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  #1  
Old 01-10-2016, 06:38 PM
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I've been searching for one of these for a long time, and I think I've found a nice one.

This is an U.S. M2 .22 trainer, built using an M1903-type action at the original government Springfield Armory in Springfield, Massachusetts.




Here's the Lyman 48C - the original rear sight for these guns.



This appears to have been upgraded from the M1922M1 model to the M2 model. There are 5 reasons that indicate this. First, the marking on the receiver is overstamped with a "2" where the "1" was, while original manufacture M2s were stamped as simply "M2", not "M1922M2". 2. The receiver is blued, not Parkerized, as were all M2s. And yes, that's the original finish, revealed because the bolt channel in the receiver is left in the white. 3. The stock style is the previous M1 style. 4. The bolt is not numbered - it appears to have been an early M2 bolt that was later retrofitted with the adjustable headspace mechanism in the locking lug. This was done on about the first 3800 guns made. 5. The barrel is marked "10-1926" and was obviously more of an M1-era barrel, re-marked near the receiver after conversion to the M2. Here are the receiver markings, note the overstamp of the "2" over the "1."



Here are pictures of the bolt, showing the fore and aft of the locking lug with its headspace adjustment screw and the movable bearing surface.





And finally, the properly-marked M2 magazine - currently worth about $150 for its scarcity.




I'm estimating the original date of manufacture somewhere around 1927 or 1928, and the conversion to M2 status as circa 1936. The gun is in excellent condition. It came equipped with an original M1907 leather sling, which I removed so as to concentrate the pictures on the gun itself.

As to value, I'll let those more knowledgeable than myself make informed opinions. I'll tell you that after reviewing some M2s on the internet auctions, I think I made out like a bandit, and I'm super happy over this acquisition.

John
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  #2  
Old 01-10-2016, 07:11 PM
Ivan the Butcher Ivan the Butcher is offline
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Congratulations! You have a beautiful example there! I bet LTC will be along shortly and fill in any blanks (I don't see any) you may have missed.

Ivan
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Old 01-10-2016, 07:31 PM
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I love it when a fine piece of industrial art like that, finds a good home with someone who will do it justice. Springfield turned out some fine work.

Congrats on your find.
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Old 01-10-2016, 07:46 PM
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This is another of those accomplishments that leave me pretty much at a loss for words.

I know absolutely nothing about these rifles, but I do know a fantastic find when I see one. Isn't it great when you find something that you've been looking for over a long period of time.

Congratulations on an outstanding find. Outstanding photography, too!
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Old 01-10-2016, 07:54 PM
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What an incredible find!
Congrats!
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Old 01-10-2016, 08:08 PM
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very nice
congrats
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Old 01-10-2016, 09:50 PM
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Back in the late fifties, the ROTC vault at my high school had at least a dozen similar rifles in the racks, along with some Winchester 75's and 52's.

I remember those being for sale through the NRA for about $65, which doesn't seem like a lot until you realize M1 carbines and 1911's were a whole lot less.
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Old 01-10-2016, 10:17 PM
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That's a great find and a mint example to boot.
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Old 01-10-2016, 11:10 PM
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Check out Bill Brophy's book on the 1903 Springfield. I have #171XX with a 11-29 barrel, that has not been converted to M2, and was a NRA Sales gun to a Detroit NRA club. Yours was most likely original in 1926 and converted to M2 later, and still has the original barrel. It is a non-NRA sales gun with the finger groove stock and not drilled and tapped for scope mounts. Nice gun!
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Old 01-11-2016, 01:20 AM
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Originally Posted by wx7b View Post
Check out Bill Brophy's book on the 1903 Springfield. I have #171XX with a 11-29 barrel, that has not been converted to M2, and was a NRA Sales gun to a Detroit NRA club. Yours was most likely original in 1926 and converted to M2 later, and still has the original barrel. It is a non-NRA sales gun with the finger groove stock and not drilled and tapped for scope mounts. Nice gun!
Thanks for your comments. My understanding is that 1922M1 models that were converted to M2 had another "1" added to that designation on the receiver (making it "M1922M11") and the letter "B" added after the serial number to avoid possible duplication of serials. This gun has a "2" overstamp and there was no "B" added as a suffix to the serial number. Both of these deviations have been recorded on other rifles, as inconsistency in manufacturing protocols did exist.

According to recent information from some experts on this rifle, it appears it was originally an M1922M1, probably produced at Springfield in the 1927-1928 time period, and then upgraded to M2 specs in the 1935-1941 period. This was commonly done with most M1922M1s.

