2nd bodyguard 380 broken firing pin DONT DRYFIRE

[GeorgiaShooter]

My bodyguard was working so well I bought another for my son EAV####. Within an hour of owning, oiling and tuning it up and dry firing to loosen the trigger the firing pin snapped. Dealer sent it back to Smith a month ago and it might be lost in shipment (send them back yourself). The dealer and S&W CS told me this was a fluke issue (roll eyes). And I should be able to dry fire away.

Well fast forward.... my main #1 BG380 EATxxxx which I absolutely love now, broke the firing pin too a few days ago when firing only a few times. Broke exact same place right where the rear meets the first cutout. I've fired about 1000+ rounds maybe more. Originally broke the trigger in with about 400-500 dry fires with no issues. Laser buttons working great after fix. Tuned it up and polished the ejector and this thing runs like a sewing machine, or it did. Obviously I'll be using snap caps in the future.

I saw a comment on the web these pins are MIM manufactured. I guess meaning they are metal injected molding? Or a powder injected into a mold to make a metal part.

Honestly this sounds like pot metal, pig iron or something. Can anyone comment? I'm now worried S&W is using a less than wonderful type of firing pin. I see a lot of broken firing pin results on google too.

 

[Snoguy]

My bodyguard was working so well I bought another for my son EAV####. Within an hour of owning, oiling and tuning it up and dry firing to loosen the trigger the firing pin snapped. Dealer sent it back to Smith a month ago and it might be lost in shipment (send them back yourself). The dealer and S&W CS told me this was a fluke issue (roll eyes). And I should be able to dry fire away.

Well fast forward.... my main #1 BG380 EATxxxx which I absolutely love now, broke the firing pin too a few days ago when firing only a few times. Broke exact same place right where the rear meets the first cutout. I've fired about 1000+ rounds maybe more. Originally broke the trigger in with about 400-500 dry fires with no issues. Laser buttons working great after fix. Tuned it up and polished the ejector and this thing runs like a sewing machine, or it did. Obviously I'll be using snap caps in the future.

I saw a comment on the web these pins are MIM manufactured. I guess meaning they are metal injected molding? Or a powder injected into a mold to make a metal part.

Honestly this sounds like pot metal, pig iron or something. Can anyone comment? I'm now worried S&W is using a less than wonderful type of firing pin. I see a lot of broken firing pin results on google too.

Dry firing with snap caps did not prevent my firing pin (S/N EAHxxxx) from breaking after about 300 dry fires. It's been fine since S&W replaced the firing pin, with about 300 live fires since on the new firing pin. I dry fire very little now.

Judging from the broad span of broken firing pins across a wide range od S/Ns, it's my opinion that the 380 firing pin has a design problem, which results in a stress point where all these things seem to be breaking.

The metal injection molding process is a widely used and accepted manufacturing process when done correctly, so I'm not so sure it is the source of these problems. However, problems with the MIM process could make a design problem worse. From what I've heard S&W tells everyone with a broken firing pin that their problem is an isolated case. I would recommend against much dry firing, even with snap caps.

Dave

 

[GeorgiaShooter]

Dave thanks, very interesting and good feedback. I'd better follow that same path until more information is available.

 

[GeorgiaShooter]

This might be useful to some. I see what is most likely causing the firing pin to break. While I can't diagnose it to the level of a professional I still see the general problem and I illustrate that in this short video. Any knowledgeable feedback out there much appreciated but I also asked S&W to respond to me, they have not done so yet. I'm still waiting on my replacement firing pin (sigh).

S&W Bodyguard 380 Broken Firing Pin - YouTube

 

[GeorgiaShooter]

Update: S&W customer support tells me they've never seen this problem before ever. And no known issue here. And that I should not listen to web forum users that find a problem once and repeatedly exaggerate it. I think if this is an issue it's either not even on their radar, they are not recording all the cases or communicating that within S&W or playing public relations tactics. I have no clue but this happened on two Bodyguards and I did nothing wrong to cause it. So I'm going to install the new pin when comes in and then watch the gun closely and not dry fire. He again said there is no official problem dry firing but I think it actually brings this issue out faster than live fire but I'm already having people email or contact me that have broken a FP even with live fire on new BGs. So even if this issue is isolated, it still appears to be a valid issue to me. We'll see if they suddenly have some design change appear in future models. If I have more news to add I'll update again.

If you have issues like this make sure you are contacting S&W customer support so they are getting the information directly.

The new BG EAVxxxx that broke the FP was lost in UPS from the dealer to S&W so I'm getting another new one. And I'll fix the one I carry EATxxxx.

