the complete slide assemblies:
(slide, barrel, recoil spring and guide rod, sights, firing pin and spring, decocker)

6906 9 m.m. - - - - - - - - - = .892 Lbs. or 14.272 Oz. - Stock 15# S&W Spring P/N 10095
3566 .356TSW - - - - - - - - = .937 Lbs. or 14.992 Oz. - Stock 16# S&W Springs Out/In 10866/10867
3906 FS 9 m.m. - - - - - - - = .966 Lbs. or 15.456 Oz. - Stock 14# S&W Spring P/N 06048
5906 FS .356TSW conversion = .974 Lbs. or 15.584 Oz. - 22# Wolff Recoil Spring
5906 AS 9 m.m. - - - - - - - = .989 Lbs. or 15.824 Oz. - Stock 14# S&W Spring P/N 06048
3906 AS 9 m.m. - - - - - - - = 1.006Lbs. or 16.048 Oz. - Stock 14# S&W Spring P/N 06048
4013 40 S&W - - - - - - - - = 1.054 Lbs. or 16.864 Oz. - Stock 16# S&W Springs Out/In 10866/10867
4516 .45 ACP - - - - - - - - = 1.097 Lbs. or 17.552 Oz. - Stock 16# S&W Springs Out/In 10866/10867
356 Limited 5.00" .356TSW - = 1.248 Lbs. or 19.968 Oz. - Stock 14# S&W Spring P/N 06048

I do not know the pound rating for sure for the double spring combination for the 3566 compact, 4013 and the 4516.
Wolff shows the stock single spring at 16# and I think S&W would have gone higher when they redesigned the double spring combination.
It would only make sense, to me.

I spoke to Jimmy Ray @ the Performance Center and asked about the 3566 Compact and 356 Limited.
That is how I arrived at the part number on the Limited recoil spring.
They/he was not able to give me the P/N for the 3566 Compact spring.
I will compare it to the 4013 (wire size, number of coils and length, [used]), But I think they are the same.

I hope this didn't get too complicated.
After interpolating all the data, without going into the equations.
The one unknown factor is slide velocities which I cannot measure, other than how far the brass gets thrown.

The bottom line is:
I could probably go down to the 20# spring on the 5906 to .356TSW conversion,
it would keep it from slamming closed as fast.
The 21# would probably be ok on the 6906 to .356TSW conversion, but I would start with the 23#
Regards,
BM1
(It took me a couple of edits to get the information to [some-what] line up)

Last edited by bad_man_ one; 01-20-2011 at 09:57 AM.
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  #8  
Old 04-16-2009, 09:55 PM
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Anyone out there that would like to get rid of a spare 6906 wide hood barrel?
Regards,
BM1
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  #9  
Old 04-19-2009, 07:15 PM
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BTT
Quote:
Originally posted by bad_man_ one:
Anyone out there that would like to get rid of a spare 6906 wide hood barrel?
Regards,
BM1
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  #10  
Old 04-25-2009, 07:19 PM
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Hooray................
It's all coming together, My prayers were answered.
Big thanks to forum member "Orangehole" for contacting me with a possible 356TSW barrel could possibly fit my 6906, I now have a real "Pocket Rocket" with the alloy frame. It is allot lighter than my 3566 Compact.
It comes from a prototype 3913TWS that was made by another forum member as a test for the 356TSW caliber, he has/had extensive Performance Center knowledge. (Name: Withheld for privacy)
Turns out it was one of two or three.
Please post if you would like to...............
It turns out that they (the 3913TSW and 6906) both have the same barrel P/N.
I'm just waiting for my Wolff springs to come in.
I will keep in touch and give a Range Test and Evaluation on this.
I don't know how well the pictures will come out.
Regards,
BM1


