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Old 05-12-2022, 07:24 PM
.357magger .357magger is offline
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Default Anyone Else Like The War Baby?

One of the first guns I ever owned was the M1 Carbine. That would have been around 1977-78, cut grass all summer and bought it in the fall (or my Dad did anyway). Sold/traded it a couple of years later for I don't remember what. But it's one of the few over the years that I really regret letting go.

So...last week I was at local pawnshop and they were just putting out a 1944 Standard Products M1 Carbine. Asking price was $1200. Jerry at the shop dropped it for me to $1000 OTD. So I plopped down a deposit and came back this week with Craig Reish's reference book.

Went over it head to toe, 100% GI, and as a cherry on top, no import marks. Looks in pretty darn good shape to me, right down to the visible cartouches.

Over 6 million made, but this one is mine. 😁

Who else is a fan of the War Baby?
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Old 05-12-2022, 07:31 PM
.357magger .357magger is offline
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A couple more glamour shots. 😎
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Old 05-12-2022, 07:56 PM
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Oh yeah im with you. Used to play army with dads m1 carbine stock with a section of bamboo cane fishing pole taped in for the barrel with electrical tape. That was at least 45 years ago. Have always tried to keep one or two around; and a couple thousand rounds. They are first class defensive carbines all my girls can shoot effectively.

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Old 05-12-2022, 07:59 PM
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Absolutely, an enjoyable piece of American history bought my first one while in high school in 1965
a Postal Meter if I remember correctly and just like you sold or traded it for something else.

Second one an Inland came with 5 15 round magazines and 700 rounds of ammo for the unheard of
price of $700.00. Only problem was a previous owner sanded down the stock and totally destroyed
all the cartouches. Oh well.

terry
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Old 05-12-2022, 08:14 PM
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I have collected a few over my time............ One of each manufacturer, and two Inland M1A1's.
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Old 05-12-2022, 08:29 PM
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I regret never picking one up when I had the spare funds. My dad carried one in WWII, always spoke fondly of it.

That's him on the left with his cousin that he bumped into by chance in France, 1944

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Old 05-12-2022, 08:34 PM
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A replacement for a 1911 handgun.......
Never wanted one as the great rifle of WWII is the M1 Grand!
General Patton knew that.......
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Old 05-12-2022, 08:47 PM
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They are light in weight and compact, easy to shoot and low in recoil, but not a replacement for the M1 Garand in terms of accuracy or power.
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Old 05-12-2022, 09:03 PM
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So much more character than any Mickey Mouse gun. "...without my rifle, I am useless..."
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Old 05-12-2022, 09:11 PM
.357magger .357magger is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S&W Fan View Post
I regret never picking one up when I had the spare funds. My dad carried one in WWII, always spoke fondly of it.

That's him on the left with his cousin that he bumped into by chance in France, 1944


What a great photo. Thanks for sharing it.

Your Dad's comment is fairly typical regarding those who used the Carbine in combat from the various WW2 books I've read and the oral histories I've heard.

Regardless, a whole lot of somebody's used these weapons for a pretty long time.
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Old 05-12-2022, 09:17 PM
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I bought my first M1 Carbine on my 18th birthday in 1979, first gun that I actually did the paper work for. Paid $300 for it and it came with a half dozen GI 15 round mags, a sling and a nice WWII M4 Bayonet. Traded it shortly there after on a AR180. My Dad carried a M1 Carbine in WWII. I have owned a few since but had not had one in awhile before nostalgia crept up on me and I found one to add to the collection from a member on another Forum. Just a good honest post WWII rebuild Inland
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Old 05-12-2022, 09:52 PM
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I have had a significant historical interest in M1 carbines since the early 1990's, and I also carried one in my patrol car for about 12 years in the early 2000's.


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Old 05-12-2022, 10:01 PM
30-30remchester 30-30remchester is offline
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Killed my first deer with one of those when I was 12 years old. Neet little guns perfect for the role they were intended.
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Old 05-12-2022, 11:43 PM
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I now kinda wish I'd bought one along the way. I never really wanted one in the past because of my father's opinion of them. He carried one for awhile as a young Lt. forward observer for a Cannon Company in the 79th Infantry Division. He quit carrying it when it let him down when he was caught out in front of his line checking on an outpost (already deceased). He had to run for his life while his guys back at the line provided cover fire. He was wounded in the left arm and was unable to return fire due to his carbine failing. I don't think I ever heard him mention what the failure was. I never thought to ask. He carried a Garand thereafter.

