Got this at the El Paso gun show this weekend. Measures 8inches wide X 6 1/2 inches high X 3 inches thick. Has an internal partition about half way up the inside. Marked on back Rock island Arsenal and inspector's mark, no date. Strap is long enough to be worn over one shoulder but hang across the chest to the other side. What is this thing, what period does it date from and how was it used?

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Sounds about perfect to hold 2 flasks full of your favorite beverage!!

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US Marine, 16 years+

Looks like it's either for food and/or ammo ;-)

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Jorge

Its an American Civil War era (or post era) cartridge box. Sounds like the inside tins are missing.Very nice!

Whew....I thought this was another 'identify this rash' thread.

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Thirty characters. Exactly...

bet Carrie Nation had one of those for her hatchet.

Sure looks like it to me!

Very nice condition part of history you got there bud!

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Take your time..quickly.

A "possibles Bag".

I'd guess some sort of map, manual or documents case from the size of it, the partition and the somewhat light weight shoulder strap.

An 8 x 6 x 3 box would be quite a large load over the shoulder with that simple strap.,and would be excessively deep for rifle rounds anyway.
Just my .02
Sure is a nice piece though. Nice find..
All I ever seem to see is black & camo nylon holsters at gunshows.

I'm thinking a post Civil War ammunition "cartridge box". The stamping of the US on the flap of CW era boxes started near the end of the war. Previously a lead filled brass faced oval plate with the US or down south CS was generally used. Most CW cartridge boxes were designed to carry 40 rounds of ammunition in 2 metal tins.

LTC

My first impression was a McKeever Box, but it's too big and wrong shape. Based on the size I believe it is a ration box, intended to hold 3-4 days ration of hard-tack. I couldn't find a picture of one though. It is definitely too deep and high to be a cartridge box.

I'd have to say a Civil War era possibles bag or perhaps a message pouch.

Binoculars.

It's too big for a cargridge box; I have a McKever box that is 1/2 to 2/3 the size of this, and a lot thinner to boot. The partition on the inside seems to be designed to separate whatever was behind it from what was in front. I don't know when the Army went from black to brown leather, and I don't know when Rock Island Arsenal started to abbreviate their name to RIA, or when they started to date their leather goods. And I don't know when the inspector. whose initials are E.H.S. worked there.

After I photographed it, I gave it a dose of saddle soap. Possibly I wasn't gentle enough; a lot of the stitching gave way. The leather is OK, but the thread was pretty rotten. Are there any leatherworkers on the forum who repair this sort of thing?

European man bag?

No kidding, I don't know whether repairing the stitching would help or hurt the value of the piece.

I withdraw my original statement on this as being Civil War era. Its actually a W.W. I era cartridge box.

If you decide to repair it, go to a fly tying web site and order some Kevlar thread in approximately the same color as the original. There are curved taper point needles out there in various sizes. The thread will be a lot thinner than the original and you should be able to use the existing holes. Be careful pulling it tight as Kevlar is tough and may cut into the ancient leather. All this is based on my putting other leather things back together. Nothing that old though. Good Luck!!

Try Jerry Burney. He repairs Luger holsters and may fix it for you.

lugerholsterrepair
WWI WWII Holsters & Accoutrements
Jerry Burney
13320 E. 45th Lane
Yuma, AZ 85367

928 342-7583
719 207-3331 (cell)
[email protected]

Ft. Lee Verginia is the home of the Quartermasters and their collection of origenal pattern uniforms and equipment, someone there not only knows "What and When", but also "How and Why, and How much?"

Normally I'd agree with my friend Ivan, but in this case I'd contact the Rock Island Museum directly: MUSEUM

Nice purse.

Looks like a post War of Northern Aggression cartridge box. Should hold either 20 or 40 cartridges of 45-70.

Depending on which source you use S.H. Broughton worked as an inspector from 1899-1910 or 1890-1920. Given the size of the object my guess would be that it was intended to hold artillery primers.

I have to agree with you. I don't know what it is but you have one. Larry

According to what I could find, E.H.S. was E. H. Schmitten, he was an inspector of leather goods at Rock Island but no date was given.

However, I did find this about a Trapdoor Springfield manufactured in 1893. This info is about the sling.

"Sling:

U.S. M1887, marked with "Rock Island Arsenal" and inspection stamp "E.H.S." for E.H. Schmitten Leather Goods, Rock Island.
The sling is also marked "AEA”, for “Army Executive Agent” for insensitive munitions."

And this:

"U.S. SCABBARD MODEL 1905
Manufactured by Rock Island Arsenal, Rock Island, Il. - Scabbard badly damaged from museum fire. Tip of scabbard missing.

Markings:
R.I.A. 1906 E.H.S. EHS = E.H. Schmitten."

So whatever you have, we know that E.H. Schmitten was at Rock Island in 1893 and also in 1906.

CW
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According to the 1885 Official Register of Civil Service, he was listed as a harness maker at Rock Island. So now at least a date range of 1885 to 1906.

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μολὼν λαβέ

Another guess on my part after a bit of Googling. This is similiar to an artillery gunners pouch. It was used to carry needed impliments including the friction primer lanyard, possibly primers and fuses. Sizes are also similiar. Some are shown with belt loops vs. the shoulder strap.

LTC