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Old 04-25-2009, 08:38 PM
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Glad to be of help BM1. I sold my 3913TSW a while ago so the barrel was gathering dust in my safe and I am really happy it went to a person who appreciates the round. I am sure you will put it to good use. You have to love this forum. Alot of great helpful people enjoying the same hobby!
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Old 05-03-2009, 08:50 PM
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Finally got to the range and it all came together today.
The 6906/356TSW is the "Cats Meow" as far as the new "Pocket Rocket".
I started out with the 23# Wolff recoil spring and that's what it needed, cycled perfectly.
Federal 135 gr. Hydra-Shok JHP's, Federal 147 gr. FMJ Gold Metal Match and
Cor-Bon's 124 gr. BHP's(only a couple of those).
Including forum member Rbert0005's reloads worked super.
(5.4 Win 231 w/125 gr. Rainier's, 1.165 OAL).
Thanks to all the forum members involved with the ideas and transactions for my 356TSW love affair.

Grinder, Rsnyder, VM, Rbert0005, Gman356ca for the load data and anyone that I might have missed,
you know who you are.

I now have quite a collection in this caliber;
PC-940 Centennial, PC-3566 Compact, PC-356 Limited, the 6906 and the newest,
a beautiful 5903 to go with my 5906(they both use the same barrel and spring combination)

And a special thanks to Orangehole and Wesman for this one-of-a-kind Performance Center 356TSW barrel.
Regards,
BM1
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  #13  
Old 05-04-2009, 10:30 AM
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Last week I emailed Starline Brass about the possibility of getting some 356TSW brass,
If they didn't have any on hand, how much would an order need to be to run some off,
maybe a group buy with members on the forum.
This was their response not the quantity I had expected.
Regards,
BM1


"BM1,
We have zero .356 TS&W left and no plans to produce any more
(you are the first person to even request them in as long as I can remember).
If we were to produce them it would take a minimum order of 100,000 pieces
and would be about six months lead time."
Thank you,
Hunter Pilant
Media Relations/Technical Support
hunter@starlinebrass.com

Starline Inc.
1300 W. Henry Street
Sedalia, MO 65301
800-280-6660
660-827-6640
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Old 05-04-2009, 09:13 PM
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Don't got a 356 tsw. I was looking at them in the 90's but never jumped. Anyway Turners Sporting Goods in Corona CA has six boxes of 124gr factory CorBon they found buried somewhere if anyone is interested in contacting them.

To the 22# Wolff spring, that is what I use in my 1006 10mm. 24 would be the upper end, either sounds a little stiff for a 356 tsw.
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Old 05-04-2009, 11:41 PM
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7tenz,
That is because the mass (weight) of the slide of a 1006 is much more than a compact 9 m.m.
which is why I was able to use the 23# spring and it cycles 100%.
I'll check into those Cor-Bon's.
Regards,
BM1
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Old 05-05-2009, 02:19 AM
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Konrad, I'm in for 2000 pieces.
Bob
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Old 05-05-2009, 04:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by bad_man_ one:
7tenz,
That is because the mass (weight) of the slide of a 1006 is much more than a compact 9 m.m.
which is why I was able to use the 23# spring and it cycles 100%.
I'll check into those Cor-Bon's.
Regards,
BM1
That makes sense, ok. But the one and only thing I don't like about the 10mm is it's heavy spring. You want them to work 100% all the time, because with the 22-24# spring it is a lot harder to clear malfunctions.

Turners has a webpage, turners.com. You can get an address and ph# for the Corona store there. Let me know how you make out.
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Old 05-06-2009, 01:03 PM
SmithNut SmithNut is offline
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Quote:
BM1,
as we discussed on the phone, my .356 6904 has the stock recoil spring. It really throws the brass, but works flawlessly with the original 9mm mags. I bought a +2 and +4 springs, but haven't tried them yet. Keep us informed.

You guys are having too much fun here! Who can tell me where to find a .356tsw barrel for my M6944? That would be a fantastic project. Grinder, did you have your original barrel reamed out or did you find one of these special PC barrels? I would sure be appreciative if anyone knows where another one of those are.

