Thinking about purchasing a Model 351PD in .22 Mag
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Erich
Member
Maybe. Issues with J-frame rimfires is that they come from the factory with a heavier-than-normal mainspring to ensure ignition of t he rimfire primers. Now, I know a number of people who've done trigger jobs, and some who've installed normal-weight mainsprings: they report that everything works fine.
Well, these are trustworthy people, so I'm sure that's so - for them . . . so far. But I have to wonder what interest the S&W engineers had in installing a heavier-than-normal spring in the first place. It wasn't because S&W wanted to make the trigger pulls on these rimfire Js more unpleasant than the triggers on their standard Js . . . I'm pretty sure of that.
So, I'm of the opinion that the heavier mainspring is a good idea.
I can report that my Model 34 was not an accurate .22 LR for me or any other adult (a 10-yr-old did better with it than any of us) - but that might have been the combo of the heavier mainspring and the small backstrap-to-triggerface distance on a J-frame. Perhaps putting enclosed backstrap stocks on the thing would have made it more accurate, but you're definitely not anywhere near the league of a Model 17 with a J-22.
As far as .22 Mag out of a handgun goes, I have a Bowen-converted Bearcat that has the appropriate barrel for .22 Mag (one of the post-'93 barrels originally intended for the conversion Bearcat before they pulled the .22 Mag cylinders due to people fanning them). I find that the (4") gun gives dramatically increased velocities from when it was a .22 LR (I get over 1400 fps with several 40g-gr loadings), but that it's profoundly ammo specific: my gun likes Winchesters and groups decently with them, but any CCI/Federal/Remington or Fiocchi just patterns at 10 yards - and many of those bullets keyhole.
Any rimfire .22 revolver is going to have ammo that it likes better than other ammo, but I've never seen such a rejection of ammo by a gun like from this Bearcat. Feed it what it likes, it's fine. Otherwise, forget it.
Now, what are your velocities going to be like from a 1 7/8" tube? 40-grains at 1050 fps? That's what Google searches lead me to believe . . . compare that to what a Velocitor will do from a similar length .22 LR revolver. Because .22 Mag ammo is not cheap.
Anyhow, just some thoughts for you to consider. I like the .22 Mag cartridge a lot, FWIW, and like the idea of the 351 quite a bit for some limited uses.
Oh, and welcome to the forum, dude!
Well, these are trustworthy people, so I'm sure that's so - for them . . . so far. But I have to wonder what interest the S&W engineers had in installing a heavier-than-normal spring in the first place. It wasn't because S&W wanted to make the trigger pulls on these rimfire Js more unpleasant than the triggers on their standard Js . . . I'm pretty sure of that.
So, I'm of the opinion that the heavier mainspring is a good idea.
I can report that my Model 34 was not an accurate .22 LR for me or any other adult (a 10-yr-old did better with it than any of us) - but that might have been the combo of the heavier mainspring and the small backstrap-to-triggerface distance on a J-frame. Perhaps putting enclosed backstrap stocks on the thing would have made it more accurate, but you're definitely not anywhere near the league of a Model 17 with a J-22.
As far as .22 Mag out of a handgun goes, I have a Bowen-converted Bearcat that has the appropriate barrel for .22 Mag (one of the post-'93 barrels originally intended for the conversion Bearcat before they pulled the .22 Mag cylinders due to people fanning them). I find that the (4") gun gives dramatically increased velocities from when it was a .22 LR (I get over 1400 fps with several 40g-gr loadings), but that it's profoundly ammo specific: my gun likes Winchesters and groups decently with them, but any CCI/Federal/Remington or Fiocchi just patterns at 10 yards - and many of those bullets keyhole.
Any rimfire .22 revolver is going to have ammo that it likes better than other ammo, but I've never seen such a rejection of ammo by a gun like from this Bearcat. Feed it what it likes, it's fine. Otherwise, forget it.
Now, what are your velocities going to be like from a 1 7/8" tube? 40-grains at 1050 fps? That's what Google searches lead me to believe . . . compare that to what a Velocitor will do from a similar length .22 LR revolver. Because .22 Mag ammo is not cheap.