John
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Old 01-11-2016, 02:04 AM
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I like it but have never seen one for sale around here, heck, I don't think I have ever seen such nice pictures of a rifle. I just feel fortunate to have found a nice 03A3 but I guess if I should come across a M2 .22 trainer, I will have a pretty good idea of what it should look like now; thanks for posting.
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Old 01-11-2016, 02:58 AM
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The Lyman sight and blued finish are stunning.


Congratulations.
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Old 01-11-2016, 11:16 PM
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I shot on a college ROTC rifle team from 1951 to 1955. We had the Springfield M2, and one of them taught me how to shoot a rifle. In 1955 we got Remington 513Ts, which I didn't like as much; the stock was too full and I had trouble getting behind the sight.

I wanted one for a long time. Finally, in the early 1960s I was stationed in Norfolk VA, and the Norfolk Naval Base had sales about once a quarter of surplus shotguns and 22 rifles, including a few Springfields. The Springfields were $25. Most were missing the magazines and for some reason the extractors. At one time I had 5 of them. The Navy must have got a bad lot of ammo, as all but the one I kept had rings in the bore where a stuck bullet had been shot out. One had 5 rings; putting a patch down that one was interesting. I shot my keeper a lot; actually shot it in very informal, monthly matches indoors at 50'; in that company, it was competitive.

The one I kept was interesting. It is stamped M1911M1 on the receiver and has a 1930 barrel screwed into it, probably original. Serial number is 19087. It's actually an M2, which has been upgraded from an M1922M1 by the addition of the new bolt. But the receiver was never restamped. I guess the Navy just got the parts from Army Ordnance and didn't bother restamping them. The Navy isn't really interested in rifles unless the bore is at least 5".
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Old 01-12-2016, 12:52 AM
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Gorgeous rifle! Nice find.
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Old 01-12-2016, 09:56 AM
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Great find, John!

In the early 40s my father was captain of the rifle team at Decatur Boy's High, and coach of the rifle team at Decatur Girl's High (a highly desirable post).

He loved the M2 rifles and I always wanted to find one for him. The only one I ever saw was at a gunshow and it was worn out and very expensive.

He passed last year and we found his old HS annual. There's a picture in it of him and the team with their rifles. If one of my sisters hasn't taken it already I'll try to get a scan.
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Old 01-12-2016, 10:26 AM
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You might not hit a Gray Hound bus with that one, but I bet you could scare the fire out of the driver!
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Old 01-12-2016, 10:29 AM
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The M1922 was built with actions specific to the rifle, not on 1903 actions. Same size and shape but not 1903.

I have a 3 digit M1922 built in 1922, never upgraded, but at some point converted to center fire and chambered for the 22 Hornet.

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Old 01-12-2016, 11:15 AM
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Sweeeeet.....great and fun find................saw references to ROTC rifle teams using them.....wow.........

Can't imagine that...what's the front sight? a post?.. we had Winchester 52s in High School (late 60/early 70d) and Annies in College.

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Old 01-12-2016, 11:41 AM
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What an interesting .22! Thanks for the great photos!
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Old 01-12-2016, 12:20 PM
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I owned an M2-22 many years ago. Like a dumb fool, I sold it in order to finance a hunting rifle. Great rifle and extremely accurate.
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Old 01-12-2016, 12:31 PM
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... I have wanted one for a long time.

Nice find!
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Old 01-12-2016, 12:59 PM
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Quote:
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Sweeeeet.....great and fun find................saw references to ROTC rifle teams using them.....wow.........

Can't imagine that...what's the front sight? a post?.. we had Winchester 52s in High School (late 60/early 70d) and Annies in College.
The front sight is a standard (maybe slightly shorter) M1903 rifle type, equipped with the standard G.I. front sight protector.

John
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Old 01-12-2016, 01:06 PM
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My M2 has the caliber stamp on the barrel upside-down! Pretty cool...
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Old 01-12-2016, 01:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigolddave View Post
Back in the late fifties, the ROTC vault at my high school had at least a dozen similar rifles in the racks, along with some Winchester 75's and 52's.

I remember those being for sale through the NRA for about $65, which doesn't seem like a lot until you realize M1 carbines and 1911's were a whole lot less.
The original M1922s sold for $39.25 when first offered (1922). Sounds cheap, except that the average monthly wage then was about $40! These rifles were absolutely the best .22 target types that could be had, and won many important matches.