Regards,
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Old 05-06-2009, 06:43 PM
Grinder Grinder is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by SmithNut:
Quote:
BM1,
as we discussed on the phone, my .356 6904 has the stock recoil spring. It really throws the brass, but works flawlessly with the original 9mm mags. I bought a +2 and +4 springs, but haven't tried them yet. Keep us informed.

You guys are having too much fun here! Who can tell me where to find a .356tsw barrel for my M6944? That would be a fantastic project. Grinder, did you have your original barrel reamed out or did you find one of these special PC barrels? I would sure be appreciative if anyone knows where another one of those are.

Regards,
It is an older narrow hood barrel pistol, so I had it reamed out. The PC barrel is the wide hood. Should be no problem picking up a 9mm barrel to throw back in my 6904 sometime.
Good luck on your project
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Old 05-06-2009, 06:52 PM
Grinder Grinder is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by bad_man_ one:
Last week I emailed Starline Brass about the possibility of getting some 356TSW brass,
If they didn't have any on hand, how much would an order need to be to run some off,
maybe a group buy with members on the forum.
This was their response not the quantity I had expected.
Regards,
BM1


"BM1,
We have zero .356 TS&W left and no plans to produce any more
(you are the first person to even request them in as long as I can remember).
If we were to produce them it would take a minimum order of 100,000 pieces
and would be about six months lead time."
Thank you,
Hunter Pilant
Media Relations/Technical Support
hunter@starlinebrass.com

Starline Inc.
1300 W. Henry Street
Sedalia, MO 65301
800-280-6660
660-827-6640

My last .356TSW order was in Sept. 2007

I'd go in for a few more
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Old 05-06-2009, 07:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by 7tenz:
Turners Sporting Goods in Corona CA has six boxes of 124gr factory CorBon they found buried somewhere if anyone is interested in contacting them.
Thanks 7tenz,
I called today, they have my name written all over them.

SmithNut,
Contact forum member RSnyder, he's a great guy,
He made me one for my 5903/5906 and I put a Wolff 22# recoil spring into it to handle the power.
It cycles 100%, it's like having a .357 Magnum Auto.

Grinder, RSnyder,
I would buy quite a large amount from Starline,
But we've got a long way to go for 100,000 pieces.
I probably should start a post in the reloading section?

Regards,
BM1
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Old 05-07-2009, 06:35 PM
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Received some more information to another email.
This is a little out of my price range unless I can get forum members to commit.

Hello Hunter,
Thank you for your reply.
What would my cost be on 100,000 pieces?
How would it be packaged and shipped to Connecticut?
It could be shipped to a manufacturing company loading dock or ground level.
Shipping cost, to loading dock or ground level?
Bulk barrel packaging would be fine.
Would you be running off some to sell for your retail/catalogue sales also?
If so, what would it sell for, 100 pc., 500 pc., and 1000 pc. quantities?
Thank you again,
BM1


BM1,
The price would be $140 per 1,000 pieces including packaging.
It would be packaged in 15 gallon cardboard boxes containing 20,000 pieces each.
Freight would be paid by you using whatever shipping method you prefer.
We will skid and band the boxes and load them on a truck for you.
We are not interested in producing this caliber anymore so we will not put
it in our catalog or sell it to anyone else.
Thank you,
Hunter Pilant
Media Relations/Technical Support
hunter@starlinebrass.com
Starline Inc.
1300 W. Henry Street
Sedalia, MO 65301
800-280-6660
660-827-6640


Hunter,
Thank you again for your reply.
That seems like a full blown retail price?
What would dealer pricing be?
I'm trying to keep this cartridge alive, but that's 14 thousand dollars plus shipping.
Can you do a little better to help keep a great round from dying a terrible death?
I would hate to see the avid followers (including me) of this cartridge
end up with a bunch of expensive paper weights.
Thank you again,
BM1
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Old 05-07-2009, 09:01 PM
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Now if my memory serves me right wasn't it $76 a thousand the last time it was in a catalog?
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Old 05-08-2009, 12:38 PM
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They are sure not going to give it away.
Regards,
BM1

BM1,
Iím sorry but that is the best price that we can do at this time. We have orders on the books right now through the end of the year.

