I live in Oregon. Recently Measure 114, requiring permits to purchase, complicating transfers, and banning magazines with an excess of 10 rounds, was passed by voters, but soon stymied by appeals to the judiciary. At the moment anyway the restrictions are not in effect. Oregon Ballot Measure 114 - Wikipedia.

I just bought a Sig P365 with two 12-round mags.

Oregon is next to Washington which has the following law:



Just a moment...

I have an Oregon resident CHL and a Utah non-resident CHL. Washington does not recognize Oregon CHLs because their law requires reciprocity and Oregon will not recognize any other state's CHL. Washington does recognize Utah non-resident CHLs.

My question is, if I travel into Washington, if I am there temporarily, say for an afternoon, am I "importing" an illegal magazine if the mag in my gun exceeds 10 rounds?

If so, do those of you who live next to states with magazine capacity limits switch to low capacity mags when traveling across state lines?

A good practice to follow is when traveling to other states with your handgun, check what the capacity limit is, and carry that capacity… Same applies for bullet design (ie: hollow point vs everything else…)

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Stay Safe...
jd SWCA #3276

I see two alternatives. Before you travel to WA, get 10 round magazines for your P365, or travel with another sidearm that holds less then 10. Good luck in your decision.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

I think they’d have a hard time claiming you are importing a magazine if you plan to leave with it. You’d also be importing your car. That wouldn’t make my “worry about it” list.

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It’s Fudd-Daddy to you.

Sort of the same deal, in Pa. No limits on the magazine. Next door in NY they have a 10 round limit (IIRC). Know an auctioneer that auctions a couple of hundred guns most every month in Pa. If a buyer is from NY and the pistol involved in the sale holds more than 10 rounds, the buyer gets the gun, but not the magazine. Yep, they still buy them.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

That looks like a call the Washington Attorney Generals Office or check their website question. As a non-lawyer, it appears that a currently owned mag with over 10 round capacity would be legal.

HOWEVER: Not everyone is gonna get the memo about currently owned mags if I'm right or give a hoot about it. I'd pick up 2-3 neutered mags for your travels to be on the safe side. Maybe someday they'll be collectors items. Mags are cheaper than either bail or lawyers.

When this stupidity was in effect the last time I was using a revolver and .45 Commander so I didn’t have to think about it.

Here in Indiana, we have a municipality north of where I live with magazine restrictions - in spite of the fact that state law clearly prohibits such interference from the little self-made local kings and queens. I don’t think the police are overly concerned with it, but when I go there I try to adjust accordingly, just to save myself any possible hassles. I don’t have time and money to spend fighting their petty, ridiculous nonsense.

Another thought is to do like I do. I carry a revolver since no one has banned them yet. There are times that we drive from Florida to Pa. All States involved in the trip recognize a Florida CCW. Go over to Ohio sometimes and they recognize a Fla. CCW also. But we stay the heck out of NY.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

I agree with you on this, but it could cost several thousands of dollars to fight if you were arrested for bringing illegal (at least in Washington) magazines into the state. Personally, I would just carry the legal magazines and have confidence that the extra 4 rounds would not make that much of a difference if the need arose.

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Have Canon, Will Travel

I wouldn't take the chance.

The law will be interpreted by the person who arrest you or doesn't arrest you.

I would spring for a couple extra 10 round mags and go about my way.

The deal you posted doesn't say "IMPORT FOR PURPOSE OF SELLING".

Importing to me is bringing something into a place. While most definitions deal with importing and exporting on a trade level if you break the definition down to the simple terms it is bringing something into somewhere else.

I have an LEOSA credential from training received at the NRA HQ and the instructor there, which at this time is the legal opinion of the NRA, said when you go to a state with a magazine restriction you follow the rules of that state. Now I know that there is a CPT in Illinois that will get on here and shout me down about this but I know what they instructed and I would go with the NRA's advice before interpreting the law on my own.

So if LEOSA doesn't give you that break I doubt your CCW will.

I am not a lawyer so this isn't legal advise just what I was instructed and what I have gleaned from looking up the definition of "import" on the internet.

When I go I either slip 10 round magazines in my 365 or more times than not I take my Glock 43 with some 6 and 8 round magazines.

Will be interested in hearing what the Washington AG offers up.

As long as a law is on the books and enforceable in a particular state you MUST obey the laws of the state you are in. If you do not you are subject to a citation, arrest, confiscation, etc. without question. The applicable law is of the state where you are currently, NOT the laws of any other state in which you are licensed or resident! This applies to ALL laws and EVERY state!

To fail to do so is strictly at your own peril!

