For Catboatwilly -

Picture is circa 1961 or so - South VN -





For CH47gunner -

For Lee Barner -








This is unconventional weapon -

I was in the Central Highlands '69-'70. Our 1st. Sgt. showed me a Colt revolver, blued, .38 Spcl., 4" barrel, with adjustable sights. I can't recall the model now. Also ran into a guy in the field that had a blued Browning Hi Power. He said it was a problem finding 9MM ammo. IIRC, he said he got 9MM ammo from the Australians...

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NRA Life, COTEP 640

Welcome home Rock -

Keep this thread going!!! It is great to hear stories from people who were ACTUALLY THERE! This has to be the best thread of the SW forums by far!

James

I had a friend who was a chopper pilot in Viet Nam. He was a little guy - small framed, and light weight, and was delighted to learn he would be assigned to fly a gunship (policy of his command was that smaller pilots would fly gunships so more ammo could be carried), rather than a "slick". Unfortunately for him, he was seconded by some "alphabet group" and flew an unarmed Cobra attack chopper doing photo recon and BDAs (Bomb Damage Assessment). Curiously, he was not provided with any sidearms, and he told me he purchased an old Webley top break revolver on the black market for self defense. He really hated his assignment, and really wanted to engage the enemy in "real combat". His solution was both personal, and unique: he told me he always carried extra canteens of water and "piddle packs" in the cockpit of his Cobra, and tried to "bomb" Viet Nam in that manner. By the way, a "piddle pack" is a pilot relief item - a plastic bag containing a special type of sponge - used to contain urine.

Regards,

Dave

Sorry, this one don't make sense! You are a-feared of the VC. I got that! So then you drop pee-pee on them? They have AKs and other guns. They love to shoot down choppers. You got to get low and slow to make that drop.
All the Army chopper guys I ever talked to were issues handguns. Many carried M-16s.
My Father in Law flew in a Mosquito with a Brit in Africa, WWII. The Brit had a Webley. FIL had a 1917.

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NRA LIFE MEMBER

Dave, that is curious that a military pilot would be unarmed. Not even a sidearm of some kind?

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NRA Life, COTEP 640

I just want to interrupt this thread long enough to THANK all of the VN vets for their service and sacrifice.

I was still going through high school when the conflict was going on, and the war ended before I graduated.

A high school friend who graduated about 2 years ahead of me had a birthdate that was in the top ones in the draft lottery, meaning his call up was imminent.

Rather than waiting for his draft notice for the Army, he enlisted in the USMC and was killed by small arms fire while on patrol 4 months after arriving in country. That really took the war off of the TV and brought it directly home to me... I'm still saddened when I think of him and his sacrifice at such an early age.

R.I.P. PFC Henry Bell Jr. (3RD PLT, I CO, 3RD BN, 7TH MARINES, 1ST MARDIV, III MAF, KIA 31 Jan 1970, Quang Nam Province - 18 years old).

It thrills me to no end that finally, VN vets are starting to get the public recognition that they so deserve.

Welcome home gentlemen and thank you.

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Conrad
SWCA #1830 SWHF #222

Pilgrim and Rock185:

The gentleman in question was a very brave, and very nice man. He passed from cancer in the mid 1980s, so I cannot ask him to verify or prove what information he shared with me. I met him when I was assigned as a nurse to the cancer ward at Walter Reed AMC in the late 1970s. There was some question as to whether his cancer was due to the effects of Agent Orange (he flew through many areas that had been sprayed with Agent Orange during his tours), but he died before this could be proven. Bill was my patient, and became a good friend - something you are not supposed to let happen. As any veteran knows, just because something is "supposed to be" doesn't really mean it actually does happen.

With the exception of Bill, every chopper pilot I knew that flew in Viet Nam flew armed - many with sidearms as well as long guns and variants thereof (I knew one pilot who carried a sawed off Browning Auto 5 shotgun). But for whatever reason, Bill told me was not issued a sidearm, and his crew chief helped direct him to the black market where he found the Webley.

I never asked him how he made his 'bomb runs" with the piddle packs, but I don't recall him ever saying he was targeting anybody, I think he was just making his mark on Viet Nam and hoping to hit some enemy trooper lurking down below. Thus, I don't think he was flying low and slow at the time. Bill was a funny guy, but he was not suicidal.