Thank you,
Hunter Pilant
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Old 05-10-2009, 04:26 PM
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Lately, I am into weird calibers as well. I found a Colt gov't in 9x23 with .38 super conversion. In my recent reading and shooting these rounds, I love these hot 9mm's. They should have kept the .356 TSW over the .357 Sig. Makes alot more sense and the handloads seem to be smokin for the .356. Recently, I have been contemplating having my P226 fitted with a 9x21mm barrel. The 9x21 can be loaded pretty warm as well. Good luck.
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Old 05-18-2009, 05:59 PM
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Bringing this to the top with some specific project questions.
Was very fortunate to get a M6946 "top end" via our Classified section last week. Was thinking of having it drilled to 9x21.5 and using it with my M6946 when wanting to shoot some of the stash of .356 TSW, but now I'm thinking that is a fall back plan.
Has anyone given any thought to using a M69xx slide on a single stack version (M39xx)? I've installed it on my M3954, and it seems to function Ok now, have not tried any of the longer ammo in the standard single stack mag, but if it fits on other Smith 9mm mags, that shouldn't be a prob. I don't have any factory ammo here at the moment, gave it all to my daughter with the Stocking Dealer Auto she borrowed and never gave back (), so after re-acquiring some I'll try the M3954 mag to see if it will fit and, hopefully function. Then I'm going to send the barrel somewhere to get it drilled out and see how the whole thing plays out.
It's been nearly 19 years since I did any substantial .356 TSW loading/shooting, so this should be fun. Glad I kept the 2000 rounds of Starline brass I bought way back when, it seems with the above emails that it's gonna be a long time til any surface again (if ever).
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Old 05-29-2009, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by 7tenz:
Don't got a 356 tsw. I was looking at them in the 90's but never jumped. Anyway Turners Sporting Goods in Corona CA has six boxes of 124gr factory CorBon they found buried somewhere if anyone is interested in contacting them.
Got them today, they are 50 rd. boxes, I never asked, assumed they were 20 rd. boxes. LOL
$18.90 ea. X 6 = 113.40 + $20.00 shipping + $133.40 total, I'm very happy.
Thanks again 7/8tenz,
BM1
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Old 05-30-2009, 07:02 PM
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BM1,
That was a deal !

I did some calculating and decided to go #21 in my 6904. The recoil impulse and ejection pattern are perfect with warm reloads.
My Melonite 5906 upper fits the 6904 perfectly and will probably become a 356
I also have another 356 project brewing
News at 11
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Old 05-30-2009, 07:13 PM
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Grinder,
I was very pleased with the Cor-Bon deal, it sure surprised me to get 50 rd. boxes.
Does anybody have a spare Marlin Camp-9 barrel or
one with a cracked stock that they would like to part with?
Regards,
BM1
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Old 05-31-2009, 06:54 AM
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bad_man_one,
A camp 9 would be an awsome little camp carbine! Let me know if you find one and how it shoots. Now you have me thinking-HMMM maybe a Hipoint 9, cheap and easy to find!
Bob
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Old 05-31-2009, 07:18 AM
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TRY 9 X 21 BRASS. THE 356TSW IS JUST A 9 X 21.5 JP
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Old 05-31-2009, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by bad_man_ one:
Got them today, they are 50 rd. boxes, I never asked, assumed they were 20 rd. boxes. LOL
$18.90 ea. X 6 = 113.40 + $20.00 shipping + $133.40 total, I'm very happy.
Thanks again 7/8tenz,
BM1
Good deal. I couldn't see them standing around collecting dust for how long. last fall I asked for a price out of curiosity and I think they said $24/50. Even that was a steal. Anyway happy shootin'
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Old 06-04-2009, 01:07 PM
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Well,
I'm down here in sunny Florida using a local town library computer and just happened to stop in to Pistol Dynamics in Palm Bay/Melbourne and had a long and most informative conversation with Paul Liebenberg, what a GREAT guy.
He showed me the originals of the .356TSW Limited with a 6" barrel with the real high capacity mags and I don't mean 15 or 17 rounders.
Also the original S&W FBI 1076 Test and Evaluation gun that was always referred to when a 1076 was in question for any reason.
It was the one that all the other 1076's were compared to, with 9, 11 and 15 round magazines that are truly one of a kind.
I will show pictures when I return home.
I was asked to not post any S/N's.
Also, on aside note, don't give up on the .356TSW round, all I can say is - IT'S NOT DEAD.
With best regards from sunny Florida, see ya soon,
Bad_Man_One