They seem to be fun handy little carbines. Wasn't someone making new one recently?
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Old 05-12-2022, 11:57 PM
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The M-1 Carbine is my favorite long gun. My Dad bought me my first M-1 when I got home from boot camp. A really nice Inland for $275. Dad liked it so much he bought one for himself, but the price had gone up to $325. Over the years I have picked up several more, most I ever paid was $600 for a Postal Meter from CMP.
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Old 05-13-2022, 01:02 AM
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Quote:
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They seem to be fun handy little carbines. Wasn't someone making new one recently?
Kahr/Auto Ordnance and Inland Manufacturing are the two newest commercial manufacturers. I've read good things about the Kahr, not so good about the Inland. Don't have personal experience with either.

Fulton Armory offers them as well as rebuilding/restorations. I've read great reviews for them.

There were a number of commercial manufacturers during the 70s - 90s. Iver Johnson, Universal, Plainfield, Howa, and maybe a couple of others.

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Old 05-13-2022, 01:56 AM
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Never even held one much less owned one. But I did get this on my 10th birthday. Was my favorite shooter until,I graduated to my Nylon 66 2 years later.

Crosman M1 Carbine | Crosman Air Rifles | Vintage Airguns Gallery Forum
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Old 05-13-2022, 07:01 AM
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Never even held one much less owned one. But I did get this on my 10th birthday. Was my favorite shooter until,I graduated to my Nylon 66 2 years later.

Crosman M1 Carbine | Crosman Air Rifles | Vintage Airguns Gallery Forum
Yep, I had one of those too
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Old 05-13-2022, 09:04 AM
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Killed my first deer with one of those when I was 12 years old. Neet little guns perfect for the role they were intended.
It's not an optimal deer rifle, but it'll do the job up close. I've taken several in the 50 to 75 yard range hunting the big woods in south Arkansas and all were one shot stops using Winchester soft/hollow points.

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Old 05-13-2022, 09:31 AM
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Bought mine a year ago, wonder what took me so long to discover this great little handy Carbine





I think it avoided the post war upgrades









U.S. CARBINE CAL. 30 M1 - Underwood Elliott Fisher Company

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Old 05-13-2022, 10:31 AM
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One of my favorites, was fascinated by the little carbine since I was a kid. Got into seriously collecting them back when all the imports were coming in back in the late 80's/early 90's. Had every manufacturer except Irwin Pederson. Never found one of those at a price I could afford. Some were older DCM guns, most were later returns. One came from the son of a WWII officer and I suspect came home with him. I really enjoyed collecting and shooting them but changing life circumstances led to me selling most of them off a few years ago. Only have one left now, a Quality Hardware gun that had the recoil plate and barrel glass bedded at some point in it's life. It's a great shooting little gun, no import marks so I suspect it was a DCM gun at one time.

As a side note I can't really say what got me hooked on carbines when I was a kid. They could be seen in various TV shows and movies and I was fascinated with military books. Dad was a vet, Korean war era but I never talked guns with him much as a kid. Later in life we did talk, he liked the carbine for it's light weight and handiness but for shooting he preferred the Garand. Since his main job was driving supply trucks he ended up with a carbine and I have several pics of him with one. So there is always a place for a carbine in my gun safe... and a Garand to keep it company.
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Old 05-13-2022, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faulkner View Post
It's not an optimal deer rifle, but it'll do the job up close. I've taken several in the 50 to 75 yard range hunting the big woods in south Arkansas and all were one shot stops using Winchester soft/hollow points.

