My handgun is obsolete? Why is that?

[18DAI]

I noticed while looking at some parts list that my two most carried handguns, the 4516 and 4513TSW are listed, by their manufacturer as "obsolete".

So, what makes my carry guns obsolete? Is it their smooth DA trigger pulls? Their crisp single action trigger pull?

Maybe it is their reliability. Flawless function round after round with no breakage or need for return shipping to the manufacturer. Perhaps it is their pleasing asthetics. They stand out in a sea of ugly polymer guns.

Probably it is their all metal framed construction and use of a hammer to drive a firing pin. Ancient methods and materials........

Then.....in contrast, what makes a 100 year old handgun design "current technology" and the "choice of professionals" (even though no manufacturer can seem to get one with a sub 4 inch barrel to run reliably......and one or two makers have trouble making a 5 inch that isn't a single shot gun ) yet a different design from 1989, just 25 years ago, is considered obsolete? Why is that? Regards 18DAI

 

[epj]

Points well made. I must point out, however, that sub 4" barrels, bull barrels, beaver tails and the like are pretty new designs. The 1911 and 1911 A1 didn't experience much of the problems you reference. Of course they didn't exhibit 2" 25yd accuracy and carry 8 round mags either. In any event, the third generation guns are far from obsolete. My 9mm 1911 may be my favorite range gun, but if TSHTF, I'm more apt to reach for my 5906 or 4566TSW.

 

[ColbyBruce]

"Ancient methods and materials"

There you go, you answered your own question.

 

[BAM-BAM]

18DAI;

S&W wants to sell their new ......"Glock era" plastic fantastic's..... to the great unwashed masses...... who suddenly want to own a gun before it's too late.......

.......they don't want those folk buying a "obsolete" handgun from the last century! Those (un)informed buyers need a "new and improved" 21st century handgun.......machine molded in one of the new and improved calibers; like .40short & weak or .45glock...LOL.

There's no money in it for S&W if you and I buy used/lnib S&Ws (fresh from someone's sock drawer) from the last century!!!!!!


Soon we will be hearing that those all those old S&W revolvers with one piece barrels are unsafe and will blow-up if you shoot a second round after a squib-round. Not to mention you can pinch your finger or thumb on those obsolute exposed/sharp (OSHA non-compliant) firing pins!!!!!!!!!!

 

[OKFC05]

So, what makes my carry guns obsolete?

Because the manufacturer no longer supports them, basically.
Finding support for obsolete machinery of any kind means special effort and inconvenience....just like my 1967 muscle car. As long as nothing breaks, it is as good as ever, but when something major breaks...

 

[growr]

to me obsolete simply mans no longer made....NOT unservicable.....M1 Garands are obsolete and they are still in use by civilians.....not military.
Just MY thoughts

Randy

 

[gunhobbit]

"Ancient weapons are no match for good combat tupperware at your side, kid."

 

[THE PILGRIM]

If they catch on, ie 1911s, the after market folks will make you plenty of parts.
If they didn't catch on and tend to break, need parts, you could be in a world of hurt down stream.

 

[ISCS Yoda]

ob·so·lete

adjective

1.

no longer produced or used; out of date.

synonyms: outdated, out of date, outmoded, old-fashioned, démodé, passé, out of fashion;

==============

It's not the best terminology for handguns but if "no longer produced" is the basis we're stuck with. In summary, however, my theory, as noted by someone above, actually, is:

If it's a semi-automatic pistol (you know they used to be called automatics but that term is now obsolete) and it's frame is made from a metallic substance and not some plastic/polymer, it is obsolete. At least for any manufacturer that doesn't make metallic-framed pistols any longer.

Other makers might disagree......

***GRJ***

 

[Iggy]

S&W no longer makes parts.

 

[Arik]

I once posted a question regarding 3rd gen reliability on another forum where there is a heavy police presence and a usually leans towards the heavier use of equipment. .....Lots and lots of shooting.

Anyway, I was asking about my then 5946 and those that did carry them had about the same responses as if I asked about Glocks here. Some were indifferent, others didn't care for the weight and some had mechanical problems.