P.S.
I was told to forget about building a "blowback" .356TSW carbine, the case head will separate.
I'm not the first one to think about it and definitely not the first one to see the results first hand. LOL
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Old 06-04-2009, 07:54 PM
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Congrats Bad Man...

I would love to see more projects just like this one.
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:15 PM
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Here are some pictures from Paul Liebenberg of Pistol Dynamics in Palm Bay Florida.
He showed me the originals of the .356TSW Limited with a 6" barrel with the real high capacity mags also with the "Std." 5" upper.
Also the original S&W FBI 1076 Test and Evaluation gun that was always referred to when a 1076 was in question for any reason.
It was the one that all the other 1076's were compared to, with the "PROTOTYPE" - 9, 11 and 15 round magazines
that are truly one of a kind.
I was asked to not post any S/N's.
Regards,
Bad_Man_One




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Old 06-09-2009, 06:59 PM
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WOW,
I need that 6"
Thanks for posting that BM1
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Old 06-10-2009, 10:47 AM
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Default Great pics...

Paul Liebenberg is the man...

IMHO, he is the reason that we even have PC guns in their current form.

I would love to see him back with S&W. Maybe then we would finally see some steel/alloy framed TDA PC pistols again.
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Old 06-10-2009, 12:49 PM
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Great pics bad man! Haha finally one that grinder does not own! Lets see him wrangle that one away from Paul L! Very cool to be able to see THE ORIGINAL 1076. Going to save that picture!
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Old 06-11-2009, 09:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orangehole View Post
Great pics bad man! Haha finally one that grinder does not own! Lets see him wrangle that one away from Paul L! Very cool to be able to see THE ORIGINAL 1076. Going to save that picture!
Grinder will never come close to having a fraction of the PC protos out there.
But it's fun to search out some of them and purchase a few.
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Old 08-17-2009, 01:40 PM
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I have a .356 TSW that I purchased back in the early 90s for use in IPSC competition. I also purchased 1000 rounds of 147 gr TMJ ammo and a couple hundred HP rounds too.

Also bought reloading dies and saved what brass I could and worked up reloads for gun.

Moved to CA 15 years ago and stopped competing and haven't fired the gun much since then. Am no longer reloading but am now interested in picking up some more ammo for it as I'm kind of getting the itch to start shooting it again.

The performance center gun is very nice, accurate, and easy to shoot. Made major PF with no problem and really knocked down the steel poppers.
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  #41  
Old 01-04-2010, 10:00 AM
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Not 356TSW... I have a 9X21 Barstow barrel for my M39-2... I see that they are no longer making barrels other than 1911. I bought 500 pieces of Starline brass but have only made up a few test rounds... before I got sick. There was a magazine article about this by... Pistolsmith John Lawson... American Hangunner May/June 1993.

I foolishly lost the factory 9mm barrel, so was in a bind as far as store bought ammo until a forum member gifted me a spare.

