Which do you prefer? Rawhide or Wagon Train? Both deal in massive "livestock" movement be they Human or Beeves.

One thing else i see similar between the two series is=--one starts all its shows titled with: "Incident at Bear Creek" or: The Ben Bonehead Story."

Both shows lost its lead star do to heart attack (Ward Bond & Eric Fleming) well before both series were cancelled. Both shows started off with a rating of approx 30 or above in first week rating. Thankfully, by their second episode-they became more and more popular.

I find them both great shows but, lean towards Rawhide as the more favorite of the two.

Oh and a bit of trivia if not yet discussed) on Rawhide. All of the folks in Gil Favors employ--were Confederates. Favor was a Lieutenant and Yates was a Corporal. Not sure what ranks the others had as members of the Confederate States military.

Two shows I rarely missed as a kid. Would also lean more toward Rawhide if I had to choose between them but see no need to pick one or the other.

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642-1, M&P15 TS

I had to. Reason being is even some of the earlier episodes of Train were as boring as watching concrete set. So far, Rawhide wins out on stories. One Wagon Train story that sits in my mind as excellent--was the: Sam Spicer Story. I dont know why? but when I think of train--I always think of that story.

However, as far as themes go--Rawhides theme blasts Wagon Trains theme by a mile.

You can't beat Frankie Laine.

I normally don't remember a lot of the stories from either show off the top of my head but usually once I begin watching an episode it'll come back to me.

Speaking of these two iconic shows, I hope you won't mind me just mentioning some of the shows I remember on Saturday mornings and during the week. Maybe grist for further discussions...

Fury (The Black Stallion)
Sky King
My Friend Flicka (I didn't watch that one much)
Andy's Gang
Tales Of The Texas Rangers
Tombstone Territory
26 Men
Jim Bowie
Bat Masterson

Man, the list goes on and on but you get the general idea. I guess we were all glued to the tv back then. Hell, I can still recite the words to half the commercials. LOL!

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642-1, M&P15 TS

Of those above ive seen, I havent seen Sky King since played on the Christian Broadcast Network and I last saw episodes about 1980ish.

Of the others, ive only seen Tombstone Territory and Bat Masterson--which I thought were excellent.

BTW, I just noticed the 17 or so episode series: Custer--is now on dvd.

I've read a ton of books on Custer and have visited the battlefield and environs, but I don't recall the series offhand.

Edit to Add: I've been to Tombstone as well. Visited while I was attending an arms smuggling investigation class at Davis-Monthan AFB several years ago.

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642-1, M&P15 TS

I thought Eric Fleming drowned in the Amazon river. (?)

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You're shy a few manners.

From Wikipedia:

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642-1, M&P15 TS

I rarely missed either shoe I catch Rawhide reruns on ME tv now.

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Custer ran for 16 or 17 episodes. Ive never seen the series myself but is currently on dvd. Also has Slim Pickens as California Joe.



[IMG]Series Description The Custer TV show was a 60 minute western action series on ABC that takes place in 1868, just three years after the end of the civil war. It followed the life of Lieutenant Colonel George Armstrong Custer as he led a bunch of former Confederate soldiers and criminals in a never-ending fight against the Sioux Indian nation. Custer Cast Wayne Maunder .............. Lieutenant Colonel George Armstrong Custer Slim Pickens ............... California Joe Milner Peter Palmer ............... Sergeant James Bustard Grant Woods ................ Captain Miles Keogh Michael Dante .............. Crazy Horse Robert F. Simon ............ Brigadier General Alfred Terry Custer Trivia There was an episode of the Custer TV show that was produced but did not air due to early cancellation of the series. Its title was: "Pursued" This series portrayed Custer realistically as a highly efficient military officer. Custer was treated as a glory seeking nutcase in many other movies and TV adaptations but it's more likely that he was simply a dedicated officer who was confident in his ability to get the job done, even if that job was essentially the elimination of an entire race of people's way of life. He simply carried out orders that were perfectly politically correct in his day in the most efficient way possible. Wayne Maunder did not wear a wig and fake mustache for his role as Custer. He grew his own hair and mustache for the part. He was one of the few star/stuntment as he did many of the numerous stunts required for this show. The Custer TV show's storyline ended one year before the real life Custer died at the battle of the Little Big Horn at the hands of Chief Sitting Bull. The real life Custer was bold in battle and was rapidly promoted to become the youngest breveted Brigadier General in the Union Army. His boldness didn't always please his superiors however and he once was even suspeded for a year when he refused to obey an order from a superior who he considered to be an idiot. He may well have been right to disobey. In those days Colonels and Generals often got their rank due to political connections rather than because of their abilities. Many soldiers perished because some rich man's son was giving ridiculous orders. Wayne Maunder continued to act until 1982 when he appeared in his last film, "Porky's". He then became an independent film producer. Episodes List With Original Air Dates The First And Only Season Sabers in the Sun (9/6/1967) Accused (9/13/1967) Glory Rider (9/20/1967) To the Death (9/27/1967) Massacre (10/4/1967) War Lance and Saber (10/11/1967) Suspicion (10/18/1967) Breakout (11/1/1967) Desperate Mission (11/8/1967) Under Fire (11/15/1967) Death Hunt (11/22/1967) Blazing Arrows (11/29/1967) Dangerous Prey (12/6/1967) Spirit Woman (12/13/1967) The Gauntlet (12/20/1967) The Raiders (12/27/1967)[/IMG]

