I've got a thing for the old classic semi-auto rifles used by Law Enforcement back in the day for "high risk" arrests. The Remington 8 and 81, as well as the Winchester '07, were used by State, Local, and Federal Officers to take on John Dillinger, Lester Gillis ("Baby-face Nelson"), and Bonnie and Clyde.

I've posted pics of my Remington 81...here is my Winchester '07 SLR. It shoots a .351 Winchester Self Loading round.

Looks like quite a beast. One thing puzzles me, how do you cock the thing.

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Release the Kraken

Hey, Steve!

It is actually kinda small and compact...about the size of an M1 Carbine.

You cock it with the rod below the barrel.

Speaking of M1 carbine, I'm told that the M1 carbine round developed by Winchester was based on the .351 round.

Here is the ammo

The way I heard it - the 32 SLR was the parent of the 30 Carbine.

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Merle, retired
western PA

There are 4 rounds in that family, 32SL, 351SL, 30 M1, and the big daddy of them all 401SL. I think it went with the 1905 SLR Winchester. Ever since I got one round for my collection, I've wanted a shooter grade rifle! The round I have must be from around WWI as it has a steel jacket, and is FMJ.

Ivan

IIRC, there was a 35 SL, that got upgraded to become the 351, and the 30 M1 wasn't chambered in any of the old Winchester self loaders.

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Merle, retired
western PA

One of the things John Browning patented was the cocking handle on the bolt. He designed his Automatic shotgun and offered it to Winchester but asked for a royalty instead of just selling it to them outright as he had with the 1885, 1886, 1892, 1894, 1895 and 1897. They said no. He went to Remington but the president of Remington died of a heart attack while Browning was waiting to see him. Browning then went to FN. So the Browning Auto 5 had a cocking handle while the Winchester 1911 was cocked by grabbing the barrel and pulling it back into the action. The FN / Remington Model 8 and Model 81 rifles had cocking handles on the bolt but the Winchester 1903, 1905, 1907 and 1910 had charging handles (rod) under the barrel sticking out the front of the fore end.

The op’s gun has a lot of condition. Most of them I see around up here have no bluing on them and the magazines are like hens teeth. Haven’t run across one in the 401 caliber either. They do point really good though.

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Bob
Sic Semper Tyrannis

There's a battered old '07 in a plastic display case in Camp Crame, Manila, Philippines. I think there were two or three greenish rounds with it. Apparently the old Philippine Constabulary used a very few of those before Japanese occupation.

You are correct, I forgot about the anemic 35 SL! And the 32 SL was incredibly under powered also, (I do have one of each in my collection too),but Winchester and "Machine Gun" Williams used the 32SL brass as the basis for the 30 M1 Carbine round.

Ivan

I bet a lot of folks think the “patrol rifle” is a new concept with the AR’s. In fact they have been around a long time. I would bet the lever action Winchesters were the most popular in rural departments, probably until fairly recently.

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No school like the old school.

Had both a 401 & 351 but got rid of them (at a good profit). They were fun to shoot but factory ammo cost was outrageous. I reloaded both of them but tired of trying to find the fired cases as they were thrown quite a distance away by the guns & at a buck or more a case it broke my heart to loose any.

I bought a mod 07 Winchester in the 54xxx serial number range IIRC back in the 1970s. Then went on a hunt for ammo and extra magazines which were available at reasonable cost at the time. I even scored a 10 round mag from a dealer that had bought 07s and mags from a mid west prison several years ago. What a well made rifle.

I used a 351 one day on a deer hunt. I shot a deer and it had no problem killing it. Shot was about 30yds. It wasn't my rifle. The host of the camp was cranked on my Rem 141/35cal because his dad used to have one. I told him he could use it and he insisted I use his 351. That's the total experience I have hunting with one.

In the 80s the State Pen in Moundsville, WVa had gotten m16s on govt deal. They had a rack full of 351s to get rid of. They wanted to trade them gun for gun for 30 carbines. I think there were 28 of them. I couldn't swing it. There was 4 of them that looked brand new. Captain of the guard told me those were reserved as deer rifles for warden and staff. The rest of them were beat from guards dragging them around. They also had more 351 ammo than I ever saw in one place.

I think you are right about that

I have always wanted the Winchester M1910 in .401 WSL but have yet to find one in a good enough condition to justify the price. Ballistics of the .401 cartridge are very impressive. About 10 years ago I found a M1910, but it got bought by someone else right under my nose. No one has yet mentioned that there were some Winchester M1907s used by the French during WWI. And to chime in on another point, the .30 M1 Carbine round was modeled after the .32 WSL.

I have a 1910 / 401
I make ammo from 7.62x39mm and use 41Magnum dies.
I made an expander to open up the brass in one step from 30 to 41 cal out of an un-used 45acp expander. I simply turned the existing 45cal expander to a taper. Slightly less then 30 to around 40+.
Plenty of lube and annealing the brass first, one pass does it w/o any case loss.
Then use the 41Mag dies to FL size, expand, ect the brass.
No trimming.
The cases come out a little wasp waist the first time but fire form.
I load CAST 41Mag bullets. They barely bulge the brass using Winchester brand brass. Some other brass can't be used it bulges it too badly.
I run the loaded round slightly back into the FL sized to remove the offending bulge.

I have a . Lee 401 bullet sizer die I have to get around to enlarging to 406 or 407 to size the bullets in. That'll take care of that last problem.

4227 powder, a slightly compressed load. The Commie brass won't take anywhere near what the Lyman book says is a normal load in the round,,just heavier brass I take it.

Works as advertised. Feeds fires ejects. Excellent deer accuracy at 50m.
HAven't tried it at 100 yet.

The 2 rounds on the left are factory 401

Then one of my reloads on Winchester 7.62x39mm brass, lead 41mag bullet. Case has been reloaded 4 or 5 times so it's starting to get chewed up a bit.

Empty Winchester 7.62x39

Factory 32 WSLR (165gr bullet, most reload with the same 170gr as the 32 Winchester Special)

As much as I don't care for the .350 Legend as a hunting cartridge as I have better alternatives in my state, it would make an interesting 21st century version of the .351WSL.

There is some buzz that Ruger will offer a Mini-14 in the caliber, which is by far the most likely way we'll see a 1907-like self loader in .350 vs. the various ARs that are already in production. Yes I know their method of operation is very different; there's several reasons we don't see many recoil operated rifles anymore.

In my rural part of the country, where there is the possibility of running into cougar, bear, coyotes, and of course two legged predators, a 20 shot .350 carbine would have some appeal.

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Psalm 27:2

Seems I heard somewhere that one reason the cops had such a hard time with the UT tower shooter back in 1966 was the cops only had 351 SL's which were too underpowered to be effective against the shooter.

At one time I thought about finding a 351 Contender barrel to use for deer. (Then I came to my senses.) We're limited to straight-walled cases.

Here's an M1 carbine round next to a .351 WSL round...

My recent GunBroker pick up of a very nice 4 digit 1907. These are very cool rifles, and very heavy for what is considered a carbine style rifle.
I also picked up a nice 1910 .401 SL which I need to get some photos of... stand by.

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OGCA Member.

What I find somewhat amazing is that a 1907 Winchester was already in Portugal on the first of February 1908 and was used to assassinate King Carlos I.

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Expect the unexpected