 

[Dragon88]

S&W usually does not admit problems over though phone. Even when we had daily posts of 15-22s firing OOB a year or two ago, Customer Service claimed they had never heard of this issue before when people called. There was never a recall or admitted problem.

If they ever do decide to improve the firing pin, they will likely do it without telling anyone and the new pin will just appear in new guns. I don't think this problem is big enough right now for them to care.

 

[Physboy]

The top spring loaded part that is housed in the slide, just below the rear sight, is the firing pin stopper. (Safety feature to keep the firing pin from striking the primer when trigger is not actuated.) The trigger bar is supposed to raise that part to a full clearance point so that the blocker is never interacting w/ the firing pin during normal use.

More likely what's happening is that trigger bar component designed to disengage the stopper is wearing down (or otherwise being displaced), causing the firing pin to hit a little bit of the blocker during normal firing actuations, as a result of the stopper not being fully cleared. This would, of course lead to undue stress being applied to the firing pin, in that break point area, too often and ultimately leading to the break.

P.S. I also posted this info on your video listed above.

You can check for proper blocker clearance by taking the hammer out, putting pistol back together & manually pushing the firing pin forward while holding trigger back. The pin should move forward w/o any resistance, if you feel resistance, then the blocker is not being cleared properly.

 

[GeorgiaShooter]

Okay these last two posts nailed it. Dragon I think you are spot on with these comments and after a number of issues with the BG this seems to be the norm, and they also refrain from answering lots of other liable questions about supported ammo and so on. I'm cool with this now. Just very happy they have the level of CS they do. It's in my opinion what sets them apart. Since there are many great brands out there this is one reason to choose S&W.

Physboy,

You really nailed it. I was looking at the wrong place but now I see precisely which part on the same pin that holds the hammer that rotates and lifts this cam causing the FP safety to rise and allow the hammer to force the firing pin fully forward as far as allowed to travel by the other side pin coming in under the ejector spring. I can see by the wear on the broken firing pin and the bottom of the safety bar this is the cause. Since this also happened on another brand new BG I'm pretty sure it's just general quality control and tolerances.

When I get this new firing pin I'll go through these procedures and make sure it clears and if I can't correct or make it work perfectly I'll just send it in or get another firing pin safety part on order. After looking at all the parts closely with calipers and magnifier, I believe I can make it work perfectly with some TLC.

I really appreciate your help. I do love the little BUG.

 

[patbelly]

GeorgiaShooter,
My BG380 S/N: EAJxxx bought in February?? Firing pin broke in the exact spot as in your video. Probably about 2-3 months ago. Sent the gun back and they fixed it. No explanation in the return box. Now I know. I didn't dry fire mine that much and probably had about 450-500 rounds through her. All is good now, but won't be dry firing it except to check for function after cleaning.

 

[Physboy]

Physboy,

You really nailed it. I was looking at the wrong place but now I see precisely which part on the same pin that holds the hammer that rotates and lifts this cam causing the FP safety to rise and allow the hammer to force the firing pin fully forward as far as allowed to travel by the other side pin coming in under the ejector spring. I can see by the wear on the broken firing pin and the bottom of the safety bar this is the cause. Since this also happened on another brand new BG I'm pretty sure it's just general quality control and tolerances.

When I get this new firing pin I'll go through these procedures and make sure it clears and if I can't correct or make it work perfectly I'll just send it in or get another firing pin safety part on order. After looking at all the parts closely with calipers and magnifier, I believe I can make it work perfectly with some TLC.

I really appreciate your help. I do love the little BUG.

Glad I was able to help brother! That's what were all here for! Good luck w/ new firing pin & keep us posted on progress!

 

[SWAT I]

Smith & Wesson Quality Customer Service

I am an LEO and range instructor for my department. I purchased a BG 380 this week. Lubricated, dry fired, and broke the firing pin within two days. I believe the individual who made the thoughtful YouTube on this is correct. There is a design flaw.

In general, I am not a fan of the 380, but have some specific applications for this pistol. We see a lot of functional problems with these pistols, and the balistics are marginal at best.

I am a fan of S&W and many of their products. In my expereince, they are ethical and thoughtful in dealing with problems. And they certainly listen to their customers. I communicated with customer service, and notified the chief armorer and my regional sales manager, both of whom are highly qualified and steller individuals.

Customer service is aware of this issue and it is being addressed. I am confident that the issue will be resolved.

 

[greybeard43]

I have been a vocal proponent for the BG380 for quite some time. This is alarming to me. S&W should find a fix for this and get it out to the owners. For a concealed carry weapon, utmost reliability is paramount. The way I read this post, the firing pin could break at any time. I guess I'll be carrying my P11 for a while.

