Here's a picture of Nill grips on my 617. I did not buy them originally so don't know if they were stock off the shelf or custom ordered. I'm guessing stock. I have medium sized hands, and a K Frame with factory target grips fit me just fine. The Nill's are thicker front to back and are a stretch for me in double action. I have considered sanding the backstrap down for a better reach. But, they are perfect for single action shooting which I do the most of with this gun.