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My results using the 30 Carbine on deer the same as yours. My only deer was a small mule deer buck at 50 yards using Winchester hollow points. The shot was to the heart and stopped in the heart perfectly mushroomed. I carried the bullet around for years to show friends till I eventually lost it. The recovered bullet fascinated me so, that I have spent 56 years collecting recovered bullets from game animals. I have in excess of 200 in my collection but would give a chunk of change if I could find my first bullet again.
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Old 05-13-2022, 10:37 AM
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When I was a kid these things were for sale all over the place and cheap. They just never lit my fire. To be honest, they still don't. But, I can see why history buffs and others might like them.
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Old 05-13-2022, 10:42 AM
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I have some and enjoy loading for and shooting them. Friend has an original Paratrooper folding stock carbine(from the CMP) if I want to jump out of an airplane.
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Old 05-13-2022, 11:26 AM
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A friend's carbine collection.
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Old 05-13-2022, 11:45 AM
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When I was a kid these things were for sale all over the place and cheap. They just never lit my fire. To be honest, they still don't. But, I can see why history buffs and others might like them.
I liked their looks but was never really moved to buy one until I noticed a tactical rifle match was scheduled in the morning on the same Saturday as a DCM High Power leg match.

It was a two gun shoot with a full size .30 caliber battle rifle (M1, M1A, FAL, HK-91, BM-59, etc) required as well as a “light rifle” such as an AR-15, AK/AKM, AR-180, HK-93, Mini-14, SKS, or M1 Carbine.

I didn’t own a suitable rifle at the time, but I knew of an excellent condition Inland M1 carbine for $125 at one of the local gun shops. That was about &50 more than an SKS, but I liked the looks of the M1 a lot more. I bought it along with 3 new in the wrap GI 30 round magazine and the only two boxes of .30 carbine ammo they had - 50 round boxes of surplus Lake City ammo.

I fired 10 rounds to confirm the zero and confirm the sight settings out to the 250 yard max for the shoot a hour or so before tue start of the match and loaded the other 90 rounds into the three 30 round magazines.

I had attracted some attention from the AR-15 crowd, which at the time consisted of shooters with mostly 16” carbines with minor mods such as muzzle brakes and trigger jobs. They thought I was wildly optimistic to think I’d be competitive with my “antique” M1 carbine.

However, by this time with just 10 rounds down range, I was impressed with the M1 Carbine in terms of its light weight, fast handling and excellent pointability at short range and it’s surprisingly serviceable accuracy out to 250 yards max required for the light rifle stage with most shots being 100 yards or less, where speed and handling mattered.

Besides, I knew I’d clean house on the “long rangel targets in the .30 “battle rattle” stage and do well at the shorter range targets as the M1A/M14 points and snap shoots extremely well at short range.

In any case, I placed second in the light rifle category (with first place going to the match organizer and his HK-93), beating every AR-15 in the field with my “antique”. I placed first in the battle rattle with my M1A and between the two placed first overall.

I became an M1 Carbine fan that day. I’m still a fan and currently own three of them:

- an Underwood;
- a Saginaw; and
- a Quality Hardware.

——

Terminal performance poor compared to 5.56 M193 ball ammo, although .30 carbine still gives pretty impressive temporary wound cavity results in ballistic gel with 110 gr FMJ at just under 2000 fps.

However, with 110 gr soft points, 100 gr semi jacketed soft points, or 110 gr Hornady FTX bullets you get very solid 18-21” penetration and expansion from .45” to .65” depending on the specific bullet used.

That performance along with its light weight, excellent handling and suitable accuracy out to 200-250 yards makes it an impressive personal defense weapon with terminal ballistics that don’t far behind a .357 Magnum hollow point fired from a carbine.
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Old 05-13-2022, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by CLASSIC12 View Post
Bought mine a year ago, wonder what took me so long to discover this great little handy Carbine





I think it avoided the post war upgrades









U.S. CARBINE CAL. 30 M1 - Underwood Elliott Fisher Company
Not bad for a typewriter company huh?

That's another aspect of these arms that really interest me. How quickly it was put into production by such a diverse group of manufacturers.

Standard Products was, and still is, a manufacturer of automotive systems and components. They produced just shy of 250,000 of the 6+ million made during WW2. Most used barrels from Underwood, like mine, and other sub assembly parts.

