Am I missing missing the mexican boat here? DEPUTY SHOT in Desert

[WR Moore]

I haven't read all the posts here, so excuse me if I'm plowing ground already tilled, but:

One ommision I noted in all the televised hysteria about the AZ law, and in a few posts here, is that the law requires "reasonable suspicion" that the subject is an illegal alien. That phrase has specific meaning. So, arbitrary demands for 'papieren!' would be illegal under the law. Doesn't mean it may not happen, but it does indicate that the intent of the law is that there must be grounds for the request for proof of citizenship.

Now, I do agree the Feds are complicit in continuing a situation that shouldn't exist. We need to reinstitute the bracero program that existed for decades. There shouldn't be ammnesty for those already here illegally.

Despite the beliefs of some, there is no constitutional right for everyone in the world to be a US Citizen.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

...and the beat goes on. Our ex-presidential candidate says he now has a plan, now that he is running for re-election, that he says will work. Question: Where ya been all this time, Juan?

LOL!

Last night Gretta Van Susteren put together a series of vids of past presidents and wannabees lecturing on the importance of a secure border.

 

[armadillo]

We need to reinstitute the bracero program that existed for decades. There shouldn't be ammnesty for those already here illegally.

Despite the beliefs of some, there is no constitutional right for everyone in the world to be a US Citizen.

I agree - but not for anyone who is already here illegally.

I believe the "Bracero Program" only lasted about 10 years and ended when Eisenhower was President. I know because my father would pick up 4 truck loads of braceros at Eagle Pass, TX and take them to Arkansas and Missouri each fall to pick cotton. He quit that business about 1957 or 1958 because the program was coming to an end.

Note: I just checked Wikipedia and it actually ended in 1964 and was started during WWII.

 

[WR Moore]

One of the DC channels had a news segment last night. It seems that Prince William County, Virginia passed a law similar to what Arizona did several years ago. They cope with the profiling issue by checking citizenship on all persons arrested.

Result: they've lost 23,000 illegal residents and violent crime dropped around 40%.

And yes, there's a few protesters. Methinks the protestors should see how Mexico deals with illegals.

 

[sgt.207]

I think they all came here to New York.


Result: they've lost 23,000 illegal residents and violent crime dropped around 40%.

 

[Dan M]

AZ Sheriff Deputy is shot

As of this moment they are reporting a Pinal County Sheriff Deputy has been shot by an Illegal Alien Coyote in the desert outside of Casa Grande AZ. Please lets pray for the Deputy and his Family.
Its been a week since Gov. Brewer signed the law. In my opinion one of the bravest things I have seen a politician do in many years. I want to thank her for that bravery and courage. But I am flat sick of this topic being Bantered by both sides of the aisle of the Political arena.
We here in AZ see the results of the Illegal's on a daily basis. It is sickening that my friends who live out in the distant mountains have to worry daily about what/who is coming out of the desert. They have told me stories of Mid Summer 108+ degree heat having people stumble to their door asking for shade food and water. After getting them hydrated they always call the Border Patrol and are told that unless there are more than 10 people in the group they didn't have time to deal with them. It is time the Federal Government does their job of securing the Border. Please I am not Bashing the BP they have their Hands full.

 

[bettis1]

Dan,

Sad to hear about the Pinal Co. Deputy. Hope he is OK.

I, too, am disappointed in the negative responses to the AZ law that I am hearing on the news. I strongly support the action of the Gov. and the Legislature.

In response to the attempted boycott of the State, I am very proud that the Smith & Wesson Collector's Assoc. has their annual meeting planed in Tucson this year. I plan on attending and leaving as much of my cash in the state as I can afford to do.

I was disappointed to hear today that Texas Gov. Rick Perry has spoken against the AZ law. I think that is very premature of him for when our Legislature reconvenes in 2011 several lawmakers are planning on introducing similar legislation. I know that will cost Perry some votes and, although I have supported him in the past, I will now wait to see what his opponent's position is on this issue.

Bob

 

[7003006]

Half of me says "Yea Baby" but the other half is scared to death of the "Papers Please" mentality. I see this as a dangerous slope, notwithstanding the problem and the good intentions behind the law. But until we do something to stop the flow-like fining and putting in jail the people who hire the illegals, the problem is going to persist..
I much prefer the armed border approach.

Have you ever been pulled over or had any other interaction with a cop that you did not yourself initate and not been asked for your drivers licence?

 

[n4zov]

As a retired INS agent all I have to say is that ALL of the Administrations and Congresses since 1965 (if not earlier) have been criminally complicit in ignoring their responsibilities. None of them ever wanted real enforcement, ever. Democrats get all warm and fuzzy about the downtrodden and Republicans see cheap, docile labor. Nobody gave a damn about the country, justice, or the common good, and nobody was ever willing to have an honest debate. What was once a manageable law enforcement problem has now been kicked down the road to a complete sordid cluster. It makes the "gun control" debate look positively adult.