I wish you guys could have met my friend. He had a rare zest for life. It was one of life's ironies that he wanted to fly combat missions, and instead was relegated to flying an unarmed recon chopper. I really miss my friend - he's another that left too soon.

Regards,

Dave

Don't forget the Remington Nylon 66.....................

Unfortunately this happened to a lot of rotary wing drivers. The rotor wash stirred everything up and fill the air with it long after it was sprayed. Also, remember, there was other nasty stuff called Paraquat (sp) that was openly sprayed as well. IMHO, this was even nastier than Agent Orange.

I can believe throwing out the "Piddle Packs" in the off chance of hitting someone is quite possible. In fact I saw many cases where mostly futile acts of aggression were used just to relieve the pressure and give even a little sense of getting even.

As an example, on a few occasions when out on a "Snoop and Poop" (recon or sniper) mission in the Ah Shau Valley we would sometimes find a unit of NVA dug in alongside a small river of stream. But, we were under orders not to engage them because that wasn't in our mission profile. So, we would make our way a couple of "clicks" up stream from them and each one of us take turns peeing and pooping in the water so it would flow down stream towards the NVA unit. We would then have a lot of fun speculating what effect our turds and "yellow water" would have on them and their food/water supply.

Another time we were out with a group of Montagnards and one of them captured a baboon which, at first, they intended to eat. But the leader of the group got a better idea. They proceeded to put a pair of panties (where those came from I have no idea) on the baboon and let it go free. They had written a note on the panties that basically said she was a NVA soldier's mother out looking for her son. The young Montagnard who thought it up was shot and killed by a sniper 2 days later. His name was Trac. The sniper also did not survive the day. I have no idea what his name was nor do I care.

Bob

I don't know if this thread is a blessing or a curse. I'm remembering things I have buried and tried to forget for a very long time.

Bob

Bob -

It is because of men like you and my dad that gave us hope and able to be here today to reflect and live and enjoy freeedom! I thank you for this once in a lifetime opportunity -

Some of us gave a little - Some of us gave all - RIP to my uncle and cousins whom gave all for country -

My dad was ARVN for roughly 20 years - Biet Dong Quan - He is with us today -

Thank you -

Luong / Saigon1965 -


I look at these when feeling down and they always bring a smile to me - I hope they do the same for you -


Husband and wife - She transfered in country to be near him -




SF helping locals -




Though not a flattering picture but this was one of my dad's old boss - General Lamson - Father of the VN airborne -







Goofiness after long range patrol -









Never seems to be enough of this stuff!

To Saigon1965: Thank you Sir. I needed that. Please tell your Dad I said "OORAH!"


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I was an armed helicopter crew chief/door gunner in VN from January 1966 to September 1968. We were allowed whatever we could scounge up. I carried a Nazi made Browning Hi Power in an old tanker m3 shoulder holster for the entire time I was in Vietnam. I tried to win a Sig P320 on the The Truth About Guns website about my pistol and how it was returned to me 46 years after I left Vietnam:

There and back again, my VN Browning Hi Power

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Bud
Lots of S&Ws

I am no archery expert, but does something look wrong about where the arrow is resting? Or is there something I am unaware of?

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Frosty
S&WCA # 2816

Nobody said he was an Archer. Sometimes you just did what you had to do.

Bob


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I was training to be a nuclear weapons specialist in the Air Force during the last year of the war. Both of my brothers served in country, one as an Air Force medic the other as a bomb loader. Brother Mike told me of seeing some VC bodies after they tried to breach the wire and one of them had a muzzle loading rifle of some kind.

This thread was a lot of fun...

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USAF AMMO!

suggesting that he is experienced. Right handed bows are common.

Yep, left hand shooter, right hand bow, looks like it works for him.

RIP PFC Bell -


Being in the 1st he had to travel thru these gates -

Welcome home BudMan5 -

I sure will - He's in Houston currently visiting my sister -

He's on the right side -

Look up Project: Eldest Son
Project "Eldest Son" - Top Secret U.S. S.O.G. Operation to Plant Sabotaged Ammunition in Enemy Hands

wyo-man

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Live free or die

He's a Lieutenant Colonel, too. The other one a full Colonel. I was a thieu (?sp) ta.