I'd personally LOVE to find a Rock Ola. I think the jukebox angle is pretty cool. I've fondled a couple over the years but the asking price was always too rich for my wallet.

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Old 05-13-2022, 12:43 PM
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Over the years I've had a casual interest in the M-1 Carbine. My first was a $29.95 Underwood out of a 55 gallon drum full of surplus carbines from a Yellow Front store.

Ten or so years later anther Underwood from J&G sales at maybe $150.

Fast forward 20 years yet another Underwood at about $600 from a gun show seller.

About five years later I picked up my current Carbine, a Saginaw from Cabela's for about $650. I just installed a push safety in it s a couple of days ago.
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Old 05-13-2022, 12:57 PM
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Love my carbine. I only have 1, genuine GI. I want to say Inland, can't remember and I'm not home.

I love how every time I shoot it at the range, some historian points out that "you know the North Koreans just got up, dusted themselves off and kept coming..." I have a standing offer: I'll give you $50 to pace off 50 yds, bend over, and I'll shoot you in the butt with it. It's only a . 30 carbine, probably won't even break the skin...

No takers yet!
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Old 05-13-2022, 04:20 PM
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A lot of people suggest a lever action carbine in something live .357 or even .44 Magnum as a home defense weapon these days. They are light, carry a respectable amount of ammo and have increased ballistics due to the longer barrels.

But I sure think an M-1 Carbine with a 15 round magazine loaded with soft points or hollow points will still be a very effective home defense weapon, even some 80 years after its introduction. And, other than needed two hands to chamber the first round, it is light and short enough to shoot or handle with one hand should the other be holding a phone or flashlight. What's not to love about the M-1 Carbine ?

Well, it's not a .30-06 but it sure will do the job within a 200 yard radius, maybe a little more if pressed.
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Old 05-13-2022, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Patrick L View Post
Love my carbine. I only have 1, genuine GI. I want to say Inland, can't remember and I'm not home.

I love how every time I shoot it at the range, some historian points out that "you know the North Koreans just got up, dusted themselves off and kept coming..." I have a standing offer: I'll give you $50 to pace off 50 yds, bend over, and I'll shoot you in the butt with it. It's only a . 30 carbine, probably won't even break the skin...

No takers yet!
The myth has always been that the 110 gr bullet at 1600 or so fps at around 100 yards wouldn’t penetrate the ice and snow encrusted padded cotton coats and underlying uniforms of the Chinese troops.

The reality is that under that large padded cotton coat was a skinny Chinese soldier and a lot of empty space around the edges of that soldier for the bullet to pass.

The reality is also that .30 carbine 110 gr FMJ will penetrate 6-7” of plywood.
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Old 05-13-2022, 05:12 PM
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Not bad for a typewriter company huh?

That's another aspect of these arms that really interest me. How quickly it was put into production by such a diverse group of manufacturers.

Standard Products was, and still is, a manufacturer of automotive systems and components. They produced just shy of 250,000 of the 6+ million made during WW2. Most used barrels from Underwood, like mine, and other sub assembly parts.

I'd personally LOVE to find a Rock Ola. I think the jukebox angle is pretty cool. I've fondled a couple over the years but the asking price was always too rich for my wallet.
I came across an M1 carbine in a local gun shop that was marked as a Rock Ola on the hang tag. To be fair to the LGS owner it did have a Rock-Ola barrel, but it didn’t take much looking to see a “Qua” peeking out from under one side of the rear sight and an “are” peeking out from the other.

A quick check of the serial number verified it was in a block assigned to Quality Hardware. I pointed that out to the LGS who had bought it thinking it was a Rock Ola.

But it was none the less original as the date on the barrel matched the serial range, and Rock Ola was just down the street from Quality Hardware. Consequently Rock-Ola barrels were commonly installed on Quality Hardware carbines.

It was none the less nicely priced as there were not many more Quality Hardware carbines made than there were Rock Ola carbines and I took it home.
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Old 05-13-2022, 05:14 PM
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I was a little late to the party and gave a little more for these two. The top one is a Postal Meter and the bottom is Winchester. The Winchester's serial number puts it late enough to have the bayonet lug and the swing safety. I have several books on them and whenever I feel like getting a little confused I get them out. With so many manufacturers and all sharing parts and pieces it can be a challenge to know what you have.



