Some outside the box defensive rifle options

[brucev]

Hmmmm Ruger 1022. can put a lot of lead on a target in a short time and won't kill all the neighbors if you miss.

This is the thought I had. I've lived in apartments where very little separated my wife and I from the neighbors next door except the walls between the units. During our first two years of marriage, we had to deal with two incidents of people trying to break in through the bedroom window. Later someone tried to get in through the kitchen window. At the ranges involved, i.e., less than 12 feet, a 10-22 loaded with any decent .22 LR HP round would have been outstanding as it would have been very easily employed, controlled and aimed. At that time I had no such rifle, so I used a 12 ga. 870 and in the last incident a S&W 59.

Nowadays I am more thoughtful on these matters. I have a RIA 1911 on the nightstand stuffed full of 230 gr. hardball. If needed... I have a little something standing by... a 15-22 with a couple of 32 rd. ProMag magazines stuffed full of CCI Mini Mags. Why? Simple. My wife is not a highly experienced shooter. She is however capable of using a rifle. In her hands, that little recreational rifle will be very effective in serving her for HD/SD. If and when she ever picked that thing up and went to aiming and firing, it'd take a real double dipped solid brass idiot to do anything except do his very best to either give up immediately or get out just as fast as he feet would carry him. Ideal? No. Nothing is. But, imminently useful and effective. Absolutely.

 

[Dominus_Lex]

Just to add another option to the mix Winchester Md. 92 in 38-40. Not a great long range rifle but the idea of shooting off a rifle round anywhere there might someone I care about on the other side of the drywall always gives me pause. 180gr cowboy ammo is out there, and it's hard to say a guy was looking for trouble when he meets a bad guy with an old Winchester.

 

[Arik]

Wouldnt anything made prior to the 60s (with a few exceptions) be an "outside the box" defensive rifle? I mean the most common are the ARs and AKs and their respective variations. With legacy rifles not far behind.

Theres a million choices.
-MAS49/56. Semi auto, 7.5 french (308 bullets and load data). 10 round detachable box mag. Short and handy rifle

-Swiss 7.5x55 straight pull bolt

- Swiss Lujman (sp?) 7.5 semi auto (FN49)

- Egyptian FN49. Semi auto. 8mm mauser, 30-06, 7mm

-Russian SVT. Semi auto 7.62x54 (still cheap ammo)

-M44 or M38 bolt action. Carbine. 7.62x54. Made by Russia, Romania, Poland, Hungaria, China, Czech

-Vz 58. AK inspired Czech semi auto rifle.

I can go on and on and on

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[jimmyj]

Hi:
In my part of the world, no matter what the rifle, ammo is SCARCE !!
However shotgun ammo can be found at reasonable prices.
My solution: Remington Model 870 12 gauge with rifle sights. Ammo-rifled slugs, Buckshot, and small shot. Patterned with slugs at 100 yards. 25 yards and under-Buckshot (#4 Buck first choice). 25 yards to 100 yards-Rifled Slugs.

 

[jaykellogg]

This is a Zombie thread. It was started when AR-15's were hard/impossible to get. That is no longer the case. Ammo is still expensive but is slowly coming down. For HD, a 12 gauge is probably the best choice. I have heard many stories where the sound of racking a pump shotgun will make a bad guy think of another line of work. I keep mine fully loaded with the safety on.

However, during the LA riots, Korean shopkeepers kept looting mobs at bay with AR-15s. I would not want to face a large mob with a 12 gauge pump, I would want a semi auto with a 30 round mag and several more (mags) hanging from my belt. There are other modern sporting rifles that could be used.

If you're defending a shop full of television sets, I doubt looters would want to risk a bullet. If people needed food the situation might be different.

 

[Jessie]

I'm prepared to outfit a defensive squad with M1 carbines if I need to.

Ohhh, THAT'S where they all went!

 

[Malpasowildlifer]

How about a Winchester model 71

 

[Jessie]

You know, I heard that if you golf, beware of the person with only 1 or 2 clubs. They probably use them very well! They may not be the perfect club for the shot, but the ball will usually go where they aim.

 

[BillBingham2]

Don't forget 20 gauge as a very viable alternative with less recoil than a 12. There are some great old 20 gauge pumps and bolt actions out there that can be had for under $200. Perhaps shorten the barrel a bit and perhaps replace the stock with a hand grip to help it swing better.

A lot depends on where you live. In an apartment/townhouse a 10/22 or a SR22 with a flashlight attached would be great. 2 BX-25s taped together or a small shoulder bag with five magazines for the SR. Out in rural America a 20 gauge pump shot gun backed up with a hand gun. Again a small bag of ammo and make sure the flash light you have has at least 250 lumen of power (read BRIGHT). I'm not a believer in the idea of a powerful rifle cartridge for home defense options, that is more of a 5HTF requirement. Short range, multiple threats, easy for anyone in the house to handle.

