You guys are great with sharing information and ideas on this forum and I would love to get some of your ideas on this topic.

I have noticed many threads and posts with discussions about whether or not S&W could still make the 3rd gen guns and sell them. I wonder how many of you agree with me that the problem with these gun’s slow sales had less to do with the advent of the plastic gun market and more to do with the fact that these 3rd gens were based on a 50 year old design and just looked "stale".

I believe when S&W introduced the TSW models with the riveted-on black rail they missed a chance to re-design this gun as a 4th generation gun. The market was clearly going “tactical” so I understand why the rails had to be introduced. But the bolt on rail looked cheap and out of place. It ruined the good looking lines of these guns. A milled-in rail would have been much better. The so-called TSW series features such as the larger frame rails, tighter tolerances throughout, steel guide rod, laser etched billboard, etc; were worthwhile new features but the guns did not come off as something new but rather just improved.

Many of you bring up the price as a issue but I whole-heartedly disagree. If people will pay $1200 to $1400 for all steel 1911’s then I bet they would pay $1000 for a modern 3rd gen. I bet that the average gun buyer has more disposable income to spend on guns today than they did back in 1990 and I clearly remember these all steel guns selling for $500 to $800 back then which in todays dollars is like $800 to $1100. Today’s buyer is willing and able to buy something “different” or “cool” even if they don’t need it. Just look how aggressively manufactures have had to re-style their new “1911” models in order to stay marketable. Just look at the "E" series guns.

The way I see it S&W would sell a lot of these 3rd gen guns if they would do the following:

1) THE SLIDE: Re-design the slide with the scalloped look like what we saw on guns like the “Shorty-Forty”. Re-design the “cocking” serrations with a new fresh design like the “fish scale” look or something similar. In short, make it look new and fresh. Make the slide so that you could change out the Walther style safety levers from “decock/safety on” to “decock only, return to fire” and also make it DAO if desired. Re-design the Novak sights to be bolder and include a modern option of a rear adjustable sight and fiber optic tubes.

2) THE FRAME: The frame should be re-designed to have a more ergonomic grip (think of HK’s excellent P30 or Walther’s PPQ) and I am not talking about the plastic grip but rather the metal frame area of the grip. Of course a mill in a integral rail for the light you will never mount on it.

3) WEIGHT: These guns could go on a diet. How about the use of scandium in the frame or maybe “skeletonizing” the frame and slide to save weight.

4) THE GRIP: Simply a cosmetic change would be welcome here but no reason that there could not be more choices available for grip “shapes”.

5) INTERNALS: The inner workings on these guns are excellent but there are too many parts and this is a design from the 1940’s. We have learned a lot since then so no reason that modern machining and computers can’t do better.

6) FINISH: We need a Melonite finish as a option.

7) MODULARITY: These guns beg for interchangeable slides and magazines. Imagine how well this would sell: A 10mm gun that has a frame with a shortened grip for compactness (think of a 4516 compared to a 4506) but with magazines that have the option of extensions so that when inserted not only extend the capacity but also extend the grip to be like a full size frame. The slides could be sold as “kits”. Imagine a 3.75, 4.25, 5.00, and a 6.00 inch slide choice. Of course the “new design” slides could be changed from traditional DA/SA with a safety to DAO without any special tools. How many of you would like to carry a concealed small frame DAO 10mm gun by day and have the option to swap the slide out in 10 seconds to the 6.00 inch slide with traditional DA/SA with safety when you are “in the woods”?


What are your ideas?