Hello All,

My wife was out yesterday afternoon taking our two basset hounds on their regular walk, when a larger dog bolted out the front door towards them.

The attacking dog managed to bite (one fang puncture) one of our dog's back in the ensuing melee. My wife pulled out her 3-in-1 Police Model MACE spray to ward off the attack. The spray didn't shoot out 10 feet as advertised, but rather dribbled out uselessly. She got more MACE on her hand and on the dogs even though she was pointing at the attacking dog's face. No wind, calm. Owner ran out, grabbed her dog, wife brought both dogs back home and we found the puncture which then necessitated a trip to the vet.

So my question to the forum members, does anyone have any proven, reliable recommendations for a non-lethal dog repellent? Something my wife could use with one hand while holding two leashes and dogs with the other?

I bought the Police Model 80112 MACE 18 gram spray with pepper, tear gas and UV dye. Like with carry firearms, one must have faith in your weapon that it will work when needed; if you don't believe in the effectiveness and reliability of your weapon, then you won't carry it.

I have two more of these sprays. I tested one last night, and it shot out 10 feet in a stream as advertised. But everytime you test spray, you reduce the content of the can and risk the nozzle clogging from dried up spray.

Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated. I hope there are other better alternatives to MACE spray.

Thank you in advance.

Richard in Plano TX

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USAF (Retired 1971-93)

When I saw your post I was going to recommend pure pepper spray without the tear gas as the dog can get a chemical burn from the tear gas.
Capstun is the one product I used when on the job.

Bear spray.

Glad your wife didn't have to use that Mace to ward off a human attacker. I understand Ace hardware sells pepper spray for bears that ought to work on dogs.

Years ago my brother gave me some dog spray that he had gotten fom the phone company. I believe it was pepper spray with orange dye. I know it would slow down a dog, but I was warned that it may not work on a trained attack dog.

Other than carrying a pistol with shot these ought to be the best, but they are subject to what just happened.

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Luke 22:36

Use pepper spray for dogs.
The brand-name Mace is designed to make the eyes water, and dogs don't have tear ducts.

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John

You might want to try one of these. Don't laugh, I have 2 pretty bad to the bone Bulldogs and I have found over the years EXTREMELY loud noises will stop a dog dead in his tracks quite often. It's worth a try, no ill effects and the horns have many other uses as well, all the best 26

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50/50 Household ammonia and water in a water pistol.. No lasting damage, but the attack dog will never bother you or yours again....
JIM.................

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SWCA # L-1911

^^^
+1

When I was a kid and had a morning paper route, I used to keep a spray bottle filled with straight ammonia hooked on the I rack used to carry papers. Used it on several occasions. Worked well and I could spray ammonia a pretty fair distance. Aim for the snoot and the dog will tuck tail and run.

Hello,

I forgot that dogs do not have tear ducts - no wonder MACE won't work very good.

I like the ammonia solution.

Was not aware of the horn-loud sound solution.

Let me run these past the wife and see what she is comfortable with.

Thank you. Finally, some things to investigate.

Richard in Plano, TX

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USAF (Retired 1971-93)

I carried a cattle prod on our walks for a long time. I only had to use it one time on a Pit Bull, and the results were impressive - it not only stopped his advance, he retreated like he was drunk. He never bothered us again.

Sounds like your spray was outdated.

use the dog-level spray and make sure it is up to date. The pepper doesn't go bad but the aerosol does. Also, carry two (one as back-up). Once you use it, trash it. The pepper clogs the nozzles as soon as it dries.

Same advice for bear spray.

its kinda big......but i bet a can of that Hornet&wasp stuff that sprays 25 ft would sure change a dogs tune?

Lemon juice and water 50/50 in a water gun. We used this on our paper route.

Here is what I'd use;

but it might not be non-lethal if my family or dog was attacked.

I would get a bigger dog. Besides that, I would go and find pepper spray formulated specifically for dogs.

And send the vet bill to the attacking dog's owner.