Hello Cyrano - The other officer is Colonel Kiem - They worked for a time together at Tong Tham Muu -

Thieu Ta Cyrano - Welcome home -

On my Trash-hauler (C7 Caribou) tour I was stationed at Cam Ranh Bay. I remember well the huge rats. They were only slightly more fearsome than the cockroaches.
We pilots were authorized the S&W .38. We served the Special Forces' remote camps so we were able to readily trade for other guns. I wound up with two Colt Government Models, one from a USArmy captain at Xuan Loc. That's 'nother story. I always had one in an Army shoulder holster, with 7 magazines in my flight suit pockets.
Our Flight Engineers were authorized the M16 or M79 grenade launcher. All the ones I remembered were M16s. Many of us, including me, carried a small rucksack with survival stuff. A number of us, including me, kept hand grenades in them. Probably not very safe, but it felt good.

I also wrangled a Thompson from a Special Forces A-team troop. It had a '28 lower and the M1A1 upper. I kept it in my hootch. The NVA loved to entertain us with their loverly 122mm rockets. Being pilots, we climbed up on the roofs to watch while lamenting that we didn't have anything to shoot back.

I touched the Thompson only once on base. One night the rocket entertainment began and we all ran for the roofs as usual. Now, this was just after we had evacuated Cambodian troops to US coastal bases for medical attention. Cam Ranh had a big hospital so many of them went there. One of the flight surgeons was a buddy of mine and he dragged me over to the wards to see "something." That turned out to be the Cambodians WITH ARVN ID'S ON THEIR CHARTS! Wouldn't want to contradict Tricky Dick when he said we were NOT in Cambodia! I, like a lot of other pilots, must have been using defective navigation charts.

Moving on, the NVA knew the patients were Cambodians and staged a raid to kill them, but also to embarrass the US with the truth.

Sooo, there we were on our roofs or walls enjoying the fireworks when we noticed people running through the blacked-out streets. Our guys, certainly, running for, uh, running for . . .
NOT GI's! NVA! Running between our hootches! I did a Superman leap off the roof and scrambled into my hootch, stomping a few cockroaches along the way, dug my Thompson out of the hole I was hiding it in and ran to the wall where a number of other astute pilots had stationed themselves with M16s.

The NVA was not in the least interested in us on this trip, though we were high-value targets. They ran to the hospital and tossed grenades into the tents hoping to kill Cambodians!

We got to stay up all night watching and listening to all the excitement. I don't recall any pilot firing a single shot. After all, we were not exactly in hardened bunkers. Drawing unwanted attention might also draw a toss of some of the NVA's highly respected noisy toys.

Somehow our squadron commander, a WWII vet and a man who could extinguish the fires of h&*l with a glance, found out about my Thompson. I was treated to one of his highly UNdesired closed-door meetings, just him and me. It was a nice chat . . .. Interestingly, he said NOTHING about courts martial, handcuffs or having me dragged behind an aircraft on takeoff. It was more along the line of "there are better guns available." Did he know how many pilots had guns in their hootches? He was NOT a stupid man. Perhaps he saw the value of us high-value targets having our own toys to play with.

I don't remember seeing any TAC Airlift pilots with guns from home.

On my fighter-bomber tour I was stationed at Korat, Thailand. Again, the issue gun was the S&W .38. Here I did see a number of pilots carrying their own guns. All the ones I remember were blue S&W .357s. The base was a tad more restrictive about keeping guns in our quarters (air conditioned with a four channel TV!), and I don't remember anyone who did. Of course, it was much less likely the the NVA might come over to play.
Besides, the only real purpose for a fighter pilot to carry a side arm was that it made us feel better.
Heh.

Welcome home Harkrader -

Thank you for the neat stories - Those are field mice and supposedly are tasty!

Fresh subject beyond shooting +Ps and bears and the stories are darned interesting and new to me.

It's a darn shame that the men, materiel, tactics and strategy poured into Vietnam were undone by corruption and politics combined with fear of getting China or the Sovs more involved (not to mention letting ourselves get suckered by NV at every turn).

Don't get into a war you if you don't intend to win it.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

drove many a trip across that bridge in an M-151 radio jeep while with the 21st TASS at Cam Rahn Bay. Siagon1965, thanks for the pics. those A-1s out of Thialand and the VNAF ones from Pleiku saved my butt a few times. lee

WOW, Saigon1965! Somebody actually took a picture of the Caribous! White tail. My squadron was red.
Kontum. Ohhh f75k. Too many bad memories. Almost got my a&s shot off there.

