Boston....Rant...

[dnonac]

I have a good friend that will be moving to Boston soon due to a promotion and transfer with his job. Like many young men, he made a mistake about 10 years ago and got a DUI in California. He only has 1 gun....an old M&P shipped in 1913. He told me he just found out that he won't be able to even take his gun to Mass due to the past DUI; much less get a carry permit.

I did a little digging last night on the net and read about a guy that got a DUI when he was 21. At age 65, he moved to Boston and was denied the FID and any chance at a carry permit. Yet, I'm sure there are people driving around Boston with multiple DUI's that haven't even lost their drivers license! I've visited Boston several times in the past and really enjoyed the historical aspects and the lobster. I'll need a real good reason to visit again!

Enough of a rant for today. It's raining and I've got some guns to clean!

God bless Texas!

[Chuck1217]

And thenk the Lord for the NRA, if anyone can get stupid laws like thqat chenged it's them. I know others exist and are very helpful, like the 2nd A Foundation, it's just the NRA is so active these days. And there are just so many things that violate the Constitution that need to be changed, but one step at a time. We seem to be going in the wrong direction, though. God bless SC, too.

[ladder13]

Boston is a great town, especially for the young folk looking for a place to party.
As far as the gun laws go, I prefer not to comment on them since I know very little about them.

[zoom6zoom]

One of the problems in Massachusetts is that every town or city has their own rules for issuing permits (if they do at all). There is no state-wide standard.

[fiasconva]

If that DUI was 10 years ago it may not even be in the data base any more. He should check to see if there is even any record of it. He just may be good to go.

[Beachcomber]

Originally Posted by dnonac

I have a good friend that will be moving to Boston soon due to a promotion and transfer with his job. Like many young men, he made a mistake about 10 years ago and got a DUI in California. He only has 1 gun....an old M&P shipped in 1913. He told me he just found out that he won't be able to even take his gun to Mass due to the past DUI; much less get a carry permit.

I believe the following link will answer all of your questions:

Firearms Records Bureau - Executive Office of Public Safety - Mass.Gov

..

[lil'Bill]

Tell your friend to contact the folks at GOAL for advise on moving into the state... Gun Owners' Action League - GOAL.org - "Protecting Your Freedom Begins Here"

[dnonac]

Thanks for the links. Will do!

[Squarebutt]

GOAL is the best source for MA gun law info. I'm a member, too. If your friend is moving into the city of Boston, he should be aware that even if the DUI is no longer on his record, the city does not issue Class A (CCW) licenses to any civilians. Suburban towns are a little better. He may want to look at commuting from NH or RI, depending on his job location. Best of luck to him.

[Kavinsky]

yeah boston is one of the worst places to try and get a permit, he'd be better off trying to get one in one of the other towns as meninio is really off of his stupid damn rocker when it comes to stuff like that.

[indiandave]

Uncle Ted didn't like guns. A lot of people who work in MA live in NH.

[Faulkner]

Personnally, I think the punishment for the first DWI/DUI conviction should be capital punishment . . . electric chair, gas chamber, gallows, firing squad, whatever.

There is NO excuse for driving after drinking, none. I've seen way too many innocent people killed by drunk drivers. So, not being able to own a gun because of a DUI would be a rather menial inconveniance in my world.

[nipster]

Originally Posted by Faulkner

Personnally, I think the punishment for the first DWI/DUI conviction should be capital punishment . . . electric chair, gas chamber, gallows, firing squad, whatever.

There is NO excuse for driving after drinking, none. I've seen way too many innocent people killed by drunk drivers. So, not being able to own a gun because of a DUI would be a rather menial inconveniance in my world.

Without trying to turn this into a DUI debate, I have to respectfully disagree with your statement and say a prayer that you are not in a position to make laws.

You can have 2 drinks, be completely sober and be "legally drunk" under most states DUI laws. This is truly a travesty. People's lives are ruined forever because of the stigma that is associated with DUI and a criminal record that cannot be expunged (in most states).

And I have had 2 friends killed by drunk drivers. But the current DUI laws are madness.

MADD and the anti-alcohol lobby is mostly to blame for this.

[kennyb]

Originally Posted by nipster

Without trying to turn this into a DUI debate, I have to respectfully disagree with your statement and say a prayer that you are not in a position to make laws.

You can have 2 drinks, be completely sober and be "legally drunk" under most states DUI laws. This is truly a travesty. People's lives are ruined forever because of the stigma that is associated with DUI and a criminal record that cannot be expunged (in most states).

And I have had 2 friends killed by drunk drivers. But the current DUI laws are madness.

MADD and the anti-alcohol lobby is mostly to blame for this.

you certainly have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to the effects of alcohol on the body your analogy as to "being completly sober any yet legally drunk" likewise are absurd...i would say,as you mentioned that its YOU i pray are not in a position to make laws...

