2 weeks into the "guns in restaurants" law in Arizona

PALADIN85020

PALADIN85020

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Effective Sept. 30, Arizona put a new law into effect that a concealed-carry permit holder may pack a concealed weapon into a bar or restaurant that serves alcohol if the owner/owners don't post a sign indicating "no guns allowed."

Although I have heard of a few bars and restaurants loudly protesting the new law and stating their intent to post such a sign, I have not personally entered a bar or restaurant serving alcohol that has done so. Am also pleased to report that there have been no shoot-outs in bars or restaurants since the law went into effect. I'm personally gratified at this, and wonder how many of you living in Arizona have experienced posted signs barring guns?

If so, give 'em one of these cards:

noguns.jpg
 
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I have only encountered 1 restaurant with a no guns sign. I wrote them the following letter and gave them a No Guns, No Money card. Guess it didn't make an impression...after a week the sign is still posted.

October 4, 2009


To The Management,

I thought I would take a moment to explain why we did not have dinner in your restaurant last evening. We got as far as the front door where we saw your new sign banning firearms. We used to dine in your restaurant up until you acquired your liquor license some time ago. Both my wife and I received our Concealed Carry licenses from the State of Arizona in 2004 after receiving the required training. Up until a few days ago, it was illegal for us to dine in an establishment that served alcohol so we quit going to your restaurant when you began serving alcohol. Before that we used to have dinner a couple of times a week and both of us were always armed with concealed weapons.

The law in Arizona was recently changed permitting us to now dine in places that served alcohol and that was good news to us because we could once again enjoy dining at your restaurant. It should also be mentioned that we never consume alcohol while carrying because that would be illegal for us to do so and put us at risk for losing our licenses. We were both surprised and disappointed to find that you had put up a sign banning firearms. Needless to say, we chose to dine at another restaurant where we were not banned.

Has it ever occurred to you that by posting a sign banning firearms that you are advertising to the criminal element that everyone inside is unarmed and defenseless? Do you really think that someone intent on doing you or your customers harm would actually obey your sign? By posting your sign you are in reality putting everyone dining there in danger of being a victim of a crime should a criminal decide to take advantage of your sign advertising that everyone is unarmed. Your sign has only banned the people legally trained to defend themselves and others from being a victim of a crime, the ones with the money to spend in your establishment.

Signed:
 
Lee in Quartzsite said:
I have only encountered 1 restaurant with a no guns sign. I wrote them the following letter and gave them a No Guns, No Money card. Guess it didn't make an impression...after a week the sign is still posted.

October 4, 2009


To The Management,

I thought I would take a moment to explain why we did not have dinner in your restaurant last evening. We got as far as the front door where we saw your new sign banning firearms. We used to dine in your restaurant up until you acquired your liquor license some time ago. Both my wife and I received our Concealed Carry licenses from the State of Arizona in 2004 after receiving the required training. Up until a few days ago, it was illegal for us to dine in an establishment that served alcohol so we quit going to your restaurant when you began serving alcohol. Before that we used to have dinner a couple of times a week and both of us were always armed with concealed weapons.

The law in Arizona was recently changed permitting us to now dine in places that served alcohol and that was good news to us because we could once again enjoy dining at your restaurant. It should also be mentioned that we never consume alcohol while carrying because that would be illegal for us to do so and put us at risk for losing our licenses. We were both surprised and disappointed to find that you had put up a sign banning firearms. Needless to say, we chose to dine at another restaurant where we were not banned.

Has it ever occurred to you that by posting a sign banning firearms that you are advertising to the criminal element that everyone inside is unarmed and defenseless? Do you really think that someone intent on doing you or your customers harm would actually obey your sign? By posting your sign you are in reality putting everyone dining there in danger of being a victim of a crime should a criminal decide to take advantage of your sign advertising that everyone is unarmed. Your sign has only banned the people legally trained to defend themselves and others from being a victim of a crime, the ones with the money to spend in your establishment.

Signed:
Click to expand...


I admire your letter. Literate, to the point, and no redneck raving. It should be a model for similar letters.

T-Star
 
Have not seen a sign here or anywhere I do business. Going to Bisbee Monday and on to Serra Vista. In Douglas half the population is Border Patrol I doubt if any place posts, SV is 50% Fort Huachuca personal. Bisbee is kinda liberal we will see.
 
I've eaten in a couple places that serve alcohol, and looked at the entry of another, and have yet to see the "no guns" signs. Where can you get the cards with the "take my business elsewhere" message?
 
Despite the whining and crying in the letters to the editors section of the newspaper, I haven't seen any signs here in Lake Havasu City. Of course, our snowbirds from up North may not have seen the news and are just arriving in town while the California Contingent (which pretty well keeps the bars in town packed year round) hasn't been very vocal as yet.

I got a stack of cards ready and waiting although I must admit, a town with 50,000 inhabitants and 6 gun shops is probably not going to need a whole bunch.

