9mm Browning Court = .380 Auto?

robrossk · Dec 24, 2019

Seems the answer is yes. As S&B is a European company the phrase 9mm short, 9mm cort, and 9mm corte are very common. But I do not recall ever seeing 9mm Browning Court. My quick and non-sophisticated ruler measurements indicate the same case width. The attached pics though indicate 9mm BRC on the headstamp. I was a bit surprised, but think I am good to go. Any input appreciated.

For reference, I recently bought a Shield EZ 380 for an awesome price (incl rebate), and bought some ammo at local guns show. Was getting ready to load magazines for a range trip and noticed the box marking and headstamp.

CZU · Dec 24, 2019

One in the same..the only difference you might see is the case rim and the S&B is a little hotter.(in my experience)AKA as 9mm kurz, I have Walther PPK's that are marked as such.

diyj98 · Dec 24, 2019

Sometimes you’ll find 9mm kurz on the older European stuff as well.

federali · Dec 24, 2019

9mm Corto

Ive seen 9mm corto, which is short, I believe in both Spanish and Italian. As for 9mm "court," this could be a typo in which somebody wasn't doing his job.

s&wchad · Dec 24, 2019

I agree with federali, “Court” was a poor English translation of corto.

Their product code (SB380A) is a good hint!

glenwolde · Dec 24, 2019

9mm Court is the C.I.P designation for what we call .380 ACP. C.I.P is like SAMMI, but for everybody outside the United States.

As usual...the Americans go their own way.

bulletslap · Dec 24, 2019

And in pistol ammo C.I.P standards are a little higher pressure than S.A.M.M.I, generally, but not in all cases.

colt_saa · Dec 24, 2019

Ive seen 9mm corto, which is short, I believe in both Spanish and Italian. As for 9mm "court," this could be a typo in which somebody wasn't doing his job.

It is not a typo

The Official designation for the cartridge by CIP actually is "9 mm Browning Court "

robrossk,
The 380 ACP cartridge is known by many names around the world. I will probably miss one or two but here goes:

380 ACP
380 Auto
9×17
9mm Browning
9mm Short
9mm Kurz
9mm Corto

Echo40 · Dec 24, 2019

Yep, "9mm Short" is merely the European nomenclature for the .380 ACP cartridge. A word of warning though, European .380 ACP tends to be loaded hotter than North American ammo, so don't be surprised if it has more recoil than your average domestically produced ammo.
So yeah, if you've ever wondered why European .380 Pistols like the Walther PPK and Beretta Cheetah are built like tanks or why European police carried .380 Pistols well into the 1980s, that's why.

Also, funny bit of trivia, contrary to what the European nomenclature may suggest, the .380 ACP cartridge isn't a shortened 9mm Luger, but rather a scaled down .45 ACP.

robrossk · Dec 24, 2019

So would S&W consider this to be +P ammo? The EZ owner does manual suggests to not use +P ammo as it may cause excessive wear

murphydog · Dec 24, 2019

An older online test of this round showed a velocity of 872 fps out of a subcompact gun, so I would suspect pressures are within SAAMI standards.

Kurusu · Dec 24, 2019

federali said:
Ive seen 9mm corto, which is short, I believe in both Spanish and Italian. As for 9mm "court," this could be a typo in which somebody wasn't doing his job.

Not a typo. Court is short in French. And C.I.P.(Commision Internacionale Permanente) documentation is in French.

colt_saa · Dec 24, 2019

robrossk said:
So would S&W consider this to be +P ammo? The EZ owner does manual suggests to not use +P ammo as it may cause excessive wear

Only if the particular manufacturer loaded to the very extreme top of CIP specifications

A pressure standard (SAAMI or CIP) is a number that is not to be exceeded, it is not a number that must be reached

leonardocarrillo · Dec 24, 2019

It is correct what Kuruzu says, court means short in French, in the ammunition box they write 9 mm Browning court to differentiate it from the 9 mm Browning Long, which is the caliber of the Browning pistol model 1903.
The short 9mm Browning is the European version of the .380 ACP.

glenwolde · Dec 24, 2019

Dirty Harry Callahan said:
Also, funny bit of trivia, contrary to what the European nomenclature may suggest, the .380 ACP cartridge isn't a shortened 9mm Luger, but rather a scaled down .45 ACP.

Indeed, since the 9x19 has a tapered case and the .380 ACP does not. Hard to claim they are related.

The .380 ACP and the .45 ACP were designed by the same you-know-who genius and the dimensions of the .45 ACP scaled down are pretty dang close.

Texas Star · Dec 24, 2019

Look how long it took for a member to tell that "Court" is French...

Thanks to Kurusu and Leonardo. They solved the mystery.

BTW, Kurusu, what is Portuguese for Short? Same as in Spanish?

Echo40 · Dec 24, 2019

glenwolde said:
Indeed, since the 9x19 has a tapered case and the .380 ACP does not. Hard to claim they are related.

The .380 ACP and the .45 ACP were designed by the same you-know-who genius and the dimensions of the .45 ACP scaled down are pretty dang close.

Yep, but I've seen more than a few folks make comments which at least imply that they're related while alluding to the European nomenclature. Comments like; ".380 ACP, aka '9mm Short' in Europe, is (as the name would suggest) less powerful than 9mm Luger." are made from time to time in threads, and IIRC, I've seen at least a couple poorly-written articles make similar statements as well.

Meanwhile, anyone who can use Google or Wikipedia knows that 9mm Luger is a descendant of the 7.65x21 Parabellum cartridge and .380 ACP was based on the .45 ACP.

On a bit of a side note, I find it somewhat amusing that for all the comments Europeans make about Americans being stubborn because we haven't adopted the Metric System, at least we're not the ones nonsensically renaming European cartridges with metric designations to confusing/misleading names based on United States Customary Units.
Seriously, imagine if we insisted on calling 9mm Luger, .357 Luger Automatic Pistol or something.

Kurusu · Dec 25, 2019

Texas Star said:
Look how long it took for a member to tell that "Court" is French...

Thanks to Kurusu and Leonardo. They solved the mystery.

BTW, Kurusu, what is Portuguese for Short? Same as in Spanish?

In Portuguese it's "curto".

wetdog1911 · Dec 25, 2019

Kurusu said:
In Portuguese it's "curto".

In universal sign language, it's holding the thumb & forefinger about 1/2" apart.

MERRY CHRISTMAS YA'LL !

My 1971 PPK/S is marked 9mm kurtz FWIW

Rob

Kurusu · Dec 25, 2019

wetdog1911 said:
In universal sign language, it's holding the thumb & forefinger about 1/2" apart.

MERRY CHRISTMAS YA'LL !

My 1971 PPK/S is marked 9mm kurtz FWIW

Rob

There is a story about that sign in Portugal.

Anglos laughed at Portuguese for being short. And Portuguese showed them this one sign in reply.

9mm Browning Court = .380 Auto?

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