YMMV as no two threats or people are alike.

B2

 

[BillBingham2]

Ohhh, THAT'S where they all went!

+1, my thoughts exactly.

 

[Arik]

You know, I heard that if you golf, beware of the person with only 1 or 2 clubs. They probably use them very well! They may not be the perfect club for the shot, but the ball will usually go where they aim.

So true. "Beware of the man with only one gun"

My dad has one gun. I think it last saw the light of day before 9/11/01.

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[jimmyj]

This is a Zombie thread. It was started when AR-15's were hard/impossible to get. That is no longer the case. Ammo is still expensive but is slowly coming down. For HD, a 12 gauge is probably the best choice. I have heard many stories where the sound of racking a pump shotgun will make a bad guy think of another line of work. I keep mine fully loaded with the safety on.

However, during the LA riots, Korean shopkeepers kept looting mobs at bay with AR-15s. I would not want to face a large mob with a 12 gauge pump, I would want a semi auto with a 30 round mag and several more (mags) hanging from my belt. There are other modern sporting rifles that could be used.

If you're defending a shop full of television sets, I doubt looters would want to risk a bullet. If people needed food the situation might be different.

I totally agree with fully loaded with safety on. Why let the BG know your position and intent ?

 

[jimmyj]

This is a Zombie thread. It was started when AR-15's were hard/impossible to get. That is no longer the case. Ammo is still expensive but is slowly coming down. For HD, a 12 gauge is probably the best choice. I have heard many stories where the sound of racking a pump shotgun will make a bad guy think of another line of work. I keep mine fully loaded with the safety on.

However, during the LA riots, Korean shopkeepers kept looting mobs at bay with AR-15s. I would not want to face a large mob with a 12 gauge pump, I would want a semi auto with a 30 round mag and several more (mags) hanging from my belt. There are other modern sporting rifles that could be used.

If you're defending a shop full of television sets, I doubt looters would want to risk a bullet. If people needed food the situation might be different.

After the first one or two "Looters" heads blow apart--the remaining looters won't be real eager for a TV set or Ham

 

[kraigwy]

Got to love the Krag's, if targets are close, you can save ammo.

I shot this Krag in a 3 gun match.

 

[bummer]

Got to love the Krag's, if targets are close, you can save ammo.

I shot this Krag in a 3 gun match.

The spirit of the bayonet is to kill!

 

[jaykellogg]

The bayonet made sense when the military used muzzleloaders. Perhaps there was still a place for it in WWII although there were no bayonet charges that I am aware of. In muzzleloading days the bayonets were often 14-18 inches or longer. It takes stones to hold your ground when they enemy line gets close. I believe there is a bronze statue in New England showing a Revolutionary war soldier loading a Pennsylvania rifle in the face of a bayonet charge. You can see the terror in his face. I wonder why they even have bayonets on M16s.

 

[kraigwy]

I wonder why they even have bayonets on M16s

I found I could dig a hole pretty darn quick with a M7 bayonet for my M16a1 in SE Asia. Good for probing too.

I keep my M9 (M16A2) bayonet in my ATV, handy for fence repair.

Yes we still need bayonets. We use them all the time for memorial services. Something to hang the helmet on.

 

[amazingflapjack]

A camp 9 with a red dot and a Winchester 94 ae in 357 with a forward mounted red dot for scout style, and a couple mod 59 S&W's that use the same mag as the camp 9. Good defensive level calibers-for me, anything above the 30-30 level is too much as a defensive gun which might have to be employed by a woman or a kid. Flapjack.

 

[hangnoose]

END OF DAYS?

Once the ammo runs out you would be happy to have a bayonet/ spear/ club/ whatever you could scavenge. a good slingshot and sack of marbles or ball bearings would be nice and quiet. Some rat traps, a sling shot, simple fishing hooks/line, a gigging pronged/spear head, for food gathering on the DL, must haves for a go or nch (never coming home) bag.

 

[jimmyj]

The bayonet made sense when the military used muzzleloaders. Perhaps there was still a place for it in WWII although there were no bayonet charges that I am aware of. In muzzleloading days the bayonets were often 14-18 inches or longer. It takes stones to hold your ground when they enemy line gets close. I believe there is a bronze statue in New England showing a Revolutionary war soldier loading a Pennsylvania rifle in the face of a bayonet charge. You can see the terror in his face. I wonder why they even have bayonets on M16s.

Korean War-Bayonet charge by American Troops to clear commie machine gun positions on a hill.