[labworm]

Originally Posted by nipster

Without trying to turn this into a DUI debate, I have to respectfully disagree with your statement and say a prayer that you are not in a position to make laws.

You can have 2 drinks, be completely sober and be "legally drunk" under most states DUI laws. This is truly a travesty. People's lives are ruined forever because of the stigma that is associated with DUI and a criminal record that cannot be expunged (in most states).

And I have had 2 friends killed by drunk drivers. But the current DUI laws are madness.

MADD and the anti-alcohol lobby is mostly to blame for this.

When do you figure you'll receive your first DUI?

[ladder13]

COMPLETELY sober after 2 drinks? I'm so glad that various groups have lobbied to get drinkers off the roads, but there's still plenty of work to do as the carnage continues. If you were in the emergency services business and saw what I and many of the cops, firefighters and EMS personnel here have seen, you'd be singing a different tune. I've seen families ruined and torn apart. I have ZERO tolerance for anyone who drinks and drives. I agree totally with Faulkner, execute them. Having a criminal record would be the least of their worries if I had anything to say about it, the offenders are lucky I don't.

[Bratastic007]

Faulkner and Ladder13:

So your position is: a man who takes his family out to dinner, and over the course of the meal has two beers or a glass of wine and then drives his family home, should be swiftly and summarily executed?

That opinion, to put it very mildly, is completely insane. For what it's worth, it's also not an opinion shared by any of the police officers I personally know. You do understand why lawmakers have established a "legal limit" for driving don't you?

I'm almost afraid to ask, but how do you feel about people who text while driving? 30 years hard labor?

Back on topic, I lived in Boston for a few years. Great city while you're going to school and can enjoy the social scene. That said, there's not a chance it's where I'd like to live as a tax paying adult.

[ladder13]

Originally Posted by Bratastic007

Faulkner and Ladder13:

So your position is: a man who takes his family out to dinner, and over the course of the meal has two beers or a glass of wine and then drives his family home, should be swiftly and summarily executed?

Yes, I've seen people who claim to have just "had a beer or two", summarily execute some poor person who was just driving to grandma's house, or coming home to HIS family after a hard days work, or a woman crossing the road with a baby in a carraige, or a young teen going to soccer practice, etc etc
I'm sure the restaurant and bar lobby, along with liquor manufacturers had something to do with the law, as all laws are the result of some special favor or lobbying effort.

You're entitled to your opinion as I.

[Bratastic007]

Originally Posted by ladder13

You're entitled to your opinion as I.

Yep. That's what makes this such a great country.

I'm sure you've seen some gruesome things in the line of work that I wouldn't want to, and those things have shaped the opinion you hold.

[geoff40]

Boston, it's hard to believe thats where the American Revolution started. Today the place is filled with minds like that of the esteemed Mayor, the Police Commissioner, the Massachusetts Governor and their DA. All of them are hard core, staunch anti gun types, the extremist sort who can't even stick with facts when they make arguments to their cause. Instead they tell lies (promoting the gun show loophole, or making false statements about gun traces for example) and half truths. I live about an hour away from the border, and I try to pay attention, but I must say I've never heard that an old DUI will prevent legal gun ownership in the Commonwealth (just that name says it all) of Massachusetts.
Is it really true? I am not sure, but I intend to find out.

[OLDFED]

Two points:
1. I went thru the "approved" gun list for MA and see there are no S&W Model 19s or Model 66s listed. Are they kidding or did I miss them?
2. I was in Norway some time back and learned that even one glass of wine with dinner is enough to get you busted for DUI. My host asked his non-drinking son to drive me back to the hotel. Evidently they heavily fine you, take your vehicle an cause much pain in the process of operating while inbibing. Good law! They also do safety checks on the vehicle you drive daily. If it doesn't pass, the car is OFF the road until it is fixed. Any broken or burned out lamps qualify. Tires, glass, dents, damage, etc also.

[wheelyfun66]

Fascistchusetts has some weird gun laws....

For non-residents, they are not issuing full carry privileges any longer (feedback from several long-time ccw holders), but only permission to bring a gun to a range or go hunting.

And...you have to pay big bucks, and appear IN PERSON every year, in order to be denied...and they keep your fees...

How did the Commonwealth go from revolutionary to....so darn...Fascist?

[Engine 21]

Originally Posted by wheelyfun66

Fascistchusetts has some weird gun laws....

For non-residents, they are not issuing full carry privileges any longer (feedback from several long-time ccw holders), but only permission to bring a gun to a range or go hunting.

And...you have to pay big bucks, and appear IN PERSON every year, in order to be denied...and they keep your fees...