Anyhow, just some thoughts for you to consider. I like the .22 Mag cartridge a lot, FWIW, and like the idea of the 351 quite a bit for some limited uses.
Oh, and welcome to the forum, dude!
VaRecon
Member
I test fired one my buddy was considering getting. Out of my usual group of shooting friends I am the guy that's stuck on revolvers. So of course they got a chuckle when I was grouping "less then adequately" at self defense range. They stopped laughing though when they did much worse. Having owned two J's I was expecting to do better, especially when I can get an average 2" group with fairly hot .357's out of my 640 pro. Long story short, it just wasn't very accurate. If I needed to stop someone trying to jack my car I would gladly trust my life to it, but for the going price I would much rather have my .357 for self defense or a 617 as a fun gun. If you want one, by all means, go for it. I'm not very experienced with .22 mags and you may get far better results than me. I would just hate to see someone pay top dollar for it then turn sour on the company when it didn't shoot the way they wanted. Just my two cents.
Packard
Member
I've shot one. Very light. Loud enough, but almost no recoil. If the ammo was cheap I would have gotten one. As it stands I think it is a viable alternative to a .32 or a .380. Or a pocket gun for someone who is recoil-sensitive.
photoman
Member
I haven't had the opportunity to shoot one but I think it would be a viable option for someone that can't take a lot of recoil due to arthritis or other conditions.
I would buy up a bunch of Speer Gold Dot ammo and try different main springs, getting it as light as possible while still igniting the Gold Dot load and call it good.
I would buy up a bunch of Speer Gold Dot ammo and try different main springs, getting it as light as possible while still igniting the Gold Dot load and call it good.
JohnK
US Veteran
I've had several 2"-3" mags.
Sold them, because they were LOUD ! Did I say VERY LOUD ! You simply cannot shoot them, without serious ear protection.
A 6 1/2" Ruger Single Six, wasn't much better.
Lordy, a .357 Mag can't be worse.
Sold them, because they were LOUD ! Did I say VERY LOUD ! You simply cannot shoot them, without serious ear protection.
A 6 1/2" Ruger Single Six, wasn't much better.
Lordy, a .357 Mag can't be worse.
David Sinko
Member
I went with the 43C instead simply because .22 Magnum ammo is too expensive. Any 2" J Frame is going to require lots of practice for evaluation and familiarity.
But if I could reload and cast bullets for the .22 Magnum, I'd buy one in a heartbeat.
Dave Sinko
But if I could reload and cast bullets for the .22 Magnum, I'd buy one in a heartbeat.
Dave Sinko
LOUD, heavy J frame trigger with the additional issue of being a rimfire and you cant get the trigger pull down like a center fire, fixed sights and expensive ammo.
Lobster Picnic
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I shoot a lot of .22 Magnum out of a 1" NAA Pug and 2" NAA Black Widow. They are definitely fire breathing dragons. With CCI Maxi Mags, the Pug looks like a flamethrower at night. The Speer defensive ammo with faster burning powder for short barrels throws a much smaller flame. Both are extremely loud.
I think .22 Magnum is a good defensive round, especially if you get 7 or 8 of them in a lightweight reliable revolver. Going against multiple assailants, the extra rounds might come in handy.
I think .22 Magnum is a good defensive round, especially if you get 7 or 8 of them in a lightweight reliable revolver. Going against multiple assailants, the extra rounds might come in handy.
I bought one for my wife and had to send it back for a trigger job. It is so much smoother but she still cannot pull the trigger with ease. Old hands I guess because it is easy for me and others.
Now after one box of shells, this NIB perfect pistol will have to be sold.
I am looking for someone who wants a special deal on a new like gun or will take it against an excellent condition Model 41. She says she is a Automatic Kind of Girl?
Anyone interested, I am in Nashville and ready to work a deal.
2/3 of the MSP.
Now after one box of shells, this NIB perfect pistol will have to be sold.
I am looking for someone who wants a special deal on a new like gun or will take it against an excellent condition Model 41. She says she is a Automatic Kind of Girl?
Anyone interested, I am in Nashville and ready to work a deal.
2/3 of the MSP.
