Checking out some guns on the weekend and I was passed a H&K 9mm USP Compact and loved the feel except for the mag release and was almost sold. Asked how many rounds and was told it was 10 with an extended mag to 13. The H&K felt great in my hand and I really wanted it but there was no way I could justify it's size compared to all the sub-compact 9mm's out there that hold 7-8 rounds and are way smaller and still accurate out to 25 yards and maybe more. I'd prefer a smaller gun and a few extra small mags.
Are the Days of the 9mm Compact Numbered?
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Waywatcher
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No. Compacts are more reliable than subcompacts, easier to shoot, generate more velocity, and hold more rounds. There is definitely a niche for them to remain relevant.
If the only criteria they're being judged upon is size then of course they will lose to subcompacts--but this ignores too many other legitimate factors.
No.....
Sub-compacts may be smaller....... but for all practical purposes a compact like a 3913 is just as easy to conceal...I've been doing it for 25 years... and easier to shoot.
The only advantage I see on a sub-compact is pocket carry..... if you are going to use a IWB or OWB holster a Compact is small enough for me!!!
That said;
I don't pocket carry (Wrangler's) .......as my pockets are full.....LOL
Coat pocket carry (winter) second gun.......make it a snub J frame for me!
Sub-compacts may be smaller....... but for all practical purposes a compact like a 3913 is just as easy to conceal...I've been doing it for 25 years... and easier to shoot.
The only advantage I see on a sub-compact is pocket carry..... if you are going to use a IWB or OWB holster a Compact is small enough for me!!!
That said;
I don't pocket carry (Wrangler's) .......as my pockets are full.....LOL
Coat pocket carry (winter) second gun.......make it a snub J frame for me!
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Protected One
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Not at all. The compact platform offers advantages that are still coveted by many. More than sufficient capacity, and easily concealed by the average person.
Subcompacts are for those situations where concealment is more difficult, or, serving a back-up role.
Subcompacts are for those situations where concealment is more difficult, or, serving a back-up role.
ChattanoogaPhil
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For me, yes.
I'm not the least bit interested in toting my Glock 19 other than in the glovebox. My next 9mm carry gun is going to be a Kahr PM9.
Accuracy and velocity concerns don't seem to have greatly affected the overwhelming popularity of 2in Jframes.
I'm not the least bit interested in toting my Glock 19 other than in the glovebox. My next 9mm carry gun is going to be a Kahr PM9.
Accuracy and velocity concerns don't seem to have greatly affected the overwhelming popularity of 2in Jframes.
Biggfoot44
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" Compact " is a variable terminology. Different Mfg will label various products with a label , frequently relative to other of their products , but accross the larger pistol world , "compacts" will ovelap with "subcompact" and "service" sizes. And different people have different sized hands.
But yes the size of pistol you are referencing still fills a niche, and will continue to do so . Heck , with LE use of 9mm holding strong and even picking back up , such medium-ish sized gun will probably have spillover effect with the general public in 9mm vs .40 or whatever.
For that matter , I'm happy with sorta mediumish- compactish 9mm in single stack.
But yes the size of pistol you are referencing still fills a niche, and will continue to do so . Heck , with LE use of 9mm holding strong and even picking back up , such medium-ish sized gun will probably have spillover effect with the general public in 9mm vs .40 or whatever.
For that matter , I'm happy with sorta mediumish- compactish 9mm in single stack.
mc5aw
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For individuals who actual practice with their carry guns ... NO ... based on the cost effectiveness of 9mm over .45ACP, .380, .40, etc.
For individuals who simply carry lots and shoot little ... YES ... as ammo economics are not part of the equation, while aesthetics (size, concealability, etc.) are the driving factors.
For individuals who simply carry lots and shoot little ... YES ... as ammo economics are not part of the equation, while aesthetics (size, concealability, etc.) are the driving factors.
getoff
Member
the Shield, PPS, LC9s, and the like are here to stay. they are not for me, but an awful lot of people love theirs. I'm a full size kind of guy myself. my G17 does most of the EDC duty. when i want a little less size, i go to the G19. if I must, a 337, or 442 does the job. my father in-law is a smaller man and a G19 is just to big for his hand and body frame. got him a shield and he LOVES it. I'll stick to the full size...
cmort666
Member
The sub-compacts, depending upon design, can be very uncomfortable to fire.
On the other hand, I can shoot my Glock 19 all day long, even with decent self-defense ammunition. I don't think I'd want to do that with an LC-9.
On the other hand, I can shoot my Glock 19 all day long, even with decent self-defense ammunition. I don't think I'd want to do that with an LC-9.
LOL.......
Ever seen a Beretta 92 Compact??? It's about the size of a 5906!
A Compact Type-M (single stack) about the size of a Colt Commander!