The "American Heros" cable channel just ran a piece on Dak To, using recently discovered sound tapes synched to film. We lost planes flying from Dak Seang. Don't want to think about it.

Some years ago the Moving Wall came to our town. I had been to the one in WDC a number of times with a guy I grew up with. He was also USAF Vietnam, a couple years before me. We always went late at night to avoid crowds and the despicable creeps who were hanging out around it pretending to be vets, or who wanted us to "tell our story."

So I went to the Moving Wall at Midnight. Finding names had become much easier thanks to computers. I entered the tent where the guides were and started asking for location of the names. After five he asked me how many I knew. "Twenty-seven." Another reason to go late at night.
Elsewhere in these forums I posted a pic of me looking rather bedraggled standing in front of a quad-50 deuce and a half. I wrote about it, but I can't tell it. I wish I could remember who the two shirtless guys were.

The 39/59 was the original Hush Puppy, as I understand it. .22 cal versions followed for assassination work. I had the use of a Swedish K for a while and liked it. It went with it's owner when he was sent to LZ English. We were jeep borne, so most of our stuff was short or sawed off, including the marvelous Savage pump gun mentioned earlier. All of us on Roving Patrol carried .38 cal revolvers in cross draw, we even had a sawed off M-14 w/selector switch that you could ride to town! One OIC had a Thompson, and few depended on the black plastic thing that you could tell was swell because it was Mattel. Our Jeep had two M-60's and an M-79, and sand bags on the floor-two radios. If someone had showed up and made us do everything by the book, we would have been left with a P-38 and a bottle of bug juice!

A Thank You to all the VETS that fought and served our country.

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I BACK OUR BLUE

The 39/59 was the original Hush Puppy, as I understand it. .22 cal versions followed for assassination work. I had the use of a Swedish K for a while and liked it. It went with it's owner when he was sent to LZ English. We were jeep borne, so most of our stuff was short or sawed off, including the marvelous Savage pump gun mentioned earlier. All of us on Roving Patrol carried .38 cal revolvers in cross draw, we even had a sawed off M-14 w/selector switch that you could ride to town! One OIC had a Thompson, and few depended on the black plastic thing that you could tell was swell because it was Mattel. Our Jeep had two M-60's and an M-79, and sand bags on the floor-two radios. If someone had showed up and made us do everything by the book, we would have been left with a P-38 and a bottle of bug juice!

Saigon 1965; Thanks for the correct spelling of 'thieu'; i's been 40 years and I'd forgotten. I was in MACV CORDS, and we wore the Vietnamese insignia on the front of our jungle fatigues. I dug around in my little box that holds all my insignia, and found I still had this.

In the Army now, wearing the combat uniform, they put their rank on the front of their shirt. I guess we were just a little ahead of the game on that one.

Attached Images

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You are welcome Lee - I have a cousin that flew A-37 for VNAF - His plane was destroyed at the flight line at Tan Son Nghut in April of 75 -


There aren't too many pictures of the Caribous from Vietnam -

Have to find one with red tail now -

My dad went to the wall in DC about 10 years ago -


AFJ - Where were you sir?

You are very welcome Thieu Ta - Last time I learned Vietnamese was 39 years ago -

Which MACV headquarters were you at?

My dad dumped his M16 and sidearm off the coast of Subic Bay - Per US Navy's request -

Later his uniform went too! We don't have anything for his time in - Just some pictures oh and his life!

Somebody mentioned Mattel.
I was going to an Air Force school and it was Army day.
We had a full day of Army lectures and a display of firearms in the lobby.

I had seen pictures of the M-16 but that was the first time I ever held one.
I liked the light weight. Both the M-1 and M-14 would have slowed me down!
But I could not believe that the Army bought a rifle with a handle! Like a suitcase!

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NRA LIFE MEMBER

Our old adversaries are using the handle too now!

I had a friend that said they got into a firefight with some vc who were using 8mm Lebel rifles loaded with some pre WWI cordite ammo and though several in their platoon were hit none were wounded other than bruises and minor scrapes.

I'm surprised they went off at all. I like French weapons but their ammo is another matter. I had a feed strip of 8mm Lebel for the Hotchkiss MG. The ammo was dated in the 1950s, and I was shooting it in the 1980s. I fired 16 rounds: two went off as expected, one was a dud and the rest were hangfires; at least that lot was uniform!

skunkhome, when I went from sudan to chad in 83 they were still using the old 8mm lebels. about one out of three or four rounds would fire. lee

A friend I used to shoot pistol competition with used a scoped 378 Weatherby Magnum in Vietnam. He had the pictures of him and the rifle in a tall lookout tower. The area around the base had been cleared out for a few hundred yards around the perimeter and he used it for long range sniping.