Of all the players in this the only one I have any respect for is the illegal alien fleeing his own kleptocratic government. If I were in his shoes with his prospects, I would go north too. In comparison I have nothing but contempt for our lying so-called leaders. The whole thing makes me sick to my stomach. Maybe we were arresting the wrong people all along...

The real problem was always on the Potomac, not the Rio Grande.

Truer words have never been posted on this forum! We are being betrayed by the very people elected to defend this Country. The "Washington Players" have no intention of solving our immigration problems and they will not allow anybody else to solve them either.

 

[scoutsdad]

Originally Posted by CAJUNLAWYER View Post
Half of me says "Yea Baby" but the other half is scared to death of the "Papers Please" mentality. I see this as a dangerous slope, notwithstanding the problem and the good intentions behind the law. But until we do something to stop the flow-like fining and putting in jail the people who hire the illegals, the problem is going to persist..
I much prefer the armed border approach.

Yea, hows that working for us?

 

[The Last Standing Knight]

Half of me says "Yea Baby" but the other half is scared to death of the "Papers Please" mentality. I see this as a dangerous slope, notwithstanding the problem and the good intentions behind the law. But until we do something to stop the flow-like fining and putting in jail the people who hire the illegals, the problem is going to persist..
I much prefer the armed border approach.

I worked at a plant years ago where the contract work was done by illegal aliens. The guy who hired them stated that if he ever got fined for it, well, that was the cost of doing business. He was not going to change because illegals worked cheaper and took more crap than American workers would.

I suspect that down the road, this thread will be locked. But the fact is, this country has been heading down this road for a long, long time and I feel it is too late to stop it to any reasonable degree that will not involve the forfieture of some individual rights and priveleges.

We, as a nation, let it get this way and this far in the first place.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

Ya'll should read this story to see how crazy all this really is.

Here we have fed immigration agents, employer and recruiters sticking it to foreign workers who want to be legal.... followed by DOJ and HS investigations... and of course a lawsuit.

Suit Points to H-2B Temporary Guest Worker Program Flaws - NYTimes.com

 

[jkc]

"Sad to hear about the Pinal Co. Deputy. Hope he is OK."

The deputy is reportedly just fine, having suffered only a minor "flesh wound". Latest reports suggest some of a large group of drug smugglers in custody, most still the subject of a massive manhunt. If the usually geographically challenged reporters might be believed (?), they are reporting the incident occuring variously near the intersection of I-8 and AZ 84, and also, five miles south of I-8. This would place it near Antelope Peak Wilderness Area, and the Vekol Valley, a significant smuggling corridor, where visitors are warned by signage of the risk of encountering dangerous smugglers, and scanty law-enforcement presence and no cell phone service --- essentially --- no man's land, uncontrolled by US authorities, enter at your probable peril. Only idiots venture into the remote Vekol Valley unprepared for a forceful self defense ... This is another example of the disgraceful failure of the Feds to seal the border.

 

[Peter J.]

Lets use the name they should really be called: Illegal Alien Invaders.

 

[HOUSTON RICK]

Our politicians, all of them, are the bought and paid for property of corporations. Corporations like cheap labor and more customers. No one in charge of the issue in Washington D.C. cares about security or jobs of mere citizens.

 

[larbike]

There is a real potential for abuses under these new laws. As a law-abiding US citizen, I don't feel that I should be stopped/questioned/ harrassed because my skin is brown or because I happen to have a Spanish surname. I already get delayed on NCIBC eveytime I purchase a new firearm. This law doesn't do anything to combat the root problem. It is simply "feel good" legislation.

 

[Joe Kent]

If the law does nothing other than force the politicians in Washington to get off their collective partisian butts and do what their oath requires them to do it will be worth it.

 

[JcMack]

My thought is there's a sort of reverse profiling going on. As in: If your a white citizen of the USA of course it's your responsibility to care for anyone who reaches the country no matter what the circumstance or cost. That PC crap is liken to "white man's burden".

 

[The Last Standing Knight]

Our politicians, all of them, are the bought and paid for property of corporations. Corporations like cheap labor and more customers. No one in charge of the issue in Washington D.C. cares about security or jobs of mere citizens.

+1........

 

[Evil One]

There is a real potential for abuses under these new laws. As a law-abiding US citizen, I don't feel that I should be stopped/questioned/ harrassed because my skin is brown or because I happen to have a Spanish surname. I already get delayed on NCIBC eveytime I purchase a new firearm. This law doesn't do anything to combat the root problem. It is simply "feel good" legislation.

It is written to keep it from being abused.
Also... after you plug a leak in a boat, you shouldnt bail the water overboard?


Jim