Wayne Maunder was Custer.

I always heard he died of a heart attack but looks like I was proven wrong.

Enjoyed both shows, agree Rawhide had better music. Both had several episodes that had nothing to do with the series premise. It's amazing how many shows and movies focused on events like the wagon trains, cattle drives and pony express, events that occurred over a relatively short period of time. Many of these shows never made it to syndication due to their short runs. Most syndicators prefer 5 years as a minimum to put weekly shows on daily so they don't run out so fast. Some really long running shows episodes are sold in blocks so you do see repeated episodes. One that I would like to see again is The Guns of Will Sonnet. One thing I thougt funny about Frankie Layne was that when he recorded the song for Blazing Saddles, Brooks didn't tell him it was a spoof so he would play it straight.

I just remember getting my butt whipped by my grandfather every time he caught my brother and I playing Rawhide.
Possibly because it always involved stampedeing his cows 😊

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Bruce

Those were shows from a simpler time, when television was free and options were few. By today's standards, you might say we were roughing it, what with just one TV and three stations to choose from.

There were no household television recording devices; no such thing as "on demand." Miss a show and you had to wait months for summer reruns.

Yes, I liked both of those shows equally well.

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A gun has no brain.. use yours

I really like Rawhide, more excitement. Like Ringo said some Wagon train shows were like watching jello firm up. They were a writers version of a character study. I like the earlier Wagon trains with Ward Bond. I just read his bio. Pretty interesting, Met John Wayne at USC playing football, became lifelong friends. Was a starting lineman on USC's first national championship in 1928.

YAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

SKY KING!

Brought to you by......

YAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

NABISCO!

I've mentioned before that Gloria Winters (Penny) came off as kind of like a teenager, but she was pretty filled out. Turns out she was in her twenties through the whole run of the show. I had a terrific case of the hots for her and now I feel justified.

Guns of Will Sonnet was an EXCELLENT show. Really original stories, scripting, dialogue with a fair amount of action.

"He's faster than his Pa. And I'm faster than both of 'em. No brag. Jes' fact."

Star Trek was Rodenberry's idea of "Wagon Train to the stars".

I think when I was a kid I liked Wagon Train, but now Rawhide is my favorite. Wagon Train could get a little slow, which was probably VERY REALISTIC. Probably at the time to me it was contained in a fairly closed setting, kind of like a family, that a kid could understand. Often it centered on personal relationships rather than action. And yeah, theme music, no contest.

Rowdy Yates was pretty cool back then, but he was no Clint Eastwood......yet. We were talking about 'Mr. Ed' and I watched an episode where Mr. Ed was corrupting Clint's horse.

HEAD 'EM UP...MOVE 'EM OUT....

The premise of stories from the Tombstone Epitaph newspaper was pretty cool. What a name for a paper.

Gunsmoke was pretty amazing through it's whole run. A LOT of great stories and characters.

Bonanza was a great show, but I don't enjoy it as much as I did then. Best scenery EVER in a show.

"Pa, I saw them little green men!" (Does this ring a bell with anybody? Probably the closest Bonanza got to the 'aliens from space' that was so big at the time.)


"Branded" - Maybe one of the first 'anti-heroes' after Johnny Yuma.

o/' Stranded. Stuck on the toilet bowl o/'

o/' What do you do when you're stranded o/'

o/' and you can't find the roll? o/'

o/' To prove your a man, you must wipe with your.... o/'

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

Well said. Rawhide was based greatly on a movie I think is called: Cattle Queen and Paul (Wishbone) Brineger (SP?)--played the same type character in that movie. Also based on the writings of a real trail-boss--which Fleming basically quotes like him at the beginning of every episode.

I think Penny recently passed away. I wasnt thought of when the show originally aired.

I just barely remember Guns of Will Sonnet. Also, I THINK it was that show that had Kurt Russell--or either it was The Travels of Jamie McPheeters?