The Winchester is probably a 1945 rifle according to the books. It has a M-2 pot belly stock.

So much to learn, so little time.

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Old 05-13-2022, 11:52 PM
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I'd personally LOVE to find a Rock Ola. I think the jukebox angle is pretty cool. I've fondled a couple over the years but the asking price was always too rich for my wallet.
I did 45 years ago, and I could kick myself for not trying to buy it. Back in 1977 the City of Reading, PA was going to auction off a boatload of S&W snub nosed revolvers and M1 carbines that the Police Department had. I am still sure to this day that at least one of the carbines was a Rock Ola, and I knew back then it was something special. But alas, i was on my first job out of school and just starting to work. I should have taken a chance back then.
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Old 05-14-2022, 01:54 AM
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I've handled them, watched others shoot them, but never have had a chance to fire one, shame to say.

I think it was a brilliant move to launch production of these for WW2. You can complain all you want about how inferior they were to the M1 Garand, but they beat the heck out of a 1911A1 or a .38 revolver for those who just needed a personal defense weapon.

Most troops already knew how to operate and get hits with one because of their rifle training. They had peep sights, which meant if they could see it, they could hit it, out to the limits of the cartridge. The basic load was three 15-round magazines. Very few of these troops were skilled with a handgun. The carbine round had much better penetration on things like steel helmets.

There are times when only a handgun will do, but in most cases, an M1 Carbine was a far better choice.
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Old 05-14-2022, 07:43 AM
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I love my M1 that I inherited from my dad.
I believe it's a 1943 by Standard
I still shoot it too. That little 30 cal is super handy
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Old 05-14-2022, 10:54 AM
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Default FAKE M-1's

My first M-1 Carbine was a fake. Made by Universal, and use the metal Hand Guard. These only appear to be a US M- Carbine! They accept the same magazines and use the same ammo, but the trigger housing is pot metal and wears out in relativity few (about 200) Magazine changes! THe inner spring is Frankenstein's illegitimate son! I bought that brand new in 1980 for $99+Tax, at the same time US M-1's were $250-300.

My current M-1's are both IBM's. My niece's roommate needed cash when moving and sold it to me for $100 Cash in 1992. My other is a working T-3 Night Scoped version I bought for $600 in 1981, when I was set-up at an OGCA show in Columbus. The T-3 has the hard carry case and field manual, Missing are the 6V battery and the canvas battery bag. I use a 6V motorcycle battery and a gas mask bag! For observation in pitch black it sees 125 yards, for signaling to another scope 400 yards. In modern use I could see raccoons to 200-225 yards in areas that had heavy light pollution.

Weight of the T-3, M-1, and Battery bag with battery is about 35-45 pounds! Very compact and light for 1953! About double a M-16 with a starlight scope in the Vietnam era! Many Green Beret "B" teams had them, but mine bares different marking on the hard case.

T-3 usage:
The Field Manual says to recharge the original battery use a running 6V Jeep OR there was a rack for 4 batteries and use a running Duce & a half (24V). The scope was only to be used on the M-1 Carbine or 2.5" Bazooka. The recoil from other weapons would damage the scope! So a Night scoped equipped "Observer" would sit between two M-2 30 cal machine guns, and using tracer ammo, mark targets for the big boys. NOT MY IDEA OF FUN AGAINST WAVES OF CHINESE SOLDIERS when you can't see them more than 125 yards! Oh, BTW, the scope's distance is very degraded by snow or fog!

Ivan
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Old 05-14-2022, 11:24 AM
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Default Never owned one

But fired them to qualify one year over in West Berlin in the USAF.

Rattily old things but a lot of fun to shoot. I should have bought one when the CMP sold a bunch a few years back. Now that I am a geezer, it would be the perfect light rifle to have - light weight, compact and super cool and super simple to operate, basically like the Garand with the charging thing-a-ma-jig on the right side where it should have been on the M-16!!