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Old 01-12-2016, 06:01 PM
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In doing research for an article I'm writing on the Springfield M1922 series of rifles, I came across this picture I thought I'd share with you. The photo purports to show a women's college rifle club dating from 1925. It's proof that these rifles had wide distribution only 3 years after they were first produced. The one on the left with scope blocks appears to have a recoil pad mounted. The other rifles shown include other bolt actions and a couple of falling blocks, as best I can tell. Things were certainly different 91 years ago!

John

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Old 01-12-2016, 06:18 PM
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Very nice, congratulations! They are wonderful rifles.
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:55 AM
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Got to shoot one of these when I had just been discharged from the military in 1969. Dead on accurate, the rifle belonged to the local PD as part of a teen marksmanship program,there were 6 of these rifles.
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Old 01-13-2016, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PALADIN85020 View Post
In doing research for an article I'm writing on the Springfield M1922 series of rifles, I came across this picture I thought I'd share with you. The photo purports to show a women's college rifle club dating from 1925. It's proof that these rifles had wide distribution only 3 years after they were first produced. The one on the left with scope blocks appears to have a recoil pad mounted. The other rifles shown include other bolt actions and a couple of falling blocks, as best I can tell. Things were certainly different 91 years ago!

John

I have to say that several of the young women in that photo have the 1000 yard stare! 😨
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Old 01-13-2016, 11:55 PM
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The second rifle from the left is one of the early Winchester 52s. I can't identify any of the others except the two Springfields. A couple of those girls look pretty angry to me. Perhaps they were uncomfortable with the cold, but with that face and carrying a rifle, I'd be very careful around them.
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Old 01-14-2016, 02:17 AM
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Looks like a few Stevens single shot rifles in the pic. You can make out the lever which dropped the breech block behind the chamber. Yeah the second one from the left looks kinda ticked off about something scary that one. Frank
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Old 01-14-2016, 12:28 PM
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To me they look like Winchester Low Walls, have owned a few with the sling swivels. They made some 'training rifles' like that owned two, one was a real shooter. One is now being used on a junior rifle team in PA has been restocked and barreled with a Remington barrel by Pappernick. Also had one that had been re-chambered to 22 hornet. Some of the Springfields were re-chambered to hornets also.

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Old 01-14-2016, 12:41 PM
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Those Winchester training rifles were probably 'Winder Muskets'. I have one in 22 short. Sure would like on in 22 LR.
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Old 01-14-2016, 02:30 PM
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Good for you. Acquiring a long sought-after gun is a geat experience - great happiness with a touch of sadness. "Now what?" comes to mind.

Any chance you would share the story of your hunt? That is, how you came across the gun and subsequently bought it?

Not asking its price, just asking for a chance to daydream ... and please don't tell us you got it at a rummage sale for $25.
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Old 01-14-2016, 08:35 PM
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Good for you. Acquiring a long sought-after gun is a geat experience - great happiness with a touch of sadness. "Now what?" comes to mind.

Any chance you would share the story of your hunt? That is, how you came across the gun and subsequently bought it?

Not asking its price, just asking for a chance to daydream ... and please don't tell us you got it at a rummage sale for $25.
Let me preface this by saying I have not seen one of these since I left high school (1957). I go to a LOT of gun shows, sniffing out classic guns that I can write about, but not ONE has ever had one of the M1922 series on a table.

Until this last Saturday. The show was in Mesa, AZ and featured ONLY antique firearms, none of the modern black plastic junk.

I walked past this table and did a double take - there were TWO of these guns there. This one, and an NRA-style rifle, which was marked way beyond my means. I zeroed in on this one, examined it thoroughly, and although I had not yet boned up on 'em very much yet, it looked legit.

The owner of the table was absent at that moment, and he had no surrogate there to help him. So help me, I stood in front of that table for 20 minutes. I almost went to his chair behind the table to sit - but I was determined not to let this one get away.

When he came back, I first introduced myself, and he recognized my name from being a subscriber to the Blue Press. I told him I had shot these rifles when I was in high school ROTC, and had always lusted after one. I think I had him when he saw the tears in my eyes.

To make a long story short, I didn't have the money on my person to buy it at his asking price, but I told him I'd give him everything I had on me then - which was about 80% of what he was legitimately asking.

He relented and agreed to sell it to me. Color me ecstatic....