My dad carried an M3A1 for his 3 tours. He liked the MAT-49, but had a hard time getting magazines and 9mm ammo. Same for the Swedish K. Plus he said all the "Agency" guys had them. He said you could always tell a CIA guy - they drove around in Green Ford Broncos, wore Bush hats and Rolex Submariners, and carried Swedish Ks. He also carried a Winchester Model 59 shotgun, purchased at a PX while he was over there. He cut the barrel off right in front of the magazine tube, and wrapped it with electrical tape to keep the fiberglass barrel from fraying. He would have his parents send him boxes of commercial #4 Buck from the States, because they were plastic and wouldn't swell up in the humidity.

Nice stuff he had - I'd give up something for a MAT-49 -


I am sure you Gents knows about this one - But would like to add to thread -


Tunnel gun from S&W -







This is a jungle workshop gun - Brought back and recently traded hands on one of the auction site -













This one is just awesome - VC made grenade -

Saigon1965 -

I believe I've posted a couple of these pics before now - worth posting again.
I crewed CH-47C & "Super C" Chinooks for 10 1/2 months from Jan. 1970 to Nov. 1970, including the Cambodian Incursion May 1970. I was in the 1st Aviation Brigade, 213th Assault Support Helicopter Company (BlackCats). Stationed at Phu Loi, in III Corp., approx. 35 miles west of Saigon.
1st Aviation Brigade flew in support of almost any unit that didn't have aviation assets or not enough - we flew in support of the 1st Cav., 1st Infantry, 25th infantry, 199th LIB, 11th Armored Cav., Australians, & the ARVN.
When I first started flying we were flying eight birds a day with one on standby and another on waterbuckets, in the dry season. Before we could get grunts/volunteers out of the field (harder than you'd think), there were only six doorgunners in Flight Platoon. We flew a Lot!

Welcome Home all.

My place of business for 10 1/2 months.


213th ASHC flight line


1st Infantry Div. patch carved out of the jungle - can only be seen from the air, outside of Lai Khe


Nui Ba Den - outside of Tay Ninh


Best friend (still) Matt C.

I was stationed in Lai Khe 65'-66'. 168th Combat Engineers. We built everything there including the airstrip. If I remember correctly It was Charlie Company Ist Infantry. A company of the 173rd Helicopter. A Company of Artillery and us. I was a dozer operator and found myself accompanying C Company on a couple of missions. Those guys didn't play well with others. Very serious bunch.
DW

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"NUTS"

DW -
I saw the Bob Hope Christmas show at Lai Khe, in Dec. 1969. Didn't start flying until Jan. 1970 - Lai Khe was one of our POL points when we were flying sorties nearby. The Iron Triangle was pretty close as was Cu Chi.

The 173rd AHC (RobinHoods) were part of our 11th Aviation Battalion, 12th Combat Aviation Group, 1st Aviation Brigade. Tho since they were separated from us at Phu Loi, they were kinda like the "red-headed step-children" of the battalion. BTW - there is a 173rd bird (UH1-H) in the Smithsonian w/ the RobinHood hat painted on the nose.

Lai Khe was kind of a strange place - run by the 1st Infantry Div., not too big but, not a small base either. Nickname for Lai Khe was Rocket City or Sherwood Forest. Either because the RobinHoods were there or because the 1st Inf. had left all the trees in the interior of the base in place. The Rocket City nickname is self explanitory.

Bruce

I didn't make it to sunny South Viet Man; I spent 1968 on the FOX in Korea. The only AR I saw there was a light green AR 15 brought in by an AF FAC.
Something I had in the armsroom that I never got the replacement parts for was a High Standard 10A shotgun. I didn't see it mentioned in the thread and wondered if any made it into VN. During an alert, I spoke with a Colonel sitting in a 151 outside of the TOC. He had one sitting next to him. I had seen an article in a gun magazine with a picture of on being shot one-handed with a couple of ejected hulls in the air. The Colonel allowed as how it was accurate.
Anyone see one down South?

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It's the deed, not the device.