For me
1) parts replacement is a big issue. I don't want to spend time searching and calling to see who may have a part in stock. Some people love the trill of looking. Spending months tracking down a part. I don't. I want to Google and buy.

2) weight. For those that are LEO it's not a problem. Doesn't have to be concealed. Mine does. So i wear iwb holster. My job is always different day to day. Today I'm in the office. Tomorrow I might be picking up parts and Saturday I might spend half the day under a tractor trailer checking, greasing, adjusting, climbing. The weight does make a difference.

3) I absolutely despise the flat grips if S &W. And i have to hunt down Hogue rubber grips with palm swell. You go to a site and they are out of stock. Another site had them on sale but now it's $50...so on and so forth.

4) I don't see a problem with polymer or their triggers.

5) it's for SD not for an art gallery. IWB AND under a shirt the "look" is irrelevant. Even more so when it actually needs to be used.

6) hate the mag safety. Hard to find one without

7) don't see a big accuracy difference between the 4506 and the G21. Or G19 and 5946. The Smith is "more" accurate but not enough of a difference. I can put them all center mass with either gun. Im sure it would make a difference if i shot from rest

 

[BMCM]

What makes your guns, and my guns, all our guns for that matter, obsolete is simply profit. Manufacturers deem these guns obsolete simply because they are no longer profitable. To keep the shareholders happy, the Board needs you to buy the new improved plastic wondercrunchentickers otherwise, boardmembers get replaced... And we can't have that now can we?

These days, manufacturing goods from high quality materials that don't break or wear out is a bad business decision. To wit: the modern automobile.

Oh, and the Garand obsolete? Maybe so but, there's several outfits currently making premium barrels. There's literally tons of NOS parts available and a healthy aftermarket industry. Can't really say the same for our 3rd gens, at least not yet. In any event, should the proverbial TEOTWAWKI occur, I certainly would'nt feel undergunned with a bag of en-blocs, a 4506 and a Garand. Plus a Garand has an added special benefit... Should the need arise to buttstroke some miscreant in the chops, you won't be snappin' the buffertube off at the castle nut on your U.S. Rifle M1

Cheers
Bill

 

[petepeterson]

I think that's a poor choice of description on their part. "Discontinued" would be a more appropriate choice.

There's nothing obsolete about my 5906, which sends the same number of the same projectile at the same speed downrange as a Glock 19.

 

[missiondude]

Probably has something to do with the "Lifetime" warranty. If it is obsolete, they cant fix it for free... I am really going to hate to have to find new competition guns when my 3rd gen PC autos break.

 

[timn8er]

Of course, you're preaching to the choir here. If S&W considers them "obsolete" because they can no longer make the kind of money they need to make per unit, they better consider me "obsolete" too!

 

[gunhobbit]

I think that's a poor choice of description on their part. "Discontinued" would be a more appropriate choice.

I'd say that about covers it.

While they may no longer be produced, they're certainly used and are decidedly *not* "out of date."

Of course, those who love their combat tupperware with multi-piece triggers will most certainly assure me that my ancient weapon is "out of date."

So be it. I'm on board with the writer who said that no tool is obsolete in the hands of someone who knows how to use it, and is willing to do so.

 

[Arik]

I don't think it's so much "obsolete" as it just isn't profitable. People make sarcastic remarks about board of directors or S&W needs more money or whatever. The simple truth is that it costs more to make that same product today compared to 1990. First the dollar doesn't have the same buying power as It did. Second, other countries are bidding for the same raw materials, which drives the price up. Third, workers want to be paid more. $650 in 1990 is $1185.33 today. Would you be buying them at that price?

 

[wbraswell]

Kind of like most of us, we still work just fine, but we're still obsolete.

 

[photoman]

They can call it obsolete all they want. It's not going to stop me from using one.

 

[JeepinSoldier]

If a miscreant gets plugged by your 4516 are they gonna say "Hey that's obsolete?"

I just bought a 6946. With the full size mag and extension, its about the same size as a Block 19, and without - pretty close to a block 26.

Size and weight are close, no safety levers, one trigger action (The smith trigger will not wear a blister on my trigger finger like the block will and is smoother), and both are 9mm.

Seems the guns are both about the same, except the 6946 is a heck of a lot classier.