I'd love to learn more about how others make out with this. Maybe I'll revive this project.
Russ

Last edited by flagman1776; 01-04-2010 at 10:11 AM. Reason: add article source
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  #42  
Old 03-01-2010, 03:24 PM
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Default .356TSW project brewing ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grinder View Post
I also have another 356 project brewing, News at 11
Grinder,
What happened to the "356 project brewing" ?

Does anybody have a spare Marlin Camp-9 barrel or
one with a cracked stock that they would like to part with?

Regards,
BM1
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  #43  
Old 03-05-2010, 09:25 PM
Grinder Grinder is offline
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Default 356 projects

Quote:
Originally Posted by bad_man_ one View Post
Grinder,
What happened to the "356 project brewing" ?

Does anybody have a spare Marlin Camp-9 barrel or
one with a cracked stock that they would like to part with?

Regards,
BM1
Here they are:
A Kimber 1911 in .356 tsw and an M&P Pro with .356tsw StormLake barrel and recoil assembly

BTW: both shoot great

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  #44  
Old 03-05-2010, 10:03 PM
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Hi Grinder,
I am impressed, as you know, it's my favorite caliber.
Were they bored out 9's from StormLake?
Or,
did they make them .356 TSW's to order and supply the recoil springs?
And/Or,
was Wolff Gunsprings involved?
Regards,
BM1

Last edited by bad_man_ one; 03-14-2010 at 07:09 PM. Reason: Spelling error
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  #45  
Old 03-05-2010, 11:37 PM
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Ahhhhhhhhhh.Here we go. Thanks for this link BM1
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Old 03-09-2010, 09:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bad_man_ one View Post
Hi Grinder,
I an impressed, as you know, it's my favorite caliber.
Were they bored out 9's from StormLake?
Or,
did they make them .356 TSW's to order and supply the recoil springs?
And/Or,
was Wolff Gunsprings involved?
Regards,
BM1
The Kimber is a reamed factory 9mm barrel with a 18.5 Wolff spring
The Pro is a Storm Lake 9 that was reamed along with the Wolff spring steel guide and 22 lb spring
Wanted to keep the factory 9 barrel in the Pro

I did find the Pro needs pistol primers to fire reliably
Locals into the 356TSW used to reload with small rifle primers years ago
They work in hammer fired pistols, but not striker
I've shot up most of that ammo anyway

Recently picked up a pile of Montana gold bullets, so the Dillon will be churning out some 356s soon

Thanks
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  #47  
Old 03-31-2010, 01:10 AM
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Default .356 TSW - New Project

Quote:
Originally Posted by bad_man_ one View Post
Grinder,
Does anybody have a spare Marlin Camp-9 barrel or
one with a cracked stock that they would like to part with?
Regards,
BM1
Well,
I'll add to my own post here..............
I got a line on a Marlin Camp-9 barrel and will ream it to a .356 TSW.
My Camp-9 has the 16.5# Wolff spring in it and feels much better than the stock 11# Marlin.
I'll put the 21# spring in it that Wolff offers (same one that's in my Camp-45) and a new buffer from Black Jack Buffers.
I think it will be safe, it handles my hot .45 ACP loads beautifully.
I believed I've addressed all the safety issues of recoil to any possible dangers of this combination since this is a "blowback recoil operation system" and not a " locked-breech design system".
I know the barrel/chamber is thick/strong enough due to the fact that there is much more metal surrounding the case than the .45 ACP and a stock S&W pistol barrel of this caliber.
I'll keep you all posted.
Regards,
BM1

Last edited by bad_man_ one; 05-04-2010 at 12:26 AM. Reason: Typo's
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  #48  
Old 07-19-2010, 10:26 PM
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Default .356 TSW - New Project - Update

Good news all around:
Let me start off with an additional note with my .356 TSW projects:
I came across another Marlin Camp-9 to experiment with, at a great price.