They sell pepper spray for dogs which is just watered down human stuff. Pepper sprayers should be replaced every thee years even if never used. Sometimes the valve will leak a drop or two and the residue will clog the nozzle. So inspect the nozzle often and rinse it with warm water if it looks gummed up. Also rinse the nozzle after each use. The keychain ones are. Nearly useless spraying only 3 to 5 feet. Look for 2 to 4 ounce versions that offer a sister inert practice can. Buy both and practice with the inert can. A 2 ounce can will give you about 15 seconds of spray. You only. Need 2. Seconds on target to be effective so every 6 months or so give it a short spray to make sure it is still giving you sufficient range. Don't forget to rinse the nozzle. Pepper spray of human strength will be very effective on animals as they have more sensitive membranes than we do.

I may be speaking out-of-turn here. Take what I say with a grain-o-salt.

If you want to protect yourself from an attacking dog by using ammonia with a squirt gun, or pepper spray, go ahead. Take the risk.

But, if you need to protect your significant other, child or toy dog from an attacking dog, using the above mentioned methods, you are risking their safety and well being.

I've been around dogs all my life, professionally and at home. I've survived a couple of serious dog attacks. Pit Bull and German Shepard.

If I'm facing an unavoidable dog attack, that dog will be met with lethal force and with no hesitation. I'll let the jury sort it out later.

Lethal force in the form of a firearm is exceedingly difficult to apply to a fast moving dog. If it has already engaged your dog you had better have a revolver as pressing the barrel against the attacking dog is the only sure way to assure a hit on the attacking dog and not hitting your own dog.

If you've trained for it then dogs are very easy to knock out, big dogs especially so as they are more likely to attack "high". The method is to present your weak arm. A dog will almost always attack the leading arm. When the dog leaps to bite the leading arm move it out of the way and sweep up with your strong arm striking him under the chin. I've done this once and I've seen it done twice. It does not take much to drop a big dog. Small dogs attack low and tend to be really quick. Pepper spray is a better choice. And if you are going to use a firearm then also extend your weak arm and shoot under it with your strong arm.
I've clocked a pitbull over the head with a stainless stee drinking mug--the only weapon available--hard enough and often enough to put a grown man in a coma and if it had any effect on the pitbull it was not apparent. I think a good pepper sprayer is still your best option.

Don't use the hornet spray, no one knows if it would work and it's poison. I wouldn't chance getting physical with the dog unless there was no other choice just because you are putting yourself in harms way as well. Shooting the dog is an option, just be aware that they will be hard to hit so be sure of your target, and be prepared to deal with a wounded dog (it's real ugly, particularly if you are a dog lover). Pepper spray seems to be the best alternative to me.

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Even older, even crankier....

I carry pepper spray when walking the dogs because it gives me options and the keys to the house and gate are on it. You should shake the canister every time you pick it up. I carry a gun to defend the dogs more than me, as I have to muzzle Bozo in case some inattentive A-H gets too close even after I warn them off in graveyard cop voice, so he can't protect himself from another dog very easily. This is a setting in which I really prefer a revolver, specifically my M296, because I want a contact shot to reduce the risk to my dogs and other innocents, and to maximize effectiveness on the attacking dog.

I would not use the the bug spray; it's a nerve poison and presents a hell of a risk to you and your dogs, too. The ammonia and other options will not discourage a motivated dog, either. I had a bull breed dog come across the street at when I was out running during law school, and it got a PR24 spin technique to the head while it was in the air. It was a lot more respectful thereafter.

I also walk with my head on a swivel, avoid silly **** like earbuds on music devices and the like except when locked in the house, etc; there is no one answer, but a system.

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NHI, 10-8.

sling shot with paint balls is what we used... you dont have to put as much bang behind it as to injure the dog

This is the technique (more or less) that I learned when working around vets in the pet shops while in college. I also was taught this when I took a animal handling course in grad school. I was warned however that you will likely get a broken arm. But alive with a broken arm is better than what could happen. (Kinda like my knife instructor said"You gonna get cut so get over it")

Get a bottle of Hartz Dog Shampoo. My dog runs like the devil when he sees me with it.

Hello All,

Thank you so much for all the super ideas. Sometimes one has to brainstorm with others to look at several options.

I have a CCW and routinely carry my 340PD in my belly band holster if I go on the walk with my wife and the dogs. My wife does not have a CCW so that is not an option for her. Besides, she says she might hit our dogs by accident and she could not live with that.