I always hated that top of the action M-16 charging handle. Hated it.
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Old 05-14-2022, 11:36 AM
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I love the M1 Carbine and have two of them. The first is a Standard products I bought off of GB some years ago. The second is an Inland that I got from CMP.
I believe its the perfect home defense rifle. Especially in an urban setting. Short, light, quick, easy handling and with more than enough stopping power. I think its a much better choice than the AR most people use.

Here's the Inland along with a few friends.



Unfortunately, the gas cylinder on the Standard Products rifle cracked. I had to replace the barrel with a mid-70s replacement barrel. Since it was no longer original, I figured what the hell and I brought it into the 21st century. Don't laugh and don't cuss, this odd ball is a great shooter and tons of fun.
My version of the black rifle.
BTW: I have the parts and can change it back to original in about half an hour.

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Old 05-14-2022, 11:44 AM
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Default M-1 Carbine Ammo

Since I've owned M-1 Carbines from the early 80's on and shoot them, I must come up with "Food" for their diet. Real surplus ammo has been dried up since the riots in the 60's, The Remington and Winchester commercial ammo of the early to mid 70's was only found in a slightly slower FMJ loading and truly anemic! So my RCBS M-1 Carbine high speed steel dies set marked '79 was bought and I loaded my first 500. The powder invented for M-1 Carbine has never been sold to the public, so WW296/H-110 was invented to fill the need (that it is so good for other rounds like 410 shotgun is just icing on the cake!) H or IMR 4227 will also cycle the action but getting over 1750 fps will be a miracle!

In the late 70's or early 80's, Winchester ammo started loading 110 grain soft hollow point ammo at full velocities. (I never had a M-2, but am told by a friend that did, the commercial SHP ammo was fine for M-2's that didn't already jam like crazy!)

When I started load for the M-1, I used 110 grain FMJ RN Hornady bullets and w-296 powder and Win WSR primers and made ammo as good as or better than commercial FMJ ammo. I later bought a gas checked bullet mold for Lyman 3118 (115 grain RNFP 32-20 bullet with a 2 grain Lyman gas check, sized .309"= 117 grain cast RNFP. It fed and shot like a dream, I used a wheel weight alloy. After over 5000 rounds, I never had any leading of the gas block/piston or barrel.)

If you are going to load 1000's of rounds at a time, go ahead and buy the Carbide sizer. Otherwise just get the standard die set. You need to lube the brass for either sizer! I have both and steel will serve a single stage press user fine! On a progressive, you should have the carbide and use a dry lube like Hornady 1 Shot.

SURPLUS AMMO WARNING: No US made Carbine ammo has ever been loaded with the corrosive Mercury primers! Early ammo did have Chloride base primers (table salt) so normal Nitro solvent will do fine. NOW the scarry part: In the early 90's we started seeing brass that was green from corroded from Mercury priming! It was head stamped "LC 53" and Berdan primed. It came from China and was copied from our ammo. It was in 50 round boxes that looked just like 1953 Lake City boxes, BUT in small print said "Made in China"! You must use solvent for Mercury priming on this ammo, and I have no idea how to get it out of you gas piston/block!

At one point I bought a Ruger Blackhawk in 30 Carbine, It had the 7.5" barrel. Surplus Ammo stuck very badly and even with ear plus or muffs it hurt my ears very badly! the W 296 reloads stuck also. The H-4227 reloads extracted just fine. That is actually a good indicator of how it will do as to velocity in a Carbine! So the rule of thumb is: If it's fun to shoot in a Blackhawk, it's pretty slow in a real M-1 Carbine!

Ivan
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Old 05-17-2022, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Ivan the Butcher View Post

SURPLUS AMMO WARNING: No US made Carbine ammo has ever been loaded with the corrosive Mercury primers! Early ammo did have Chloride base primers (table salt) so normal Nitro solvent will do fine. NOW the scarry part: In the early 90's we started seeing brass that was green from corroded from Mercury priming! It was head stamped "LC 53" and Berdan primed. It came from China and was copied from our ammo. It was in 50 round boxes that looked just like 1953 Lake City boxes, BUT in small print said "Made in China"! You must use solvent for Mercury priming on this ammo, and I have no idea how to get it out of you gas piston/block!