Dan R
 
gunsmith11 said:
if it is concealed,,,who cares
Click to expand...

You will if you pull it (or someone "makes you"). I may not like the existing laws but when it comes to CCW, you better believe I am going to comply. I may be in the minority here (imagine that), but I see CCW as privilege much like driving. You fill out the forms, take the test etc., etc., and they give you a license/permit. "They" retain the ability to revoke said privilege. No, this not intended to be a debate about rights/privilege, just an observation on the way it currently is out there.

Now as I said, I may not like laws but since I want to continue to CCW/drive I have come to terms with compliance. In this case it is my choice to not enter an establishment that has the legal right, by posting, to prohibit CCW. I won't do business there even if I am not carrying but hey, it is his restaurant and he has the right - even though I think it/he is stupid, to run his business as he sees fit.

If you go into a bar and drink or a restaurant that is posted while carrying and you end up getting caught, it happens, (see the "Do you try and make people" thread), the consequences are severe. You will probably lose the ability to ever CCW again and perhaps even lose the ability to "legally" own a firearm for the rest of your life. For me it is just not worth the risk. Everyone gets to make their own choices but we must be prepared to live with the consequences.
 
I was just through AZ last month. Stayed at the Courtyard Marriott in Flagstaff, drank in their bar...no sign. Ate dinner at Black Barts (a whole nuther story there), again I did not see any signs. During my return trip I stayed at the Courtyard Marriott at the junction of the 101 and I-10. When we walked down to the bar for an evening drink, the had a sign posted right behind the bartender proclaiming "no guns allowed".

Maybe it had something to do with being so close to Phoenix proper? I don't know.
 
Capt Steve said:
For me it is just not worth the risk. Everyone gets to make their own choices but we must be prepared to live with the consequences.
Click to expand...

I agree...I will not carry where posted, I will just avoid the business.

MKT said:
Maybe it had something to do with being so close to Phoenix proper? I don't know.
Click to expand...

The law just went into effect at the beginning of October 2009.
 
I saw in the paper that it was 18 years ago today when the massacre in Luby's in Kileen, Texas took place. This event really is why Texas has concealed carry today, and maybe a lot of other states too. These establishments need to be reminded of that. The BGs don't leave their guns in the car.
 
Lee in Quartzsite:

Great letter! Rational and to the point. Should be a model for others to do likewise.

For those asking about the card: It's right on my original post in this thread, but here it is again:

noguns.jpg


Then, assuming you have Windows, right-click the card above and "save as" whatever file name you want, like "noguns.jpg".



Go to your word processor (I use Word). Click "Insert", "Picture", "From file" and pick your file for insertion onto the page. Repeat as necessary, and move the pictures around as necessary to get max number on the page. You should then have a Word file like this:

CARDS.jpg


Select your paper or card stock for printing, print, and use scissors or a paper cutter to separate your cards.

Simple, really! I keep a supply of 'em in my wallet.
 
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Paladin-do you have anything on the back of the card? I came across the following somewhere and thought it was a good summary:

As a citizen with a concealed handgun license, I:
Have no felony convictions;
Have never been convicted of domestic violence;
Have no history of mental illness or drug addiction;
Have passed a background check and have my fingerprints on file with the authorities;
Have passed mandatory training in both the use of a firearm and applicable law.
CAN YOU SAY THAT ABOUT YOUR OTHER CUSTOMERS?
 
Chik a Boom said:
Paladin-do you have anything on the back of the card? I came across the following somewhere and thought it was a good summary:

As a citizen with a concealed handgun license, I:
Have no felony convictions;
Have never been convicted of domestic violence;
Have no history of mental illness or drug addiction;
Have passed a background check and have my fingerprints on file with the authorities;
Have passed mandatory training in both the use of a firearm and applicable law.
CAN YOU SAY THAT ABOUT YOUR OTHER CUSTOMERS?
Click to expand...

Nothing on the back of the card yet, but that's a good summary. I'll have to figure out a way to align the front and back images.

Thanks!
 
PALADIN85020...thanks for the compliment. I am going to try a figure out how to add Chick a Boom's wording to the back of my cards.
 
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Tennessee's Restaurant Carry Law went into effect back in September. Oh yeah, there was alot of screaming and crying. "Blood in the streets" and all that BS. And many restraurants did post signs. In response, we permit holders took our business elsewhere.
Well, so far no shootouts. More importantly, many posted places started to feel the pinch. Slowly, but surely the signs are coming down.

BTW: one of our local Tennessee Firearms Association members owns a print shop. He made up thousands of the cards just like Palidin posted and the backs are printed up very much like what Chick a Boom posted. He's been giving them away at the monthly meetings here. I have some and take a few with me whenever we go out to eat. So far I haven't had to use any of them. :D

So hang in there Arizona, it'll get better before you know it. :D
 
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