I can still watch some Bonanza, but not as much as I did when I was a Kid. If ever released by the owners?(some episodes are released unrestored and look ugly) ill buy only the years that had all four of the stars in it.

Gunsmoke, ill only buy the b&w eps--which i think were seasons 1-10??

I loved every episode of Tombstone Territory. Shame it lasted only 96 episodes. Its demise was because people were getting all Westerned-out I guess? I wish this series had lasted a few more years. Pat Conway--guested on a few shows after--one was in an episode of: The Texan, that also had other Western notables.

I heard about Brandeds theme-variant. The guy who created the show talked a bit about it but never sang any words.

Preferred Rawhide. Stopped watching Wagon Train after Ward Bond died.

One show I really enjoyed was the Walt Disney shows about Texas John Slaughter. Those were really good for a young Iowa farm boy.

Ive never seen any of those. Wish disney would release them on dvd.

Yep. When these shows came along, we didn't even have electricity. We had to watch TV by candle light.

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Georgia On My Mind

The way Wagon Train was written to focus on the guests, it did seem to attract more of the top stars of the time. Some that I recall include Bette Davis, Whitmore, stanwyck, Rooney, Reagan,Suzanne Pleshette, Nimoy, Moorehead, Lee Marvin,Ralph meeker, Montalbahn, Marjorie Main, Jack Lord, George Gobel, Lorne Greene,Hayden, Falk, Doryea, Linda Darnell, Joseph Cotten, James Caan, Borgnine. Some also appeared on Gunsmoke .

I'm with you on this. It's been a long time since I have seen one in reruns. Tom Tyron played Texas John Slaughter.

17 episodes aired for three years on "The Wonderful World of Disney" between '58 and '61. Texas John was a real life character.

Rawhide was excellent. Good writing and a top notch cast. I made a point to DVR and watch most of them when it was showing regularly on Saturday mornings on AMC a few years ago. It seems to have disappeared, again.

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Charlie Flick
SWCA 729 HF 215

Kind of an apples and oranges thang here Ringo. Wagon Train was focused more on the stories and events while Wagon Train was focused more on the personalities of the characters and their interactions.

I suppose I liked 'em both about the same but found them to be very different style of format.

On a side note for a while there Dad and I were worried that Mom was gonna leave home for Clint. She flipped out over him big time.

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Real men love cats!

Im not a spelling nazi nor do I play one on tv. Just corrected two names. :-)))

Speaking of Gunsmoke--you will find out in the thread with its name.

Corrected:

I like oranges more than apples. My mom had a thing for Clint and James Dean.

I just purchased the Paladin and Wanted Dead or Alive collections.
The Rebel is next. Good ideas for more DVDs here.

I bought the Wanted Dead or Alive series when I also bought Robin Hood. McQueen was excellent in that show. I have one press photo of McQueen as Josh Randall.

This is the Wanted--press photo I have

Check my thread about Gunsmoke--and more.

Appreciate it. I'm a slow typer and trying to type and think before I ran out of time is a bad combo. was out sick for about 9 months a couple of years ago, thank God Gunsmoke had 20 years worth of episodes. Have formed some opinions that may cause some argument. B&W better than color, actually preferred Festus to Chester (let the argument begin). Ken Curtis made many appearances before becoming a regular. Remember an Indian, several generic cow hands, and a character named Festus that was much darker than the regular character. Also preferred the opening with the man in black that we still disagree over

I grew up doin' Rawhide for real on a smaller scale. Made 3 and 5 day cattle drives every year from the time I was about 12 to 18 and again for 20 years after I left LE and moved back to the ranch. That was one of the reasons I went into LE, Those cattle drives ain't near as glorious as they seemed on TV. Maybe cuz we din't have Frankie singin' in the back ground.

The cook on Wagon Train herded sheep for my Grand Dad one year back in the 30s, before moving to CA and becoming famous.

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Eccentric old coot

My prob is i type faster than i can process. On Gunsmoke, ive never seen any b&w ewpisodes till i bought the first season. I like the b&w better too. Festus was better than Chester, and im looking forward to seeing Burt Reynolds as a cast member--and an injun.

Its been well over 35 years since I last saw wagon Train. I dont remember who the cook was? but when these are released by the proper company, im buying all the seasons that had Ward Bond in em.

Frank McGrath played Charlie Wooster, the cook. Ward Bond died in season 4.

I caught a few of Rawhide and Wagon Train when they were first aired.

Rawhide had some excitement. Wagon Train seemed to prove that the Wild West was tamed by middle aged to very old Hollywood stars.

Now as to Western shows in the broadest sense, I came to realize that Little House on the Prairie featured lots of children but no sex.

Whereas Dallas featured lots of sex but no children.