 

[SWAT I]

Georgiashooter:
I just viewed your YouTube #2, on the evaluation of root cause and repair for the fring pin design problem. It was very insightful.

Do you feel that the firing pin and firing pin block should be redesigned? Should they be manufactured with forged metal?

I would also be interested in hearing if your BG will stand up to extensive dry firing after your fix.

Thanks for your scholarly contributions on this!

 

[Snoguy]

Georgiashooter:
I just viewed your YouTube #2, on the evaluation of root cause and repair for the fring pin design problem. It was very insightful.

Do you feel that the firing pin and firing pin block should be redesigned? Should they be manufactured with forged metal?

I would also be interested in hearing if your BG will stand up to extensive dry firing after your fix.

Thanks for your scholarly contributions on this!

Based on GeorgiaShooter's latest YouTube video, he no longer has his 380. He apparently had a 3rd firing pin problem with his 380, and then traded it back to the dealer and bought a SIG P238.
Sig Sauer P238 Equinox DEC 2011 Review, Range Test, Field Strip - YouTube

Dave

 

[edenney]

Glad I found this thread. I was in the market for a BG 380, but it sounds like I would do well to wait until confirmation that this issue has been corrected. With such a serious problem that could result in a major lack of sales (and a lot of returns), I suspect they'll correct this asap now that they've apparently acknowledged that the problem exists, and know what's causing it.

 

[lyodbraun]

I was thinking of getting one of the .380's for my wife, but after reading all the problems with this model I will not being buying one at all, I have the other Bodyguard the .38 special, and really love it and have had no problems with it.....

 

[vfontjr]

My wife bought me a BG380 for Christmas. I was nervous about it after reading about these firing pin issues, especially since I dry fired it a few dozen times. I took it to the range tonight and put 150+ rounds through it. It performed flawlessly. The laser was a little low, but after a slight adjustment, I was getting a very tight grouping. It's a little snappier than my M&P 9s and the trigger is going to take some getting used to, but as a backup carry piece, I think it will be fine.

 

[edenney]

BG 380 SN question

Does anybody know roughly what the newest SN's are that have been produced for this gun to date? Obviously there have been a lot of problems with this gun, most of them resolved early on except obviously for the firing pin related issue, and I really want to make sure that I buy one of the newest possible SN's if I buy one.

From what I understand and have read, the SNs started with EAAxxxx, and proceeded to EABxxxx, EACxxxx, and so on. This makes sense, but I've seen EAXxxxx SNs posted, and if each letter represents 9,999 produced, that's almost 250,000 manufactured in the last couple years. That seems ridiculously high to me for this model and over that period of time, so I presume this logic isn't entirely correct. Does the 3rd letter change every time there's a revision or something? If that were the case it would mean there have been almost 25 revisions since productions started, which also sounds high. If someone could clarify, and perhaps clue me in on the highest known SNs produced that would be great. I've tried to find this information elsewhere including on S&W's site to no avail.

TIA!
Eric

 

[ekrauos]

Mine is an EAKxxxx . I have 200 live rounds and maybe about 400 dry fire pulls with snap caps. Firing pin broke in the exact same spot as in the video (which is now removed). I called S&W, they denied of ever hearing the problem. They are of course paying for shipping and replacing the pin. But I want to know if the pin has been re-designed, or made of a different metal, so it will not fail again. I will not carry this again until I have over 2000 dry fires and 1000 live rounds and no failures.

 

[Fastbolt]

When I called someone I know at the company, he told me he thought he'd heard the firing pin had recently been revised to incorporate a radius at a spot that was previously a sharp corner (where some firing pins are reported to have been broken).

I replaced a broken firing pin for another instructor. It had broken off at the front corner of the firing pin safety shelf.

The gun fired a box of rounds in the intended manner after the repair.

I strongly suggested the owner of that Bodyguard, and another of our folks who just bought one, to just shoot the guns and not sit around and engage in excessive dry-fire 'practice' with these little guns.

There's no way in the world I'd ever consider doing 2000 dry-fire cycles through this (or any other ) diminutive pocket pistol.

Does it really take experienced and skilled shooters more than 1-2 magazine loads of rounds being fired to figure out the long & heavy trigger stroke of this sort of gun and adapt to it? Once that's figured out, go to the range and shoot the gun as much as you can afford to shoot it, if you wish.

BTW, the only other couple of our guys who have bought and used their Bodyguards for quals (so far) have not had any problems with them.