Ammonia and lemon juice solutions are too messy and I can't find a leak proof squirt gun that won't leak in her pocket.

I suggested that she can kick the attacking dog. Might be a bit of a balancing act with our two dogs on two leashes and the attacker. Everyone could wind up in a heap on the sidewalk.

Sling shot requires two hands.

Bigger dog not an option. We like bassets, one female is 45 lbs, the other is 48 lbs and low to the ground.

The shampoo makes our bassets run for cover as well.

The bear spray would pack a punch - but it is just too big to carry around.

The hornet spray is a gamble - I think I'll pass on this one.

I checked the date on the MACE spray - MFG. 2012, use by Jan 2016 and it was never used before this attack.

Yes, the owner of the attacker did come by the house that same evening with some dog toys and paid the vet bill ($250) and was sincerely apologetic. My wife has said hi to her on previous walks - been here 10 years. Dog just ran out the front door when it saw the lady's son coming up the sidewalk off the school bus, but then for some reason, decided to divert to a more appealing target - our dogs. Puncture wound is not infected, and healing nicely, thank goodness.

Based on everyone's input, she wants to try this:

Amazon.com: Mace Pepper Gun: Sports & Outdoors

I like that it has a practice water canister. We will take the advice of changing out the pepper canister even after one use, so I am ordering spare canisters. Looks like the reviews are good.

Let's see how this works out; hopefully, she won't need it again (first dog attack in the 15 years we lived here).

Thank you all for the recommendations. They were very valuable and helped us make a decision.

Cheers,

Richard in Plano TX

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USAF (Retired 1971-93)

That is designed to attack the neruological system of the wasps. It literally short circuits them, kinda like a spiders' bite or jellyfish sting. But FAST, like a jellyfish.
I do not know of its' effects on a dog. I am skeptical of how effective it would be.
My vote is pepper spray. Walking cane/ golf club. Steel toe boot.
In that order.

I am an avid bicyclist and after much experimentation I carry Sabre RED OC Stream, 2 oz can. It's easily carried or concealed by walkers, runners, and bicyclist and has a proven range of 15 feet or so. It is very effective on dogs as I've utilized it a couple of dozen times with 100% effect and it doesn't take much to get their attention.

As I spray them I growl back at them "get" a couple of times. Most of the time I only have to use it once on any given dog. Typically when I've encountered a dog the second time they don't get very close, and if they do I just growl "get" and they stop in their tracks.

I have had two specific dogs that I sprayed a couple of times and they just wouldn't take "get" for the answer. They were allowed to run loose and were very aggressive. Eventually, after warning the owners first, I shot and killed one and the other got run over by the UPS truck. Some people just won't listen.

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- Change it back -

3 ft of shovel handle. Ain't lethal unless it need to be. Joe

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Wisdom chases me; I'm faster

Cattle prod, stun baton or stun cane. When attacked by a dog use a continual application of the shock device until the irresponsible owner shows up then a few applications on them should do the job.

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314th AMS 1983 - 1991

Where legal.

Check out UDAP Bear Deterrent Pepper Spray They produce bear spray and pepper spray, Theres a video of a pit bull being hit with their spary. good stuff

Bear deterrent sprayers can shoot out to 25 feet. A real advantage. But they contain the same ingredients as human pepper spray. And they are generally too large to carry. A good human sprayer will go out to 12 feet. The keychain ones only to 4 to 6 feet and I consider them inadequte for dogs or bad guys.

Upon further reflection I don't this this would work for me. The cattle prods I've seen are too large to carry on my person. The stun batons pretty much mean that the dog has already launched and is about to nail you as you apply the zapper.

A full size man in good shape can defeat a dog upto about 75 pounds. But the dog usually wins because of our primal fear of an attacking dog. Dog trainers get over that fear and can frequently protect themselves from an attacking dog. I think that same primal fear would come into play with the very close battle stun batons.

Buy a Kimber...



PepperBlaster II

Or just buy a smaller spray bottle, fill it with ammonia and some Tabasco sauce and call it a day. Though undiluted household ammonia alone will work fine. Don't bother with a squirt gun as most will leak. Any decent common household spray bottle can shoot a fair ways. Find a setting somewhere between mist and stream. If you want to step it up, you can buy a pressure sprayer bottle that will increase the distance and volume of spray.



