Shooting some old GI .45 ACP Ball cartridges

DWalt

DWalt

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I was shooting at my range last week, and brought along some old GI .45 ACP ball cartridges from WWI, WWII, and Korea that I chronographed from my Colt M1911. From oldest to newest, these are the results (rounded to the closest digit):

1. REM-UMC 18 (WWI, brass case). 5 rounds fired, average MV = 764 ft/sec, spread = 64 ft/sec. I did not calculate standard deviation due to the small number of shots. I actually attempted to fire 8 shots, but three were duds.
2. RA 42 (WWII, brass case). 10 rounds fired, average MV = 836 ft/sec, standard deviation = 19 ft/sec
3. EC 43 (WWII, steel case). 10 rounds fired, average MV = 780 ft/sec, standard deviation = 17 ft/sec
4. TW 54 (Korean war-almost, steel case). 5 rounds fired, average MV = 850 ft/sec, spread = 35 ft/sec. I did not calculate standard deviation due to the small number of shots.

The latest military specification velocity information for the .45 ACP I have is 855 +/- 25 ft/sec at 25.5 feet, standard deviation <= 37 ft/sec. Presumably this is from the standard 5" M1911 barrel, but the specifications do not mention barrel length.
 
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I remember buying EC 43 and EC 44 ammo for five dollars per hundred rounds. Never had a problem with the steel cases but did need to clean after firing due to the corrosive primers.
 
OFT II said:
I remember buying EC 43 and EC 44 ammo for five dollars per hundred rounds. Never had a problem with the steel cases but did need to clean after firing due to the corrosive primers.
Click to expand...

I once bought 25 boxes of the steel-case EC .45 ammo for $2/box at an estate sale. Aside from the corrosive primers, there is one other problem. Fired steel cases tend to stick badly in my M1917 chambers. I have read this is a common problem with revolvers.
 
Sorry to see the WWl ammo had three duds but at least some fired.

My ammo that old has "Green stuff" growing on it..............

I generally take some Brasso to the dirty brass cases and then remove that vile stuff with a soft cleaner that will not harm the brass, over time.

When my lead bullets start to turn "light Gray or white" it is time to fire the ammo and start over.

Old ammo is interesting but I prefer less than 5 year old stuff for practice.
 
I had a bunch of the Evansville Ordinance 43 steel case my father
won at auction at Ft Sill OK when I was a boy. After I left home
he gave it to me and being poor as a church mouse I reloaded
it.(Didn't know it wasn't easy to reload) I averaged 5 reloads
before cases started splitting. Still have a couple boxes of the
GI stuff.
 
One interesting thing about the REM-UMC 18 ammo is the primer pocket. Its diameter is too small to accept a Large Pistol primer, so the primer pocket must be reamed larger. This is not because of a crimp as there is no crimp. It is a bit of a job to ream them.
 
DWalt, my US M1911 Ball ammo is newer than yours. Made by Olin Corp. and head stamped WCC-77. Muzzle velocity was 827fps & standard deviation of 16. All rounds fired normally. It helps that has been packed in a USGI ammo can in a cool basement for most of its life.
 
Nevada Ed said:
My ammo that old has "Green stuff" growing on it..............

I generally take some Brasso to the dirty brass cases and then remove that vile stuff with a soft cleaner that will not harm the brass, over time.
Click to expand...

Too much work. I just toss that stuff in my tumbler with walnut & Nu Finish. :D
 
Mid-1970's the police department providing my paychecks traded off all the Model 1921 Thompson guns in the armory. Stacks and stacks of surplus .45ACP, most from WW2 and some from WW1 with 1918 headstamps. A nickel per round cash and carry.

I shot up all of it, WW1 and WW2 vintage, brass case and steel case. I don't remember a single failure in any of it. About the same time I purchased a US Model 1911 Colt from a retired Army officer along with original holster, belt, mag pouches, and 3 two-tone WW1 mags still loaded with 1918 ammo, and it worked just as well as when it was new.

My current stash includes several boxes of FC-63 ball ammo and a little treasure of WCC-66 tracer-ball. I will trust it any day of the week!
 
