I have two friends who killed attackers with H-S derringers, up close and personal.
It does the job.
It does the job.
High Standard Derringer, 22 Mag
- Thread starter Retired W4
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I see that I am not alone, Old Tanker shows a similar setup.
BUT! PLEASE! Be aware of the little note that I added:
The idjits at the ATF long ago classified this combination as an "AOW" requiring an NFA tax stamp.
Don't ask me why, you know they're always looking to harass us and some years ago when that setup was made popular by Galco or Jackass Leather before it changed its name some genius at the ATF decided that if you couldn't see the gun it had to be submitted to them for the NFA tax stamp.
Here's the 1997 explanation in the ATF's "FFL Newsletter":
https://www.atf.gov/file/56386/download
We literally registered my wallet holster using a handwritten, ink inscribed serial number, entered it into my FFL's bound book, I completed a Form 4473, and we then applied for the $5.00 transfer tax. As I recollect, my FFL kept the wallet until the tax stamp came back, making the transfer back to me a real thing. He simply insisted that I remove the potential felony from my life so I agreed and we got-r-dun! YMMV as always.
BUT! PLEASE! Be aware of the little note that I added:
The idjits at the ATF long ago classified this combination as an "AOW" requiring an NFA tax stamp.
Don't ask me why, you know they're always looking to harass us and some years ago when that setup was made popular by Galco or Jackass Leather before it changed its name some genius at the ATF decided that if you couldn't see the gun it had to be submitted to them for the NFA tax stamp.
Here's the 1997 explanation in the ATF's "FFL Newsletter":
https://www.atf.gov/file/56386/download
We literally registered my wallet holster using a handwritten, ink inscribed serial number, entered it into my FFL's bound book, I completed a Form 4473, and we then applied for the $5.00 transfer tax. As I recollect, my FFL kept the wallet until the tax stamp came back, making the transfer back to me a real thing. He simply insisted that I remove the potential felony from my life so I agreed and we got-r-dun! YMMV as always.
old tanker
Member
Like so many other conflicting ATF letters and rulings. Something is legal until they change their mind.
We had one long ago...... Took 2 fingers to pull trigger.........Loud as a stick of dynamite in your face........You could hit a 55 drum if you held it inside before you pulled the trigger.
The Kid
Member
I have one in 22LR. Like an above poster, I carry it at times when a bigger gun is not possible as I consider it better than no gun. The trigger on mine really isn’t bad, I’ve handled DA revolvers with heavier trigger pulls.
It isn’t for every situation but it’s another arrow in the CCW quiver.
It isn’t for every situation but it’s another arrow in the CCW quiver.
From the perspective of literally shooting one of these things I can say from experience thank you, but no.
That includes any derringer, actually, but there are exceptions to my rule of no.
Everyone likes pictures:
This cute little antique ain't ever getting fired (a gift from a friend, literally, from his dad's estate):
Remington .41 centerfire derringer Illion NY
I LOVE that one!!! When I picture a derringer in my mind, that is what I see.
Larry
ezb57
Member
It has to be registered as an AOW- Any other Weapon $5.00 tax stamp. Talk to a Class 3 dealer. Be Safe,
ezb57
Member
If Im reading the letter linked above correctly, the $5.00 fee is for a transfer, but you have to start with a $300 application to construct.
forindooruseonly
Member
Correct, but the Form 1 fee to construct an AOW is $200, not $300. Still, the point is that transfers are much, much cheaper than building an AOW.
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I had one in the late 70's. The barrels were not bored parallel. As you could imagine it was not exactly a target pistol but I found if I laid my index finger along the side of the barrel and pulled the trigger with my middle finger I could point my index finger at what I wanted to hit. It put the gun lower in your hand and seemed natural.
Tex1001
Member
Am I reading these posts correctly? Dropping a pistol into what
amounts to a pocket flap holster suddenly shifts to AOW?
If I carry a 1911 in a concealing flap holster under a coat is that AOW? Seems to be the same thing to me.
I truly understand jumping through the AFT hoops because of
their ruling, but this is a very slippery slope.
Sorry. Conspiracy rant off.
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The Kid
Member
I believe the main sticking point insofar as the ATF rule is concerned is that the wallet holster is designed with the intent that the gun be fired without removing it from the holster. If the holster didn’t have the trigger hole it would be a non issue, of course it would also not be useful either.
I really don’t understand the thought on the rule, and I don’t agree with it. But that’s what I was lead to believe when I inquired about the issue with an ATF agent.
I really don’t understand the thought on the rule, and I don’t agree with it. But that’s what I was lead to believe when I inquired about the issue with an ATF agent.
RobertJ.
Member
I had one just like that back in the mid-80's. My most vivid memory is how painful it was if you forgot hearing protection. I paid $50, shot a box of ammo, then sold it for the same. I didn't miss it at all.
IIRC, at one time, the HS .22 Magnum derringer was issued to South Carolina state troopers as a back-up gun.
Tex1001
Member
I definitely don't understand the logic either.
Say I drop one of my derringers into my jacket pocket and
get hijacked, shoot the perp with my derringer from inside my
pocket through my jacket.
Et voila. Instant AOW. My goose is federally cooked.
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old tanker
Member
Anyone who expects the ATF to be consistent or logical in their rulings is likely to have to answer question 21g affirmatively.
Old Corp
Member
Like many LEO's of bygone days, I carried a HS .22 WMR in a back pocket wallet holster. BUG's were 'verboten' for our agency. The Chief was a retired NYPD dinosaur and subscribed to the 'possible throw-down gun' BS.
So - anything you carried had to be well-hidden.
A fellow officer saved his own life with a HS .22 WMR after losing his service revolver in a huge tussle with a bulked-up ex-con.
Once the HS's muzzle was shoved up his nose and the trigger pulled to it's halfway point, the suspect ceased his intentions.
So - anything you carried had to be well-hidden.
A fellow officer saved his own life with a HS .22 WMR after losing his service revolver in a huge tussle with a bulked-up ex-con.
Once the HS's muzzle was shoved up his nose and the trigger pulled to it's halfway point, the suspect ceased his intentions.
When you qualify with your “deep cover gun” come back and show us your target and score! I tried to qualify one of my guys with an AMT 380 and he could never get close to a passing score but he did get a trip to the ER when the slide sliced the top of his shooting hand so bad that he needed stitches.
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