Sig 225 or 228/229..........Compacts?........... not so much!
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Frizzman
US Veteran
I have a Glock 23. I've owned every size Glock except for the G42. They have all come and gone. It's a primay house gun. I have a .357 Sig and a 9mm conversion barrel for it. So, it can be a compact 9mm when used with G19/17 mags...I like that its ablet to use three types of ammo and take larger capacity magazines and use a laser/light if desired. If I was going to carry a Glock, it the is concealable any easier to shoot well...I do admit to carrying a Kahr PM9 at times though...But, mosty I carry J Frames.
hkcavalier
US Veteran
They are not going anywhere. I think the G19 is the best selling single model centerfire handgun in the U.S. over the last 10+ years? Can anyone back that up?
Let's face it --- for all around use (home defense, carry) they are a great compromise. I rarely suggest subcompacts to rookie shooters, not only because of recoil but because there is just less room for error --- they malfunction more often. People that don't practice failure drills (95%+ of gun owners, and I'm being kind) need something that's dead-nuts reliable, even if it's a bit bigger and heavier.
In my experience, nearly all people who carry couldn't care less about the velocity loss or gain from one model to the next. Struck in the same spot, a 9mm 124gr @ 1150fps will have the same real-world effect as one @ 1050fps. It's all about comfort, ergonomics, price, and ability to control the weapon.
Let's face it --- for all around use (home defense, carry) they are a great compromise. I rarely suggest subcompacts to rookie shooters, not only because of recoil but because there is just less room for error --- they malfunction more often. People that don't practice failure drills (95%+ of gun owners, and I'm being kind) need something that's dead-nuts reliable, even if it's a bit bigger and heavier.
In my experience, nearly all people who carry couldn't care less about the velocity loss or gain from one model to the next. Struck in the same spot, a 9mm 124gr @ 1150fps will have the same real-world effect as one @ 1050fps. It's all about comfort, ergonomics, price, and ability to control the weapon.
Definitely not, take for example the M&P9c vs the Shield. The 9c is just a little bigger and the mag holds 12 rounds. I actually prefer how the 9c fits my hands better than the Shield making it more shootable to me. These compacts aren't going anywhere.
Aticus
Member
Are the compact 9s on the way out? No. I don't consider a Glock 19, a Smith 39 series, the Colt Commander, or Beretta's Compact as compact guns. These are what used to be call belt guns. They were made to carry on the belt and can be concealed but it takes some work. To me a compact 9 would be a Kel-Tec P-11/PM-9, Smith M&P9c. Guns of that size are compacts. The smaller 9s are sub-compacts to me.
I have experience with a Kimber Pro Carry (commander size), the P-11 and the M&P9c. The Pro Carry was easy enough to conceal and comfortable enough to shoot for long periods. The P-11 and 9c were a lot easier to conceal but not as comfortable to shoot for long periods. I have no experience with the sub-compacts but I expect the shooting would not be something I'd want to do for more than 100 rounds if that.
I have experience with a Kimber Pro Carry (commander size), the P-11 and the M&P9c. The Pro Carry was easy enough to conceal and comfortable enough to shoot for long periods. The P-11 and 9c were a lot easier to conceal but not as comfortable to shoot for long periods. I have no experience with the sub-compacts but I expect the shooting would not be something I'd want to do for more than 100 rounds if that.
Surprised many consider a Glock 19 as a compact???? It's a full size 9mm. The Glock 26 would be a compact 9mm. I understand compacts are still very much viable in larger calibers but the selection of single stack 9mm's holding 7-8 rounds such as the PM9, Shield, P938, LC9, Colt New Agent and of course J-Frames have been around forever. The mags for these semi's are so small too. Easy to carry a couple in your pocket. Sure they're not designed for heavy range use but they're still very accurate. Seems Glock never got the invitation to this party. Neither did H&K, they must agree that most people want a larger 9mm.
Waywatcher
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They are all full sized just some have longer barrels than others. The Glock 26 is the compact 9mm.
ChattanoogaPhil
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The differences between a manufactures full size vs compact version are typically not that much. Trim an inch or less off the barrel and maybe a half inch or so off grip on the same platform... you got a compact. And it's not uncommon for the owner of a compact to add a magazine grip extension to get them right back to full size anyway.
I first got a G17 then years later a G19... eh... about the same gun.
It's the single stack subcompact that make the big leap from full size. Along with ease of carry, I think a lot of folks just aren't as enamored with carrying a box of ammo in a doublestack 9mm as they once were.
I first got a G17 then years later a G19... eh... about the same gun.
It's the single stack subcompact that make the big leap from full size. Along with ease of carry, I think a lot of folks just aren't as enamored with carrying a box of ammo in a doublestack 9mm as they once were.
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