And, you better be conversant with the laws of that state where you are! As my Grandfather said many times, "Ignorance of the law is no excuse"! He was a District Court Judge, Dean of the local Law School and President of the State Bar Association at times in his life, as well as still a practicing Attorney after he "retired".

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Gunsmithing since 1961

To avoid any issues take a 6 round revolver Not a semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to take a larger round count. That kills that argument, I'm telling you as a NYC resident with a pistol license for over 40 years, Not CCW. I Can't tell you how many people get arrested and their weapons confiscated at airports, bridge crossings etc when their weapons were legal leaving home and crossing borders where there IS Reciprocity between your home state and those states that you may travel through. No such thing in my tri-state area.
People ask me regularly I'm visiting NY and I want to carry my ccw gun after hearing all the horror stories about crime running rampant in NY.
I usually tell them leave your gun at home and/or bring a non lethal means to defend yourself. There is No safe answer. That is the state of the country presently

Arlo, if you get 10 rd mags make sure they are specific for the XL. The standard 10 rd mags that are for the base model will not fit the XL unless you change base pads.

My base 10 rd did not fit my XL when I changed grip modules.

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Sure you did

I wouldn't chance it, Onomea. I wouldn't call the attorney general's office either. He is the most virulent anti-gunner to inhabit the office. Ferguson was instrumental in getting the magazine ban as well as the "assault rifle" ban on the books.

I can use and carry high cap mags I already own, and I can use "assault rifles" already owned. But I can't acquire more or sell what I have. There are lawsuits in process to overturn this stuff, but our courts have been quick to panic on the side of the antis. So we're stalled.

Please members, let's not turn this into a good state/bad state discussion. It is what it is and it's likely we're all fighting or will be fighting this battle.

Again, Onomea, I'd err on the side of caution. I hate to say it, but if you needed to use your handgun to protect yourself while here, and you have an 11+ round magazine in it, I think the AG would love to make an example of you. You don't want to be that person.

I am a retired LEO and a nine-year veteran of the USN. I carry everywhere under LEOSA. I would NEVER carry a magazine into a state in violation of their laws. It seems to me that the current crop of LEOs, some of them, take delight in arresting fellow LEOs or retired LEOs for ANY violation.

Do NOT violate any of the laws related to firearms. I suggest you own a pistol, to carry into any state which has mag restrictions, which will not accept a mag which is over ten rounds.

This is my understanding. When in a state that honors your carry permit you still have to carry under their rules and restrictions. As for buying a gun out of state you don’t get the mag if it’s not legal in your home state. Being a NY resident I dealt with this many times when purchasing online.

While it is highly unlikely you could be charged for importing a banned/restricted magazine, you could easily be charged with possession of a banned/restricted magazine. When traveling with a firearm, it behooves you to be very familiar with and abide by all the firearms laws in the states and localities you will pass through.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

I'm a retired municipal police officer and I currently work as a police officer at a local university. Despite the fact that I complete my state's required legal updates every year and qualify at the range every year I consider my campus PD credentials worthless once I leave the state. I carry under LEOSA and the few times that I need to go to NJ or NY I make sure that I am compliant with their laws. I carry a 625 revolver with a bunch of moonclips (six round magazines) loaded with 230 gr. ball ammo. I work with some retired NYPD and when they go to NY they carry 10 round magazines loaded with 8 rounds. When I do the yearly LEOSA qualification there is always talk about the NY magazine restrictions and NJ hollowpoint restrictions but the guys who are actually retired from NYPD do NOT carry more than 8 rounds in a magazine. I look at that as a clue.

My drivers licence from my state lets me drive in every state, however I need to obey the laws of the state I am driving in. Same goes with my CC permit!!!!

It doesn't need to hold "less than 10"

It only needs to hold 10 or less !

I appreciate all the responses, guys.

I don't head into Washington that often, but think that when I do I will either carry a revolver or get a 10 rounder for my P365 for that purpose.

Exactly this^^^^^^^^ we had a chance to fix the reciprocity issue in 2016-18 but Congress couldn’t figure it out. Hopefully if given another chance they will. I really want NY to get gut punched on this !!!!!

Recently flew home to visit family in NY and had to add my Glock 19 to my permit and pick up a 10 round mag before my flight.

I would not want to get caught and have to try to get off on a technicality by the wording of the law. That’s a lot more time and money than just picking up a 10 round mag.

My DL is good in all states. All states don't recognize my CC permit.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

When in Rome, do as the Roman’s

Carry a 40 or 45 with 10 round or less magazine capacity or a revolver. Taking chances makes no sense.

Get the 10 rounder. Two would be better.

As a non resident, you would be IMPORTING a high capacity magazine.

Glad to have you. Don’t stay long. This place sucks. No….people here suck.

