Had forgotten that S&W had Nyclad before Federal took it over. Wonder if they made the ammo or had it manufactured?
Besides being a gun store owner that handled S&W products, my dad was also a gun writer.
The hand written label makes me think maybe this was some of the 1st ammo. Perhaps it was sent to my dad so he could write about it.
78121211X hand written on the flap of the box. Guess that was the product number.
Anyone remember when this ammo came out?

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David Reynolds

I still have several boxes of it after Federal took it over, in 158 grain SWC and hollow point. It was the NYPD duty ammo for many years until the Gold Dot took over.

I believe it was early to mid 1970's...

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Tom
SWCA 1856, SWHF 780

SWC = Semi WadCutter
What does WSWC stand for?

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Regards,
Lee Jarrett

Never mind----
I think that reads NSWC for Nyclad SWC.

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Regards,
Lee Jarrett

Could that be an N, as in Nylon SemiWadCutter?

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Formerly Model520Fan

I still have a box of the .38 +P and run it in my snubby for CCW. Back in the day, it had a tremendous self-defense rating!! I still think it has some attributes.
Thank for sharing!!!
I sold a full box of the .357 a few years ago for $75.

Nyclad ammunition was originally introduced by Fiocchi. It was marketed by S&W through it's S&W-Fiocchi connection before being discontinued by S&W and picked up by Federal. This all occurred during the 1970 era and into the 1980s.

Amazing I can remember that far back. And we didn't even get a telephone until 1884...

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Pisgah

Curious as to who he was.

Nobody you ever heard of. His name was David Reynolds, same as mine.
He wrote for an industry publication named American Firearms Industry for several years. Had a regular column and also represented them at the trade shows like Denver and Chicago and later the SHOT Show when it started in 1979.
Had an annual article for Gun Digest for several years. Also did some free lance work for American Handgunner and others.
Think his byline was Dave Reynolds most of the time.

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David Reynolds

In those days I thought Nyclads were 'ahead of their time'. Too bad they died out. I would like to see them tested by modern methods for penetration, expansion and possibly refined. I suppose the Hi-tek coating is superior but the characteristics of the HPSWC could be effective given given the right configuration and hardness.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

Yes, you're right.
Appreciate the follow up.

Heck ya I remember it. Been a while for sure. Wonder how much they cost back in the 70s. probably a shocker now. Nice to see the box now.

I still keep 6 rounds of the 158 grain +P Hollow Points in my house revolver, a Model 681. Two speedloaders of it sit in the safe alongside it. I shot 6 rounds a year ago. Still works fine and will do its job if I ever had to unfortunately use it.

As I remember it, the concept of Nyclad was higher velocity without leading because of the nylon coating. Also let you use a softer alloy for better expansion.
In our tests, after the ammo was Federal, the non +P 125 SWCHP gave .60 caliber expansion from 2" barrels.
Most of us in the store carried S&Ws with 2 or 3" barrels. The Nyclad ammo was what we carried for years and years.
My lady has that loaded in her S&W Model 37 2" that she keeps in the nightstand.

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David Reynolds

They were ahead of their time , and the concept Does have potential.

But it was strategic business decision for Federal . They saw it as needlessly competing against their own premium offerings.

For years afterwards they would occasionally put out limited runs of the " Chiefs Special " 125 HP Non Plus P .38 Special .

It had a cult following as being the best Non +P offering , and boxes of the original were selling for steep prices ( for the Era) .

Thought the back of the box might be instructive. Says made in USA.

S&W Ammunition Co.
Member S&W Sporting Goods Group
Rock Creek, Ohio 44084

Guess that is where it was manufactured.

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David Reynolds

I still have a couple boxes of the 125gr non +P and 158gr swc +P in 38 spl and at least 4 boxes of the 9mm load. The 9mm was very soft shooting and I used it in my small frame CCW pistols for controllability.

So your Dad worked for Andrew

I went to my first SHOT show in Dallas with AFI, but I can not recall how many years ago that was.

I must have met your Dad at the booth one of those years

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"Acta non verba"

Rock Creek was a manufacturer and distributor of law enforcement equipment, such as handcuffs and tear gas launchers and gas munitions. S&W bought them in the early 70's.
The rumor about Nyclad's discontinuance was that after firing, the nylon "jacket" would fill back into the grooves, making it impossible to match the bullet to the gun that fired it. Don't know if that's actually true.

colt saa,
My dad died in 1992. Not sure when he quit working for AFI. Here is a letter to my dad from Roy Jinks in 1978.
What years did you work for them?

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David Reynolds

That was true for the very very early production and was quickly reformulated to hold the lands and groove markings like conventional bullets…

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Tom
SWCA 1856, SWHF 780

...for people that want to run backwards wadcutters in their guns. But, if they perfected the Nyclads as a defensive round, people would still want to use backwards wadcutter in their guns.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

I bought several cases of Nyclad 158g .38 sp including some +P back around 1983.
The boxes look like OP's..
I still have a case to go through.
Semi wad cutters,I believe.
It's good stuff!

