For generations folks have argued over what's the best Caliber/Cartridge for Self-Defense? The argument is generally a worthless waste of time with most people just arguing in favor of their preferred cartridge with little or no objective facts to backup their claims, meanwhile there was always one objectively ideal cartridge for Self-Defense, but few folks are bold enough to come right out and say it because they know they'll get bombarded with baseless arguments against their claim.

Fortunately, I'm bold enough to say it once and for all, right here, right now...

The best Caliber is .729 and the best Cartridge is none other than the mighty 12 Gauge Slug Shell.
That really ought to be a mic drop right there, but obviously folks will attempt to argue against the fact, so I'll keep going to explain why it's the best.

Obviously a 12 Gauge Slug packs a heck of a punch, delivering over 3000 Foot Pounds of Kinetic Energy at the muzzle and still maintaining over 1200ft-lbs at a distance of 100 Yards.
In other words, a Brenneke Black Magic Magnum Slug delivers as much energy at the Muzzle as a .500 S&W Magnum — The Most Powerful Handgun in the World — at the muzzle, and as much energy at a distance of 100 Yards as a .44 Remington Magnum — The Former Most Powerful Handgun in the World — not to mention the 5.56x45 NATO — The standard issue rifle cartridge in NATO Armed Forces — at the muzzle, and it does it all with a 602 Grain, .729 Caliber Projectile.

Some would argue that it's too powerful, too punishing, and delivered from a Firearm too large/heavy to carry concealed.
NONSENSE, I SAY! Nothing more that anti-gun rhetoric designed to pacify the masses and encourage citizens to carry less-than-adequate tools for Self-Defense.

In the modern-era, 12 Gauge Firearms are available in compact, concealable packages such as the Serbu Super Shorty and the Mossberg 590 Shockwave.
Furthermore, there exists a plethora of lower-powered yet still extremely effective 12 Gauge Slug Shells on the market, ranging from Federal Mini Shells for those of smaller stature all the way up to the aforementioned Bear-Slaying Brenneke Black Magic Magnum.


When you strap this on when you head out and you don't have to question whether or not you're adequately prepared to defend yourself.

Also, it's time to say it, people... Carrying a firearm isn't enough! If everyone maintained a rigorous daily exercise routine then nobody would argue that it's "unrealistic" or "impractical" to EDC a 12 Gauge.
Furthermore, if folks had some actual confidence and weren't overly concerned about what others think of them, then they wouldn't have to hide a Pocket Pistol in their pants when they go out to the store.

Folks need to start taking their Self-Defense seriously! You can't just carry whatever happens to be convenient, you've got to carry what gets the job done, and for all the endless arguments over which suboptimal handgun cartridge is the best of the worst option for minimalist Self-Defense, nobody has ever disputed that a hit from a 12 Gauge Slug is a fight-stopper!

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

It worked for Mad Max.

I like this. I can get behind this. HAHA!

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Go ahead... make my day.

Try carry inside the waistband of your pants while in Chicago

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age is just a number

Can't argue the 12 gauge, but tricky to conceal in South Florida summertime.
95 degrees and 95% humidity.
Kinda warm down here, sometimes hard to breathe.
In the winter I think maybe under a flannel, as it's cool out for about one week.

I think the 10 gauge trumps the 12……..LOL

I'm not convinced, nor will I be, until I see the results of a gel test.

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What, me worry?

I remember having this exact same discussion years ago in the back room of an old saddle maker's shop. There were several of us sitting around discussing the pros and cons of different defensive calibers, cartridges, muzzle velocity, foot pounds of energy, and firearms.

Finally, one old cowboy looked up and asked, "Just how much deader than dead can you kill a guy?"

End of discussion.

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Pack light and cinch tight.

A month and 3 days late.

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I need ammo, not a ride.

If you're going to pack that stuff around all day then that's fine. If you're not going to then you've accomplished nothing. The vast majority of people just aren't going to stroll around all day with a shotgun and a Klingon battle knife. The most important weapon isn't going to be the one great big one you left at home, it's going to be the one you carry with you.

When grocery shopping, walking the dogs or making quick bank stops a measly 9mm is just fine for me. Probably wouldn’t over penetrate as much as my sabot stuffed 12 ga Cruiser.

Jim

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Why not just carry a short barrel S&W 500?

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Music/Sports/Beer fan

8 gauge trumps 10 gauge. Using a 12 gauge as a comparison.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

It’s tricky to conceal in Alaska. In January.

I wonder what a good quality leather holster would cost for it?

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Why duck?? It's a 9mm!

May could use a M1A1 Carbine holster US WWII M1A1 Paratrooper Carbine Scabbard, Rigger modified, Made in USA | ATF

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

Appendix carry? I think the girls in the bar would notice.

more internet bs the best caliber and cartridge is the one you have on you..
last time I went to the store the 12 gauge stayed home and my little 9 went with me

Anyway... how many of you have fired a 12ga Shockwave with 2 3/4" 9-ball 00 buck? I have. Not fun. Not even close. I'll stick with my 38's and 9mm's. Now a .410 Shockwave, maybe...