I've read that there's only one (maybe two) 22Mag loads that are made for short barrels. All the rest have powders optimized for 16" or longer rifle barrels, which don't begin to burn all of it in a couple inches of pistol barrel. I've thought about a 351 for my wife, but when I've tried to find the appropriate ammo to go along with it there has always been a backorder situation. When I did a Notify Me at Midway on some, it was sold out within 30 minutes of my getting the notification (late in the evening.)
I have since discovered the joys of 32 caliber revolvers, especially the 32 H&R Mag. They will shoot 32 Long ammo, which is very tame stuff to practice with, and most 32 H&R Mag ammo is also pretty comfortable to shoot. Buffalo Bore makes some +P stuff that gets up to mid-hot 38 Special energies (100g JHP bullet at 1100fps from a 2" 432PD barrel, 1230fps from a 3" M31.) I find the BB stuff more tolerable to shoot in an airweight J frame than the 38 Special +P FBI load in a steel J frame, although I still don't like shooting more than 6-12 rounds at a session. (Especially at >$1/round.) And you can reload the 32 for less than any 22 Mag load - based on Midway prices. As a centerfire J frame you will also get a very nice trigger pull on most samples. And all of my 32s are extremely accurate (accuracy seems to improve with velocity, for some reason, both with 32 Long and 32 H&R loads.)
J frames in 32 are not the easiest to find, and they're 6-shots instead of the 7 you'd get in a 351. However, any J frame in 32 Long that's marked Model 30 or 31 can have its chambers reamed to take 32 H&R Mag rounds for ~$100 total out of pocket. Buffalo Bore has advised me that such cylinders are completely safe for unlimited firing of their +P 32 H&R rounds.
So if your interest in a 351 is for higher capacity and lower recoil than the typical 38 Special J frame, you might also think about a 32 caliber. Just beware - they can be highly addictive.
I have since discovered the joys of 32 caliber revolvers, especially the 32 H&R Mag. They will shoot 32 Long ammo, which is very tame stuff to practice with, and most 32 H&R Mag ammo is also pretty comfortable to shoot. Buffalo Bore makes some +P stuff that gets up to mid-hot 38 Special energies (100g JHP bullet at 1100fps from a 2" 432PD barrel, 1230fps from a 3" M31.) I find the BB stuff more tolerable to shoot in an airweight J frame than the 38 Special +P FBI load in a steel J frame, although I still don't like shooting more than 6-12 rounds at a session. (Especially at >$1/round.) And you can reload the 32 for less than any 22 Mag load - based on Midway prices. As a centerfire J frame you will also get a very nice trigger pull on most samples. And all of my 32s are extremely accurate (accuracy seems to improve with velocity, for some reason, both with 32 Long and 32 H&R loads.)
J frames in 32 are not the easiest to find, and they're 6-shots instead of the 7 you'd get in a 351. However, any J frame in 32 Long that's marked Model 30 or 31 can have its chambers reamed to take 32 H&R Mag rounds for ~$100 total out of pocket. Buffalo Bore has advised me that such cylinders are completely safe for unlimited firing of their +P 32 H&R rounds.
So if your interest in a 351 is for higher capacity and lower recoil than the typical 38 Special J frame, you might also think about a 32 caliber. Just beware - they can be highly addictive.
Packard
Member
Rim fire ammo used to be cheap. Not so anymore. I have a 351 PD. If I want something will less kick, I can use wadcutters.
When rim fire ammo was cheap it made sense, but not anymore.
When rim fire ammo was cheap it made sense, but not anymore.
Lee's Landing Billy
Member
Get out the sticks and stones. I'm ready for a pounding. Try the Ruger LCR in .22 mag. Triggers are like butter and can be had for around $375. Now, here is the downside..They are BUTT UGLY!!!
This. I loved my 317. Everyday companion once I got home from work and piddled on my farm. Once I handled a .22 LCR, my 317 stays in the safe.
Trigger is mucho better, stock grips are better, front sight is easier to see. I love my .22LR LCR.
Hello:
Do you still have the 251-PD ? I have no trades, but I have cash, or whatever you prefer.
Do you still have the 251-PD ? I have no trades, but I have cash, or whatever you prefer.
