m41 extractors, Behlert, etc

[Stewboy]

Hello all,


I bought a 1979 m41 a couple of months ago. Long story short, first trip to the range it ran great. On the second trip, after a cleaning, it behaved very badly: could barely get the slide open after firing b/c the cases were sticking in the chamber. Same for various kinds of ammo, though the Federal 29gn punch worked better. Wolf springs in 7lb and 6.5 didn't help. Replaced extractor with Volquartzen it got worse.



So stripped the gun, and polished the chamber with Fitz using a cylindrical wool dremel style "bit." Back to the range today, and first 10 rounds went swimmingly using cci sv and OEM extractor. Then ejection problems started from the same magazine--case half way out of the chamber, next round beaten up trying to load.



Maybe a little more chamber polishing is in order? The chamber passes the plop test when clean, but after those ten shots today, it failed the plop test. Round would go half way down and stop.



I'm also looking at the extractors, and took pictures of the OEM (right picture) and the Volq (left picture). with a round against the bolt. What Austin Behlert noted years ago is evident: OEM is too long, and the claw hits the side of the case. Volq is a little better, but it's still not hitting the "corner" like it's supposed to. It seems like raising the back end up of the extractor a mm or two (by filling in slightly the hole in the bolt where its peg rests) might help, I'm not sure.



I cleaned the gun again, removed the firing pin and recoil spring, reinstalled the Volq. and hand cycled a magazine of rounds without any problem. So to repeat my earlier question, should I Fritz-polish the chamber a little more?



Of course, I may just need to send it to a m41 gunsmith, but I'd like to know how to fix the problem myself if possible. Sorry for the long post.



BTW, if anyone needs the article on Austin Behlert and his 41 diagnosis I've got it in PDF. One thing that surprised me is that Behlert reported the problem to S&W way back when, but they weren't interested.

 

[armorer951]

I would be reluctant to extensively polish the interior of the chamber....just me though.

You could always check for burrs at the chamber mouth or a defect inside the chamber itself. (use a magnifier) A reamer may be needed if you find something on the chamber mouth or interior.

If you haven't done so, I would remove the bolt and check the interior of the extractor cavity and the integrity of the plunger and spring to make sure the extractor is moving fully inward, and the extractor "flexes" in and out cleanly without any catches or resistance. Check that the mouth (and interior) of the ext. cavity is clean and burr free. A new extractor spring may help the extractor do it's job..

Sounds weird, but the extractor itself should come to rest in the center of the extractor cutaway in the barrel when the slide is fully forward. If there is any contact, there my be evidence on walls of the slot, or a shiny spot on the claw of the extractor. (top or bottom) This cutaway should be clean and free of debris.

I've read that .22 rimfire bullet lubricants (wax etc) can sometimes also cause stoppages due to residue and buildup in the chamber, depending on the ammunition and manufacturer. (but not at the 10 round mark) You could experiment with different standard velocity loads to determine whether or not this is a problem.

You might also check to see if the gun will shoot high velocity ammo successfully. If you do this, I would use a full length OEM spring for testing.

One other reminder if you are using a shortened or "cut" recoil spring in the gun, the cut end should always be at the rear, inside the frame cavity.

This is a "short list" of just a few additional areas to check. Other areas include problems with magazines and a lot of other potential problems. Hope you get it sorted out.

Please note, I am by no means an expert on the model 41. Just passing along some common problems and possible solutions I have learned after owning one for the past decade or so.

Most people here at the forum would include Clark Custom on the list as one of the foremost pistolsmith's for the model 41.

S&W(R) Model 41 | Clark Custom Guns

 

[Stewboy]

Thanks very much for that advice. I've taken bolt apart and cleaned everything, but will order a new extractor spring on your advice. Will also try some cleaned ammo next time I'm out, since it does seem like the chamber is getting grimed too quickly and that's causing part of the extraction problem. Thnx again.

 

[chief38]

If you haven't done so already, try a few boxes of the CCI standard velocity 40 grain ammo. That is the most widely tolerated ammo in M41's. Aside from solving many feeding issues, it is extremely accurate and reliable.

 

[Stewboy]

Yes, the CCI is what I've run exclusively, and only tried other SVs when I started having problems. The only higher velocity I tried was the Federal punch, which performed marginally better, but tends to flake a lot. Back to the range today to see if a minor adjustment on the Volquartzen extractor has helped.

 

[Protocall_Design]

Make sure it hasn't been dry fired and got a firing pin ding on the mouth of the chamber. That will cause extraction problems when the case is fired and expands.

 

[Stewboy]

Make sure it hasn't been dry fired and got a firing pin ding on the mouth of the chamber. That will cause extraction problems when the case is fired and expands.

Yes, thank you--checked that and it looks good even under magnification.