Somewhere in my ammo stash is a sealed spam can of the Russian-repacked 45 GI Ball, packed in 42 round boxes; I thing Southern Ohio Gun(?) was the importer? My guess is as long as it stays sealed, it will all probably go bang just fine. The loose boxes I bought at the same time all fired with no problem, but it's been a while. Obviously, all corrosive though. The 42 round box is a bit of a head scratcher - someone once told me that it was the same box they used for 7.62x54R, and it just happened to work out that way - no idea if that's true.



The Denver '43 M2 Ball .30-06 that CMP was selling years ago all went bang just fine, too.



As long as storage has been ok, it makes great practice ammo.
 
RWJ said:
Somewhere in my ammo stash is a sealed spam can of the Russian-repacked 45 GI Ball, packed in 42 round boxes; I thing Southern Ohio Gun(?) was the importer? My guess is as long as it stays sealed, it will all probably go bang just fine. The loose boxes I bought at the same time all fired with no problem, but it's been a while. Obviously, all corrosive though. The 42 round box is a bit of a head scratcher - someone once told me that it was the same box they used for 7.62x54R, and it just happened to work out that way - no idea if that's true.
Click to expand...

I seem to remember seeing something suggesting that those repacked 42 round Russian boxes of .45 ACP have mainly mixed USGI headstamps. And they are indeed Russian 7.62x25 (not 7.62x54R) boxes. Nothing magic about 42 rounds, that is just the number of rounds which would fit in the existing boxes. There is a theory that they might not even have been repackaged by the Russians, as they have been found in various locations around the world. The boxes are usually found labeled in English. All in all, there is some mystery involved as to their original source and purpose.
 
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You're right about it being mixed mfgr. I just went downstairs and got a box off the shelf that was not part of the sealed case, and was comprised of 27-RA 42, 1 FA-42, 4 WRA 45A.C., and 10-WCC 42. All still looks as good as any from a box as recent GI ball, and unless you looked at the headstamp. you'd never know it was WW2 ammo. I just happened to have a box of 7.63x25 on the shelf, (even though I don't own a gun in that caliber?:confused:), and it seemed to me to be a little long to go in the box without a slight bulging, but that may have been the way they packed those. These boxes are unmarked. The sealed can is marked in English with a different than normal stencil, but lists the ammo as 11,43mm. The can and opener appear to be the same as known Russian cans I've seen, but it could very well be a common industry item. There's probably enough of the WCC 42 or RA 42 to do some testing, if you'd like some. I basically bought it to go with a pristine Colt Commercial/convert to military that I have in my collection that's original and about 98% or better.
 
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EC 43 WWII , zinc plated steel cased , 45 acp ....bought and shot a lot of this .
It reloaded very well also , almost lasting as long as GI brass cases .
When I tell people about having 45 acp WWII steel cased ammo a lot don't believe we made and used it back then ....but we did and it worked very well .
Some things aren't new !
Gary
 
For those interested in Chrysler's WWII small arms ammunition production at Evansville (mostly steel case .45 ACP and .30 Carbine), I can recommend reading Wesley W. Stout's book "Bullets by the Billion." I have an original hard cover copy, but I believe you can find a free digital copy somewhere on the internet. Or look on eBay.
Bullets by the Billions 1946 Chrysler Corporation | eBay
 
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Based on what you gentlemen have found by actually chronographing GI ball ammo, the actual velocity is not the advertised 855 fps +/-25 fps, but is realistically 825 fps +/-25 fps.
 
I inherited a lot of late 60's early 70's 230 hardball from my late pa-in-law. So far, it has all shot flawlessly. It is all still in ammo cans in boxes, high and dry. It shoots better than some modern day fodder. I had found some stray rounds when cleaning up his garage that had the green copper oxide corrosion on it. Tossed them in the tumbler and it cleaned them up. All shot flawlessly. Seems like the ones I chronographed in my 5" 1911 were averaging about 825 or so.

Rosewood
 
In the past year I shot some FC65 in a 5 1/2 in. M1917 and 5 shots avg. 789fps. I had the barrel cut to 3 3/8 in. and 5 shots avg. 727fps. I didn't write down the deviation between shots. Larry
 
tops said:
In the past year I shot some FC65 in a 5 1/2 in. M1917 and 5 shots avg. 789fps. I had the barrel cut to 3 3/8 in. and 5 shots avg. 727fps. I didn't write down the deviation between shots. Larry
Click to expand...

Revolvers lose velocity because of the cylinder gap.
 
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