While the SWC Nyclad round is probably a step up from the 158 grain RNL, it is really not a spectacular SD round compared to modern ammo. I suppose back in the day it was sought after as an improvement, but today there are much better choices IMHO.

If purchasing for nostalgia (they are neat looking), I understand but IMHO it is now nothing special as a SD cartridge.

Another urban legend I heard about the Nyclad discontinuance was that they could defeat standard bulletproof vests.

Not sure when I purchased the Federal Nyclad, but it was likely 10 or so years ago. The 642 was purchased in 2010, so I know it was some time after that. I still have 2 1/2 boxes of it. Federal re-introduced the Nyclad 125gr. HP in .38 Spl. at the 2009 Shot Show.

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SWCA 3297 SWHF 583

This piece of male bovine feces was handcrafted by newspaper people who confused the nylon coating of S&W's ammo with the Teflon coating of KTW. The Teflon coating of KTW was purely to protect the bore. KTW WAS a vest-killer, AFAIK primarily because of the velocity, and the use of a very hard bullet which would not deform at that velocity.

At that time, use of soft body armor by police was not well known. After these "journalists" publicized it, the incidence of head shots against police went up considerably. Cop-killer journalists? Yes. Cop-killer bullets by S&W and Federal? No.

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Formerly Model520Fan

I still have a partial box of the Federal Nyclad .38+P 158 grain LSWCHP "FBI Loads".
They are very accurate in my Colt Detective Special and quite controllable. In my S&W Model 640 they are a bit more stout feeling and less easy to shoot well. I know that better self defense rounds have become available since the 1980's but I would have no problem carrying these.

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Early Nyclad projectiles were black, like the KTWs. This is how
the urban legend got started.
Later production was blue. Neither would penetrate.
I still have a couple of boxes of each.

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I'm with her

Off topic, but I point to this to question people who used to lube their bullets with moly who said that the lubricant actually made their loads run SLOWER. Their 'reasoning' was that "It gets out of the barrel quicker so pressure doesn't build up as much". If it gets out of the barrel quicker it IS going FASTER. At least to my reasoning.

PS I got back into shooting in the middle of the 'moly' craze. I almost jumped on the bandwagon, until I read and thought about it. I'm glad I never touched the stuff.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

Found a box of the Federal Nyclad. Also found a couple of rounds of the S&W Hollow Points. Pic of the Federal and the S&W rounds. The S&W has the classic SWC profile.

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David Reynolds

Mine (all that is left) is all Federal 9mm in nickel cases.. Still shoots great!

Cheers!

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Sit Reloader Sentiret

I had thought about that at my first look at this post. It sort of reminds me of the old KTW ammo, but not spire pointed as the KTW was. Still have a round or two of the KTW somewhere in this mess.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

I still have most of a box of the Federal made 38 Spl +P with the blue Nyclad HP bullet and nickel cases. They are my reserve ammo for social work in the Model 60-4. I’d sure love to find a couple more boxes, S&W or Federal, either would be fine!
Froggie

Interesting. The KTWs that I have seen were greenish. Have you seen any of those?

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Formerly Model520Fan

The ones that I had were green teflon coated. I believe the projectile was tungsten cored.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

It is close. I think that first SHOT Show I attended was in 1990. Now I have to find my old Show notes. With the max of a 2 year overlap I may not have interacted with your Dad much if at all

I only remember the year because Hogue had the very first wood grip for the third gens on display. Brazillion Rosewood on a 4506, beautiful piece of wood. Guy Hogue gave me that set of grips as we were tearing down the booth.

I got the 1006 from S&W that same Show and that was how I did the 10MM review, wearing those grips

I first Met Roy at that 1990 show, I am pretty sure he was Captain of the Factory's Shooting Team back then. His passion was always contagious. I have enjoyed every interaction we have had over the decades

Sorry to you other guys in the thread, probably should have taken the drift Private

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"Acta non verba"

The Nyclad (nylon clad) was a good bullet.

You and IM56F are quite correct. I checked my notes and the
Nyclad blacks started to get the "penetrator" reputation solely
because of the black nylon coating.
Federal switched to blue to make shooters think that the nylon
coating was benign.
I apologize for the misinformation.

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I'm with her

I recall being able to buy bulk Nylon coated bullets at gun shows in the early 80's. I had several thousand of the 158 Gr. that were very accurate when loaded appropriately. Wish they still made them.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

A little late to the party, I still have a box of the Federal Nyclad that was tucked away in an ammo box, debating about whether to shoot it-I have a whole bunch of Gold Dot .38+P so no need to load it up in the revolvers.

There isn't a price sticker on the box and of course I can't remember what I paid for it or even exactly when I bought it but it was shortly after Federal took it over lol.

Anyone know what "Company"

labeled the end of the box in "free hand"

instead of a printing machine?

No wonder that "N" was messed up, after a days shift.

I also remember getting those bullets too. A I remember they were in a blue box and they were cheap. I know I got mine from a wholesale distributor in New Jersey...Robert's Shell Co in Vineland...but I can't remember the brand name...something like Taurus but not just right.

I have a box of 148 gr wad cutters Nyclad in my stash.

Here are a few boxes of the S & W Nyclad 38 special

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MSG US Army