At one point I bought a Ruger Blackhawk in 30 Carbine, It had the 7.5" barrel. Surplus Ammo stuck very badly and even with ear plus or muffs it hurt my ears very badly! the W 296 reloads stuck also. The H-4227 reloads extracted just fine. That is actually a good indicator of how it will do as to velocity in a Carbine! So the rule of thumb is: If it's fun to shoot in a Blackhawk, it's pretty slow in a real M-1 Carbine!

Ivan
I started seeing the Chinese 30 Carbine ammo in the mid to late 80's (shortly after the surplus market took off again thanks changes in the law). Later, working for an ammo vendor at gun shows saw a lot more of it. It came in the typical galvanized cans used by many of the comm bloc nations. Most of it was packed in plain cardboard boxes with a simple rubber stamped description on top (Carbine 30 Cal M1 iirc). We sold a lot of it, I shot quite a bit myself. Older US issue bore cleaner seemed to clean it up okay (I had a lot of it so that was what I used). Never had an issue with corrosion even in the gas piston (my habit of spraying brake clean there may have helped) though I heard of others having problems. The twin flash holes for the Berdan primers were a dead giveaway on the fired cases that they weren't what they appeared to be.

I still run across this stuff at the shows even now, there was an awful lot of it sold here. Though rarely seen now French made 30 Carbine does show up occasionally. It is also Berdan primed and most of it is corrosive (there were some lots that weren't according to some collectors I know) and is very prone to not firing due to age and the type of priming compound used.

The mercury is not the issue with corrosion, it is the chloride salts left after firing Chlorate primers (which were widely used for many years by many countries). You need a water based cleaner to remove Chlorate residue which is what older US military bore cleaners have. Mercury fouling can be removed from the bore by most regular cleaning solvents but tends to attack the brass and it is generally considered unsafe to reload cases that have been used with Mercuric primers as the brass becomes brittle and prone to splitting. Mercuric primers tended to have a shorter life than Chlorate and most countries had abandoned them by the WWII era. ............ As to US Carbine ammo the government decided early on to issue non corrosive 30 Carbine only as better suited to field cleaning methods and not requiring the removal of the gas piston reducing the chances of damage or loss by the troops.

Last edited by desi2358; 05-17-2022 at 03:35 PM.
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Old 05-17-2022, 04:01 PM
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Yes.
Don’t get to shoot it much lately, but maybe that will change sometime this year.
Mine is an Inland (1943 I think) that has a chromed bore. The chrome job has a couple of really bad places where the chrome was applied over some metal chip cuttings. Barrel is military. Gun is almost new condition. Was probably refurbished at a government arsenal.
A very few were apparently made with chromed bores, but the Army stopped the practice because of QC problems, and cutting the short chambers out to full size was trashing the chamber reamers. Will get the barrel replaced sometime. The guy I got it from said he got it from the DCM in the late 60’s or early 70’s.
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Old 05-17-2022, 04:07 PM
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I have one carbine left out of my collection, see Post #5. It is an Inland with a stock inspected by Elmer Keith. My Aunt had given it to me when she found out that I was collecting carbines My Uncle had bought it in the mid 1960's for $20.00.

I took it to the range yesterday with some Lake City ammo. Using a 25 yard pistol target at 50 yards was able to keep most every shot in the 10 ring if I did my part.
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Old 05-17-2022, 04:26 PM
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Yes.
Don’t get to shoot it much lately, but maybe that will change sometime this year.
Mine is an Inland (1943 I think) that has a chromed bore. The chrome job has a couple of really bad places where the chrome was applied over some metal chip cuttings. Barrel is military. Gun is almost new condition. Was probably refurbished at a government arsenal.
A very few were apparently made with chromed bores, but the Army stopped the practice because of QC problems, and cutting the short chambers out to full size was trashing the chamber reamers. Will get the barrel replaced sometime. The guy I got it from said he got it from the DCM in the late 60’s or early 70’s.
Would not change out the barrel. It will kill any value to a collector Sell it to a collector and you will probbably get enough to buy a new reproduction and a ton of ammo JMHO
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Old 05-17-2022, 05:17 PM
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I had no idea they were selling for that now.