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Heavily armed old man.

The truth be known the best round is the one that stops the fight no matter what caliber!

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

Nobody said anything about concealed carry .
I'll take a good 12 gauge pump , full stocked , any day ... and Open Carry works for me .

The best caliber ... is the one in your hands when things go South !
Gary

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Certified Cajun
NRA Member

357 Magnum high speed light weight hollow point.

A 4” 50 should do the trick.

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and what his trumpet saith

Needs a longer bayonet.

What happens when you are facing a dozen baddies and your shorty shotty only holds four shells?

In other words, one can never prepare for every possibility. You are better served attempting to deal with probabilities. For me, that means that a six-shot 432UC, with two extra reloads in speed strips, meets my requirements.

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Only a cold warrior

Doc Holliday carried a sawed off double barrel under his duster suspended on a lanyard, the attachment point was located so when he opened his duster it came up in the firing position.

He only carried that because he didn't have a Sig P365.

Well, it is definitely NOT a 58 caliber!



Kevin

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Unshared knowledge is wasted.

Hard to argue with its effectiveness. Might question the realistic carry options.

I do keep a short 870 as truck gun. Pretty sure it would raise eyebrows if I wandered into the local bank with it.

My idea of a carry shotgun. Eight in the tube and one in the chamber, and it has rifle sights. In a pinch you can mount a bayonet on it.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

If 12 gauges is as powerful as 500 S&W, why not just go with 500 S&W in a much more compact design?

mine comes with a bayonet... lol

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Yes that is a real shotgun.

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Heavily armed old man.

Opinions are like exhaust pipes........We all got one.........For anything under 50 yards I prefer the handgun. Shotgun for for crowds......A scoped deer rifle for distance.

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S&W Accumulator

As credited to Wyatt Earp, when asked how to survive a gunfight:

Don't show up.

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Life of the party until 8:00PM

As Jeremiah Johnson said to Del Gue: "sound wisdom".

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Music/Sports/Beer fan

I have one for mine also.....

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

That is a USMC Remington M870 MK 1......

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

Well heck yes, the shotgun has to be the best self defense carry gun! Right? Even ol’ president Joe Biden said “get a shotgun” and that guy is always right, right?

Well said, but regrettably not something the gunfighting aspirants want to hear as they dream of the ultimate showdown attended by many violence-crazed armed opponents.

If I knew I was going to be in a gun fight, my absolute first choice for a men stopper would be the MK19


Barrel length: 16.25 inches (413 mm)
Cartridge: 40×53 mm
Muzzle velocity: 750–790 feet per second (230–240 m/s) (average)
Rate of fire: 325-375rpm (cyclic); 40 rpm (sustained); 60 rpm (rapid)

PS it is also good against light armored vehicles

Is that a 12ga in yer pants, or are you just happy to see me??

The answer depends on how dead do you want to kill him?
If he is still a threat after the first shot-shoot him until he's no longer a threat. Pretty simple if you ask me. I think that any high capacity pew pew that you have with you would suffice.

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Forum consigliere

I'm not sure. Does April Fools run into May??

Well, Andrew's Leather had given the idea some thought when he made this rig...

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Go ahead... make my day.

If you bring logic into this discussion, the gunfighting theorists won't participate.

10 Gauge is an obsolete duck-hunting round, 12 Gauge 3.5" Shells have replaced it.

Only cowards mask their radical, over-the-top, borderline unreasonable assertions as jokes by posting them exclusively on April Fools Day!

Ignoring the fact that it is tactically disadvantageous to engage a dozen units upfront and assuming you mean that the enemy had unforseen reinforcements which have cut off all viable escape routes?
Well, you want to take up a defensive position behind cover, and call for reinforcements of your own, then hold the line as best as you can until they arrive. If you're going to go down either way, then give 'em heck and tack as many of 'em with you as possible.

As far as being prepared for such a scenario goes, — or as prepared as you can be for a desperate situation — there are a few options... You could carry a 12 Gauge that takes detachable box magazines, a NY Reload, a or a BUG which offers similar performance such as a S&W Model 500. If all else fails, that's when you draw your knife.

Fortunately, the most common adversary one is likely to encounter on the mean streets are the infamous Crackerjack Boys, who are generally known to be less than well trained fighters, not to mention terrible shots due to their unorthodox method of aiming down the flats of the slide while taking haphazardous shots in your general direction with shaky hands due to their crippling chemical dependency on caramel-coated popcorn with salted peanuts mixed in.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

I referenced an 8 gauge in Post # 14. So I guess if a 10 gauge is obsolete then so is the 8 gauge. But they both pack a heck of a wallop, especially at close range. Sort of like a swivel gun!

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

That's correct, that's the answer, and, also, it is right. Furthermore, it's the best, most practical answer. Did you win? Did the aggression stop? Good job. Sleep tight. All the rest is commentary.............

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Come and take it!!