How did the Commonwealth go from revolutionary to....so darn...Fascist?

Remember - "No taxation without representation". That is one reason many people left european countries along with the idea to live free of oppressive government laws.The folks that made that decision originally came on the Mayflower. Then you had the Menino crowd and the elitists' who dominate government and think they know what's best for you. They came with the Mayflower too - Mayflower Moving & Storage.

[LenS]

Originally Posted by dnonac

I have a good friend that will be moving to Boston soon due to a promotion and transfer with his job. Like many young men, he made a mistake about 10 years ago and got a DUI in California. He only has 1 gun....an old M&P shipped in 1913. He told me he just found out that he won't be able to even take his gun to Mass due to the past DUI; much less get a carry permit.

I did a little digging last night on the net and read about a guy that got a DUI when he was 21. At age 65, he moved to Boston and was denied the FID and any chance at a carry permit. Yet, I'm sure there are people driving around Boston with multiple DUI's that haven't even lost their drivers license! I've visited Boston several times in the past and really enjoyed the historical aspects and the lobster. I'll need a real good reason to visit again!

Enough of a rant for today. It's raining and I've got some guns to clean!

God bless Texas!

This is a legal "maybe". DUI with a POSSIBLE penalty of >2 year jail term (regardless of what the penalty paid was) is a LIFETIME DQ for MA and the Feds! MA changed the law so that DUI after 5/1994 makes one a Federally PP!

Since MGL allows "discretion" and "suitability" decisions by the local police chief, if one has a DUI that is NOT a DQ, some chiefs will still deny (or restrict) while others will give a LTC unrestricted.

Originally Posted by zoom6zoom

One of the problems in Massachusetts is that every town or city has their own rules for issuing permits (if they do at all). There is no state-wide standard.

There is a state-wide standard, read MGL C. 140 S. 131. HOWEVER, MGL allows "discretion" and "suitability" to be decided by each and every local chief (351 of them), so there literally is 352 different sets of criteria in MA!

Originally Posted by fiasconva

If that DUI was 10 years ago it may not even be in the data base any more. He should check to see if there is even any record of it. He just may be good to go.

Unless the state it happened in, deletes all old convictions from it's database, the BOP and III run by the MA PD and state (CJIS) will turn it up. Lying on the application is an automatic DQ per MGL and can lead to a perjury charge.

Originally Posted by Squarebutt

GOAL is the best source for MA gun law info. I'm a member, too. If your friend is moving into the city of Boston, he should be aware that even if the DUI is no longer on his record, the city does not issue Class A (CCW) licenses to any civilians. Suburban towns are a little better. He may want to look at commuting from NH or RI, depending on his job location. Best of luck to him.

City of Boston does indeed issue LTC-A licenses, however almost all are restricted to "no concealed carry", allowing mere possession (no LTC means you can't even possess a spent cartridge case). I am an NRA Instructor and teach many Boston residents to pass the "Moon Island test" (Boston requires a range test with an old PD revolver and a minimum score of 210/300 for every applicant including renewals).

Originally Posted by Kavinsky

yeah boston is one of the worst places to try and get a permit, he'd be better off trying to get one in one of the other towns as meninio is really off of his stupid damn rocker when it comes to stuff like that.

Won't work if he lives there. MGL requires you get your Resident LTC in the city/town you live in (exception if you OWN a business in another town, no exceptions for mere employees). Boston does have it's own gun bans and doesn't allow ANY rifle mags >10 round capacity . . . this dates back to 1989.

Originally Posted by geoff40

I live about an hour away from the border, and I try to pay attention, but I must say I've never heard that an old DUI will prevent legal gun ownership in the Commonwealth (just that name says it all) of Massachusetts.
Is it really true? I am not sure, but I intend to find out.

Read MGL C. 140 S. 131 (d) (i) and weep!

Originally Posted by wheelyfun66

Fascistchusetts has some weird gun laws....

For non-residents, they are not issuing full carry privileges any longer (feedback from several long-time ccw holders), but only permission to bring a gun to a range or go hunting.

And...you have to pay big bucks, and appear IN PERSON every year, in order to be denied...and they keep your fees...

True, new policy as of a couple of years ago. They won't deny, but they usually will NOT issue a permit allowing you to carry a gun, only to possess it.

It cost $100/year and a yearly trip (appt only) in Chelsea MA for an interview, fingerprint and picture. Then wait 2-3 months to get the restricted permit. Rinse and repeat!

NOTE: I am a subject matter expert on MA gun laws and created a 3 hour seminar on the topic to combat tons of mis-information given out by dealers, instructors and law enforcement people. I very rarely drop by this forum but spend my life on www.northeastshooters.com where we created a sub-forum on MA gun laws (best place to get real info).