John
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Old 01-14-2016, 10:17 PM
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"Tears in your eyes" I will have to remember that!
Again Congratulations!
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Old 01-14-2016, 10:39 PM
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Wow. Nice!
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Old 01-14-2016, 10:42 PM
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Nice rifle, and great find! I guess my "grail gun" is a 1922M1 never modified to M2. They seem to be impossible to find.
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Old 01-14-2016, 11:27 PM
James Mooney James Mooney is offline
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Default .22 target rifle

While this is a S&W forum I couldn't resist adding my .22 winder musket. It was rechambered to .218 Bee. Shoots like a house afire! Had a scope mounted and it is my turkey gun during deer season. It's also taken a deer.
JM
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Old 01-15-2016, 11:22 AM
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John,

The 10-1926 stamped on the end of the barrel, located just behind the sight, is the manufacture date of the rifle, though most likely it refers to the original M1 iteration, prior to its conversion to an M2. I have an M1922M1 (it may actually be stamped M1922M11, I can't remember), its manufacture date (as evidenced by the barrel marking) is 7-1926; its serial number is 77xx, with no prefix or suffix.

I haven't pulled mine out of the safe for a long time, but you have piqued my interest enough to dig it out at the next opportunity and take another look. I do recall that mine also has the original Lyman sight (a 48B, I think), the original magazine (I don't recall the marking on it) as well as the M1907 leather sling.

I will take another look at mine shortly, and will subsequently verify/update the above information about it.

I picked mine up a few years ago for $200 and am curious how much you paid for yours, though I understand your reticence to divulge it (perhaps you can PM me?). I only did a small amount of research when I initially acquired my specimen, then locked it away. I'd be very interested in hearing what you find out yours is worth.

Thanks for posting!

-Dave
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Old 01-15-2016, 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by PALADIN85020 View Post
In doing research for an article I'm writing on the Springfield M1922 series of rifles, I came across this picture I thought I'd share with you. The photo purports to show a women's college rifle club dating from 1925. It's proof that these rifles had wide distribution only 3 years after they were first produced. The one on the left with scope blocks appears to have a recoil pad mounted. The other rifles shown include other bolt actions and a couple of falling blocks, as best I can tell. Things were certainly different 91 years ago!

John

That is a tough looking team. The girl standing in the middle looks like Larry Fine. I do wonder where those nice rifles are today.
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Old 01-16-2016, 12:48 AM
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My M2 and two NRA Springfields:


One G & H Springfield and one probable G & H Springfield:




Sedgley Springfield:

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Old 01-16-2016, 12:49 AM
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A wonderful photograph:
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Old 01-16-2016, 01:00 PM
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A wonderful photograph:
That's a great photo - thanks for posting it. Too bad the lady shooting the rifle was not instructed on how to properly use the sling, military-style, to improve steadiness. Once it was tightened (higher up) to her left arm, she needed to insert that arm way through over the sling, then twist/wrap into it clockwise to provide tightness and stability. As illustrated, that sling would not have been of much help.

John
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Old 01-17-2016, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PALADIN85020 View Post
In doing research for an article I'm writing on the Springfield M1922 series of rifles, I came across this picture I thought I'd share with you. The photo purports to show a women's college rifle club dating from 1925. It's proof that these rifles had wide distribution only 3 years after they were first produced. The one on the left with scope blocks appears to have a recoil pad mounted. The other rifles shown include other bolt actions and a couple of falling blocks, as best I can tell. Things were certainly different 91 years ago!

John


I really dig this photo. A hard looking bunch of girls there!
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Old 01-17-2016, 01:17 PM
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The third one from the right has the look of one who loves her work. I think I am in love!
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Old 01-17-2016, 02:52 PM
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The third one from the right has the look of one who loves her work. I think I am in love!
Unfortunately, she would be about 100 years old now; probably dead and gone. Tough luck, pard.

John
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Old 01-17-2016, 02:57 PM
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Dreams never die!
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Old 01-20-2016, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PALADIN85020 View Post
In doing research for an article I'm writing on the Springfield M1922 series of rifles, I came across this picture I thought I'd share with you. The photo purports to show a women's college rifle club dating from 1925. It's proof that these rifles had wide distribution only 3 years after they were first produced. The one on the left with scope blocks appears to have a recoil pad mounted. The other rifles shown include other bolt actions and a couple of falling blocks, as best I can tell. Things were certainly different 91 years ago!

John

Check out those hairdos. And we think they have some strange ones today!!
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Old 02-02-2016, 02:14 PM
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Very nice ~ congratulations!
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Old 02-02-2016, 04:21 PM
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Beautiful find. I had the pleasure of shooting one of these when I was stationed in Fort Leavenworth, KS at an indoor range. It was a tack driver. It had a very smooth action too. If you weren't putting the bullets on top of each other, it was not the firearm's fault. Enjoy that little masterpiece.
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