Large Animal Pressure Sprayer | U.S. Plastic Corp.

Or use what mail carriers have used for thirty years...



Halt II is 1% capsaicin. Clip a can to your belt and go.

http://www.rainbowtech.net/products/...rature.pdf.pdf

+1 on the ammonia and water. When I was in unversity there were a lot of mean stray dogs between my place and campus and I carried a squeeze bottle with ammonia. Had to use it several times and it worked well. How about wasp spray?

I tried the Kimber. It shoots pretty far. But your aim has to be on-target and you only have two shots. I felt I would need more practice to assure my accuracy. I felt a lot safer with a sprayer where I could re-aim on the fly.

The Halt II is half the potency of the human variety--with good reason--it is legal (as far as I know) in all states because of the lower potency, and dogs have more sensitive membranes than humans and it works fine.

But if I am going to carry only one sprayer, then it's going to be the human variety with the extra potency. Attacking dogs be forewarned.

I think it is unreasonable to expect anyone to carry a bottle sprayer on a regular basis.

Get a Pit Bull and take it with you when and wherever you travel...

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In dog years I'm dead.

Louisville Slugger.

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Forum consigliere

When I worked for the power company we used Halt II. It is red so watch out for you clothes but it never failed me. You would only need to hit the dog once in the eye area, after that just a glimpse of the bottle on that dog will do the trick. I used it on German Shepards, Pit Bulls, Rottie's and mutts. Used it more than I wish I had too.

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BG 380,Shield 9 & Mossburg 500

Probably is easier for the paperboy with racks, or bicyclist with a place to mount a spray bottle. But people carry water bottles on their belts often enough that it shouldn't present much of a challenge to find a smaller spray bottle to fit a water bottle carrier.

As with humans, some dogs are immune to the effects of pepper spray. Ammonia is often recommended over pepper spray for this application because it is an asphyxiant that cause a more pronounced reaction with dogs than does pepper spray. I've heard it explained that a more aggressive breed may be able to ignore the pain of pepper spray, whereas the effects of a breathing problem coupled with being blinded is not be so easily ignored.

Household ammonia is commonly an 8% solution. Stronger stuff (straight ammonium hydroxide) is available and can be diluted to half strength, but it is far less safe in such concetrations.

Read this in another forum from someone that used it in a LE setting:

"you have to hit a dog square in the mug with pepper spray or mace or it doesn't work. When I was on the Tactical Entry Team (years ago) and were going into a yard with an aggressive dog we carried a spray bottle of ammonia. It never failed to chase them off, even if it didn't "hit the mark". The remained wary of us the entire time we were at the location, barking, but at a distance."

FWIW, the Kimber Pepperblaster II was mentioned half in jest.

I had a purebred Doberman Pincher who apparently did not know how big the breed was supposed to get. He grew to 29" at the shoulder (2" taller than your desk) and 135 pounds. He jumped a 10 foot tall fence once with about 1 foot of air under his belly.

He had a unique approach to other dogs.

If a dog came over and wanted to sniff he was, "Hey, I like to sniff."

If a dog came over and wanted to play he was, "Hey, I like to play."

And if a dog came over to fight, he was, "Cool, I love to fight."

Whatever the dog wanted to do, he was happy to accommodate him. And he always, always won the fights. A local motorcycle dealer had a Doberman that he allowed to roam the streets. My dog beat that dog in a fight so fast that it was over before I knew it was starting, the the dealer's dog on the ground and my dog holding him by the throat. My dog then let him go and turned his back on the dealer's dog and strutted away with an attitude that said, "Go ahead and try it."

On another occasion a woman was walking home from the train station and the dealer's dog was stalking her. I joined her with my dog and escorted her home. The dealer's dog ran off.

Apparently it was strength by association. After that the woman said all she had to do when the dealer's dog was around was to spin around and say, "Go!" and the dog would run off.

But in general I don't think carrying a dog with you is the answer. I carry pepper spray and a gun (or two). Not every situation where you could legally use a gun is it sensible to do so. At the very least the paperwork involved in a shooting would recommend pepper spray over a 9mm.