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Life Is A Gift. Defend it!

I have 10 round mags for every semi I own. If I travel out of state, those are the ones I carry.

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Heavily armed old man.

I carry whenever and wherever but WA could very well charge someone for violating any law. The ‘if you plan to leave with it’ defense is full of holes. It’s no defense.

I think it is always best to go to the text of the law rather than synopsis offered by others. Text of the law:

RCW 9.41.370: Large capacity magazines—Exceptions—Penalty.

Text of the bill as passed includes definition of "import":

https://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/bienn...20240527205116

"Import" means to move, transport, or receive an item from a place outside the territorial limits of the state of Washington to a place inside the territorial limits of the state of Washington.

"Import" does not mean situations where an individual possesses a large capacity magazine when departing from, and returning to, Washington state, so long as the individual is returning to Washington in possession of the same large capacity magazine the individual transported out of state."

If your vehicle registration and or drivers license states anything other than Washington state, you’ve just imported an illegal magazine. Not that hard to figure out.

Same with California.

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Life Is A Gift. Defend it!

It would be great, but I'm not putting any money on this ever happening.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

NY will never have reciprocity even with a SCOTUS ruling.

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Sure you did

I have some pistols that take mags of less than 10 rounds (Shield, G33, 945-1). I can use the standard mags (they are not LCM except by definition) in any pistol for which I already had them (mostly 9mm Glocks). Using them is not a crime since I already had them. In this county, the odds of being arrested/charged unless in conjunction with some other unlawful act are so close to zero it is laughable. Along the I-5 corridor, much higher.

Note: Glocks was and as far as I know still is quite vehement about not using reduced capacity mags for duty or defense. Carry some other platform if you need low capacity mags.

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NHI, 10-8.

Retired Police sergeant and state certified police academy FA instructor. Moved out of New Jersey just as fast as I could. I return for two week beach vacations. That's when I carry a 442 with 158 gr. SWC. This is because of the HP restrictions, since overturned. I simply don't trust that local LEO's have kept up with court decisions. It's much easier to just reload. NJ has been jerking LEOSA and civilian gun owners around for decades.

Trusting the NJ carry permit is a **** shoot too. Think about it. I did this for 29 years and don't trust the system, what would they do to you Joe Citizen? Washington, California, New York, Massachusetts, Illinois and Maryland. Travel with care.

When I travel, I comply with whatever that States laws are. I recently was just passing through Colorado. They have a 15 round capacity. Every other state I was going through had no capacity limit. I brought 15 round mags on that trip.

Why create any hassle for yourself? Especially just to carry 2 extra rounds. And what happens if you have to actually use your gun for SD? Is a DA going to make an issue out of the 12 round mag?

Even being retired LE out of CA, I was allowed to keep my large cap mags upon retirement. But when I go back, I bring 10 rounders. I'm no longer a resident of the State and would be considered a large cap mag importer under CA law (at least that's how I interrupt the law).

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Watch & Pray

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A seller in PA selling to NY buyers......
That sounds like he is violating the federal law.
If I understand it correctly people can only purchase handguns in the state they reside in.

Is that Montana that requires the firearms to be listed on your permit?

Double post

No, NY. Montana does not require a permit.

Not quite correct.
Handguns must be RECEIVED through a dealer in your state of residence. EXAMPLE: I bought an M&P Pro 9 from a dealer in KY, who shipped the pistol to an FFL in my hometown in OK, where I completed the Federal paperwork for me to legally RECEIVE the handgun, complying with Federal law and the laws of both states.

Generally, for a person
to lawfully transfer a firearm to an unlicensed person who resides out of State, the firearm must
be shipped to a Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL) within the recipient’s State of residence. He or
she may then receive the firearm from the FFL upon completion of an ATF Form 4473 and a
NICS background check. More information can be obtained on the ATF website at Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives |
and Unlicensed Persons | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives

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Science plus Art

That is how I understood it but the post I quoted made it seem like they got the high bid and just took them home. No transfer involved.

Does NY have none resident carry permits?
Your location says Montana so I was assuming that is where you live. If that is correct I am surprised you could have a NY permit. Unless you are a retired LEO from NY.

I am sure that the seller is transferring the gun in question to an FFL-holder.

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Mark Lathem

Yes, I live in Montana. I used to live in NY and had my NY permit. I simply changed my address to my MT address when I left NY, permit is still valid. I’m not a LEO.

Some upstate counties to offer non-resident permits if you have a business or property in NY.

What he said........No FFL is going to jeopardize his license or business (unless his is a fool) by selling a handgun to an out of state buyer. He gets an FFL in their state to transfer the handgun for them. You understand the law, but not how it plays out in real life.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.