I finally got the time to put my extra Marlin Camp-9 barrel into a CNC Turning Center at the shop.
Re-bored the 9 m.m. chamber 2.5 m.m.'s deeper following the same taper of the 9 Lugar (Parabellum) blending into the existing taper.
The 9 round is actually 9mm x 19.15 mm (0.754 in) and the .356 TSW is x 21.5 mm (.8465 in).
But when I bored it to to the extra depth it was crushing the round in the chambering stage.
I would have never noticed it but I shot only one round to check the spent case and
if the primer was flattened due to the increased pressure of a 18" barrel.
I safed the firearm in the process to check the brass and that's when I noticed it.
I fired that same accordioned (crushed) round next and oddly enough the spent brass then looked fine.
Who would have thought to ever check?
It appears that the stock Marlin 9 m.m. chamber was not head spaced deep enough from the factory,
but it didn't matter with the factory 11 lb. recoil spring seating it, I guess.

But now it had a heavy duty .45 ACP Wolff spring rated at 21 lbs., it crushed the .356 TSW round.
I will be checking my other Camp 9 and 45, who would ever think to eject a live round and check for that.

So I re-indicated the chamber in the CNC Lathe again and re-bored it again,
but not before doing a headspace check with the bolt, a round and the barrel assembled all at the same time using inspection gage pins.
All the testing was done in a friends homemade magnum (1/2" thick) bullet trap.

Everything is perfect now with the cycling.

I think I'm going to put a red dot on this one.
Range report to follow, hopefully later this week.
Regards,
BM1

Last edited by bad_man_ one; 07-20-2010 at 10:38 PM. Reason: Corrected typo for 18" barrel, not 16"
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  #49  
Old 07-20-2010, 09:24 PM
Grinder Grinder is offline
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Great update BM1
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Old 07-26-2010, 03:01 PM
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Default Range Report and a little EXTRA INFO

Went to the range with the new Marlin Camp-.356 TSW
Every thing went flawless.
I decided to go with a 3x9-32 scope on it instead of a red-dot.
Shot some reloads, Federal Match, Hydra-Shok's and CorBon 124 gr BHP's.

I emailed CorBon to see if I could get some information on their load.
I was pleasantly surprised when the responded immediately.


Hello Mr. Peter Pi,
I am an avid fan of the defunct Smith and Wesson .356 TSW Ammo.
I have six hand guns and a Marlin Camp-9 carbine chambered in this caliber.
I use your 124 gr. BHP's at 1450 fps and love them.
I also shoot the Federal Match 147 gr. and the Hydra-Shoks.

I was hoping to get some load data on your round.
I see it was the Speer 124 gr. Gold Dot Bonded Hollow Points.
And the rounds had 11.2 grains of powder in them.
But I don't know who the manufacturer of the powder is.
I have compared it to 15 different powders that I have, to no avail.
I would prefer to use the same power (or one similar) that you loaded these rounds with, they work GREAT.
Rather than going through the chronograph process with different powders.

I also contacted Starline Brass to see if they had any left but they do not have any anymore.

I've been reloading for awhile and also reload 10 other calibers;
9 m.m., 357 SIG, .40 S&W, 10 m.m., .38 Wad Cutters, .38 Special/Magnum, .44 Special/Magnum, .45 ACP

I'm in a little bit of a bind here with this.

Thank you for your help,
BM1


The reply;
Sir,
While I'm a big fan of the 356 TSW ammo S&W did not produce enough guns to warrant keeping it in production. The guns were only available through the Performance Center. S&W was going to produce a factory production gun at one time, but that never materialized. We no longer have any ammunition or brass having sold out years ago.

I looked up the data on our old 124gr load and it was an OEM powder that was not commercially available to reloaders and has been long discontinued. The closest thing to it would be Accurate No 7. I would start with a charge weight of about 10.5 grains and work up to a max Charge weight of 11.3 grains watching for excess pressure signs. Hope this information helps you out.

Peter R Pi Sr
President & CEO
CorBon/Glaser Products
1311 Industry Rd
Sturgis, SD 57785
Ph 605.347.4544
Fax 605.347.5055
Dakota Ammo
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