confederate
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I read that Smith& wesson designed there snub nose revolvers to shoot most accurate with 158 grain ammo and that lighter ammo tends to shoot low. Anybody know if this is true?
Snub nose, most accurate ammo
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S&W (and Colt) typically regulated the sights of all their fixed sight .38 Special revolvers (snubbies and otherwise) for factory 158 grain lead .38 Spl ammo. Generally, lighter bullets will hit lower than the 158 grainers, and will often be off in windage, as well.
JohnnieB
US Veteran
The "Standard" Police round for many years was .38spl 158gr LRN, so POA/POI of most .38spl revolvers were (and still are) regulated to it, regardless of barrel length.
It is true that lighter bullets tend to impact lower, but you specifically mentioned snub nosed revolvers, which are short range weapons, so the downward shift in POI might not be a significant issue.
Put it this way, a two inch POI shift at 25 yards will be less than an inch at 10 yards and only slightly more than the diameter of the bullet at five yards.
To each their own, but I avoid the issue by carrying 158gr LSWCHP +P in my snubbies.
It is true that lighter bullets tend to impact lower, but you specifically mentioned snub nosed revolvers, which are short range weapons, so the downward shift in POI might not be a significant issue.
Put it this way, a two inch POI shift at 25 yards will be less than an inch at 10 yards and only slightly more than the diameter of the bullet at five yards.
To each their own, but I avoid the issue by carrying 158gr LSWCHP +P in my snubbies.
You've got two different issues here. The most accurate (smallest shot group) ammo in your pistol may vary. Try a variety.
As for POA/POI, that's a different question. Previous posts are accurate about vertical dispersion, however, both the stocks (grips) on the weapon and your grip can also have major affects on vertical shot placement. Most snubbies were made with high front sights. A file can make the necessary corrections to raise the impact point to your preference once you decide what you want to carry. [Filing the front sight down raises the point of impact. Doesn't take much.]
As for POA/POI, that's a different question. Previous posts are accurate about vertical dispersion, however, both the stocks (grips) on the weapon and your grip can also have major affects on vertical shot placement. Most snubbies were made with high front sights. A file can make the necessary corrections to raise the impact point to your preference once you decide what you want to carry. [Filing the front sight down raises the point of impact. Doesn't take much.]
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G.T. Smith
US Veteran
I have tried a few different weights of bullets in my 37 no dash 1 7/8" and have found that the 158 grain LRN, for me, is the most consistent round. But like WR Moore said, the grips and the way you hold them can make all the difference in the world. Personally I like the PC round butt magnas that came on my revolver, because they fit my hand and I think that that makes as much difference as bullet weight in my case.
Peace,
gordon
Peace,
gordon
OP
confederate
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Thanks for all the replys. When you dont know the answer, ask the people that do. Right? I think I will give the 158 gr ammo a try. Sounds like it is working for yall. Thanks again for the help.
I've found my model 60 shoots the Federal 110 grain reduced recoil self-defense ammo closer to point of aim than anything else I've tried. Of course, could be me, not the gun, or maybe a combination of both.
DustyJacket
Member
As far as ACCURATE, 148gr hollow base wad cutters are accurate light target loads.
ArchAngelCD
Moderator, SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
Like the others here I mostly use 158gr LSWC/HP ammo in my revolvers including my snub nose. When I do use different ammo in my snub nose it's usually Speer short barrel 135gr .38 Special +P ammo. I know it shoots 3" low and 2" to the left from my M642 so I adjust the POA accordingly, not really a problem.
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Hurryin' Hoosier
US Veteran
Well, three dits, four dits, two dits, a dah. ASA, Sir! I thought I was the only LFCF still around!
calapooia
Member
I found that the Hornary Critical Defense, 110 grain, non plus P shot to point of aim,out of my model 60. Have not tried it in my other J's
G.T. Smith
US Veteran
Remington Raider!
No, HH, yer not the only one around. Have you checked out the veterans section. Quite a few of us around. I wound up in the 318th electronic warfare unit in Augsburg Germany in '71.
Radio teletype.
Remington Raiders, we never retreat we just backspace!
Peace,
gordon
No, HH, yer not the only one around. Have you checked out the veterans section. Quite a few of us around. I wound up in the 318th electronic warfare unit in Augsburg Germany in '71.
Radio teletype.
Remington Raiders, we never retreat we just backspace!
Peace,
gordon
Hurryin' Hoosier
US Veteran
No, HH, yer not the only one around. Have you checked out the veterans section. Quite a few of us around. I wound up in the 318th electronic warfare unit in Augsburg Germany in '71.
Radio teletype.
Remington Raiders, we never retreat we just backspace!
Peace,
gordon
I'll have to do that, buddy. Good to hear from you.
05K2O '66-'70
Beautiful Shemya ("The Black Pearl of the Aleutians", you know) and Asmara (from which I'm still trying to sober up!)
NNNN
Sgt55
Member
I found that the most accurate round in my 442 is 148gr wadcutters (match grade). Laser accurate out to 20 yards.
After performing somewhat extensive ammo accuracy testing with my M&P 360 w/3" barrel, I was surprised to find that the 158 gr. +P LSWCHP were not the most on-target.
By far, this particular pistol shoots Remington Golden Saber 125 gr. +P the most accurately (three of five shots less than 1" from dead center from 8 yards), followed closely by Fiocchi 125 gr. XTP rounds.
But, as mentioned previously, the biggest difference in accuracy was to be found in the grips - for me, the Hogue monogrip outperformed the Pachmayr Compac and the S&W originals.
So, the lesson learned for me is to get the right grip first, and then test various brands/loads of ammo.
By far, this particular pistol shoots Remington Golden Saber 125 gr. +P the most accurately (three of five shots less than 1" from dead center from 8 yards), followed closely by Fiocchi 125 gr. XTP rounds.
But, as mentioned previously, the biggest difference in accuracy was to be found in the grips - for me, the Hogue monogrip outperformed the Pachmayr Compac and the S&W originals.
So, the lesson learned for me is to get the right grip first, and then test various brands/loads of ammo.
ArchAngelCD
Moderator, SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
Speaking for myself alone, I prefer a heavier bullet in the .38 Special because IMO it "hits harder". I am not a fan of light for caliber bullets in any application. I feel there are optimum bullet weights for each caliber and try to stick with those weights.
I like 145gr and 158gr bullets in the .38 Special
I like 124/125gr bullets in the 9mm
I like 230gr bullets in the .45 Auto
I like 165gr bullets in the 30-06
I like a 170gr bullet in the 30-30
Sure, other bullets weights will work well and other shooters may like different bullet weights than I do. I don't think that makes anyone wrong, just a difference of opinion.
carbofan21
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My 642-1 (first run of no lock guns) produced in 2008 shoots to point-of-aim (@ 25 feet) with the 135gr speer gdsb load, and just a tad high with 158gr loads.
Factory boot grips on mine.
Factory boot grips on mine.
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For target work I use my own reloads which I seat Round Nose Lead 158 grain bullets in (different manufacturers depending on the deal at the time of purchase). I have found they are about the most accurate for me. These of course are range loads, NOT carry loads. For carry I always use Buffalo Bore ammo.
Chief38
Chief38
Thanks Angel. When I shoot 158 in my snubby I swear it hits a lot higher than a lighter round. Maybe it's in my head (or more likely, my technique!).
And if John Moses meant us to shoot anything other than 230 gr hardball in our .45's I'm sure he would have invented it!