Doesn't matter to me personally as I just have enjoyed them and their history.

Someone could of had a heck of a return years ago...IF I am recalling correctly. Only owned one briefly on a trade, back then when I first started collecting I'd often had to trade long-guns and cash for a Smith & Wesson. Different times.
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Old 05-17-2022, 05:32 PM
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Very nice………and the price was right!
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Old 05-17-2022, 06:02 PM
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The myth has always been that the 110 gr bullet at 1600 or so fps at around 100 yards wouldn’t penetrate the ice and snow encrusted padded cotton coats and underlying uniforms of the Chinese troops.

The reality is that under that large padded cotton coat was a skinny Chinese soldier and a lot of empty space around the edges of that soldier for the bullet to pass.

The reality is also that .30 carbine 110 gr FMJ will penetrate 6-7” of plywood.
Many years ago (late 1960s) I worked with a retired USMC Colonel who fought in both the Pacific and Korea. We once talked about the "bulletproof" Chinese quilted coats. His only comment was something like "every one of them I shot with my Carbine fell down".

My first Carbine was a GI bringback, an Inland, about 1959. I bought it for $40, including around 1000 rounds of ammo, probably a dozen 15 round magazines in pouches, a bayonet, and a bag of various spare parts. I still have it. Not an original WWII version, but a postwar rebuild as nearly all found today were. Most of the postwar Carbine rebuilds were done here in San Antonio at the San Antonio Arsenal.

The previous discussions about Mercury in priming compounds are absolutely incorrect. The use of Mercury compounds in American primers stopped about the time of the Spanish-American war. Until about the time of the Korean War, most US military ammunition used chlorate primers - EXCEPT .30 Carbine which has always used only non-corrosive primers. It is correct that at least French, Chinese, and Dominican Republic .30 Carbine military ammunition did use corrosive chlorate primers. Those should NEVER be used in your Carbine. By far, the best bore cleaning solvent for chlorate-based primers is plain old water as it completely dissolves any chloride salts remaining in the barrel. The old WWII US military issue bore cleaning solvent was an emulsion of oil in water.

Last edited by DWalt; 05-17-2022 at 07:07 PM.
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Old 05-17-2022, 08:14 PM
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I have one and only one. Inland receiver and Win. barrel. I replaced the stock. When I bought it the original stock had been sanded and was cracked. I also rebuilt the bolt and replaced the springs. It's now a reliable shooter. I think the barrel was probably a military arsenal replacement as it hardy has seen any use with 1.3 on my muzzle erosion gauge. That's practically a new barrel. The rifle had been re-parkerized and doesn't show any wear to the finish. Has the exact same finish as my CMP 1911. I bought it from a dealer about 7 years ago for $1000. Probably paid too much for it but it's a really good shooter. Some are so well used the barrels need to be replaced.

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Old 05-17-2022, 09:14 PM
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Kahr/Auto Ordnance and Inland Manufacturing are the two newest commercial manufacturers. I've read good things about the Kahr, not so good about the Inland. Don't have personal experience with either.

Fulton Armory offers them as well as rebuilding/restorations. I've read great reviews for them.

There were a number of commercial manufacturers during the 70s - 90s. Iver Johnson, Universal, Plainfield, Howa, and maybe a couple of others.
Kahr makes theirs with way too much drop in the butt stock.
It irritates me when some company makes copies of something like that when there is no shortage of examples to follow.
It is just as easy to make a correct copy as it is to make an incorrect one.
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Old 05-17-2022, 11:36 PM
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You can't go wrong with Audie Murphy's weapon of choice! Saw his gun, a 1.1million range Winchester, at a Birmingham show, back in 2010. Very Cool! I've accumulated these cute little boogers for over 40 years. I currently only own 14 of them at this time, including my first, a Rock-Ola with a 5-43 barrel date. The majority of the others are Inlands (they're my favorite!). One of those even has a registered M2 kit installed for when I'm in the mood! Two of them are M1A1's, one IBM, one Inland to Underwood lineout and one Springfield Armory (commercial receiver) with all GI parts to include original SA marked parts. And to answer the OP's original question, well YEAH!
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