12th week kittens:
watching the weekly changes in my kits has been interesting, because the changes are dramatic.
i saw infants, babies, toddlers, kids n last week, teens.
they outgrew the teen look nnow just look like small cats.
emotionally, some are learning to enjoy my cuddling.
i even get an occasional purr.
that's something drifter never did.
they are quite athletic. they can go anywhere.
they can leap 3' up my desk without noticing.
they know how to use ladders, for going up n down.
they spend time on top of my arbor, which is 7' high.

drifter is finally getting back to normal. she has ignored me for 12 weeks
yesterday, she cuddled up to me n watched johnny carson for a while.
i think she knows the mom thing is ending.
they were effectively weaned at 8 weeks, but they have been drinking from mom once/day or so, but now drifter is cutting them off.
she no longer enjoys it.

these guys are able to leave the garden at any time.
i dread this, because there will be losses as soon as they start to prowl.
i don't know how, but drifter may be keeping them in.
i'm not sure how. if all 4 made a break for it, she couldn't stop them.
besides, when they are on top of the fence, all they need to do is just jump the other way n they would be out.
they are very curious, but have decided leaving the garden isn't smart.
this keeps them alive, but i sure wish i understood how they figured it out.

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susie

Trust the wisdom of drifter.. She knows what's out there and somehow she'll keep them safe. You can build that enclosure if you feel they'd be safer. They're still too young to defend themselves. I'll pray that they stay safe. I feel very attached to them and hope she can teach them what they need to know and will protect them from harm

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To play with them you can get a thin pole and tie a string to it with a bunch of small feathers at the end. It's fun for them to catch the feathers as they wiggle. Or get a laser pointer and let them try to" catch"it. Don't let the red dot shine in their eyes though. There are other toys you can get in a pet store or online. Trial and error! They'll all have a different favorite so find a variety of fun things to chase. Kitties do love to play and maybe they'll bond with you while playing. You aren't doing anything wrong. You're doing great. I would schedule appts neutering for them all at about 5-6 months. If you neuter drifter, make sure to keep them inside during that time till she's back and active so they dont get out and get killed by a predator.

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drifter is the best mom i've ever seen.
since i know she will survive, i'll get her fixed.
then, any kits that survive will get fixed, unless they decide to be outdoor cats.
i wouldn't mind more outdoor cats, but i don't want any more litters in the house.
you know, i've always thot of cats as solitary critters.
not so.
they all, including drifter, want to be part of a clowder.
this may change with age, but right now drifter, myself n the kits are one tribe.

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susie

I had a fellow send me a buckle and he wanted a belt to go with it. He wanted it single layer and made of a leather thicker than a regular strap belt and since a leather side would cost way too much, I ordered a strap.
I had to trim the width of the strap and ended up with a thin leather strip that I tied to a stick.
The cats love it. I've become the keeper of the stick with the leather tied to it person. Every night they gather 'round and stare at me until I play with them.
Sara's the most athletic while Sandy and Natayo lay on the floor and bap at it and try to catch it.
The belt came out pretty good too but it was a lot of stamping and a lot of leather dye.

I wear an extra large glove and my anti-gimpy meds help by increasing peripheral blood flow. That gives me big warm hands.
Every night Sara waits for me on the bed to get a full body stroke with my big warm hands. If I take too long, she comes and gets me. She'll walk up and start fussing 'til I get up off my butt and come into the bedroom to give her the big warm hand full body stroke. She'll just lay there and purr.
Cats like routines. At least ours do.
My wife likes my big warm hands too.

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Keep on Chooglin'

you know, snub, i was just telling ig that i wish i had your skill in making vids.
what i have in front of my nose is a ton of kits n one moth.
they are all aware of it n take turns leaping high in the air to try to grab it.
these leaps are very graceful, in fact, beautiful.
not kittenish at all.
your leather work is beautiful too.

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susie

Very nice belt snubby! Great idea to use that strip of leather as a cat toy... They love to go after anything that moves as you know and warmth is a plus. Happiness to a kitty is a warm stroking on a cold night. Keep those warm hands going . @susieqz a video with the moth and the kits would be great.. Do you get fireflies in the summer? They might like those if you have them. Have a good night

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Ya just gotta hold the camera steady and try to keep 'em in frame.

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Keep on Chooglin'

THANK YOU ENGINEER 1911 !!
this super nice person sent me a strong carrier, that will hold drifter.
i bot a cheap one, but it's too flimsey for drifter.
now, i can get her to the vet.
i didn't want to fix her, but she is going into heat every 3 weeks.
so, she has to stay indoors 6 days straight, every month..
she hates this,
drifter hates being inside during the day.
she won't like the vet, but she will like being able to come n go at will.

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susie

amazingly, i still have 4 kits.
today was the day they left the garden.
with them, it's all or none.
they act in unison.
i thot i'd lose some, because a storm was rolling in n i'm not walking well enow to chase them down.

one was hungry, so he came in, but the others ignored me.
of course, when another one showed up, the first dashed out.
this is how it works here.
if you corral a couple, they will make a break for it when you open the door for others.
finally tho, i locked a couple in the bath when drifter herded the rest indoors.
i opened the gate because they were crying, but they can all scale a 6' board fence.
from now on, they take their chances.
i think i'll lose some because they are vocal n make noise.
drifter is always silent outside, but they haven't learned this.
i cannot cope with cleaning up after them unless they spend time outdoors.
they are happy together. this is a pack, no matter what anyone says.
i guess the blood relation is important.
drifter won't let me feed other cats, but these i can feed.
they all think i'm just part of the pack.
drifter is happily back to normal, but she has a calender.
on their 12 week b day, drifter finally came to watch movies with me n now comes to me nightly, like before.
as i'm typing this, i hear coyotes cutting up.
any kit that stays out after dark is gone.

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susie

Susieqz you just have to remember Mother Nature is a tough old gal who doesn’t suffer mistakes by any of her children. Cats are better equipped than most animals but it is a survival of the fittest situation when they venture out into the world. If they become outside cats they will face many dangers you can’t help with. If momma lets them go so must you.

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Hue 68 noli me tangere

today, drifter n 3 kits came in.
bear is missing.
if he gets back to the garden, he can live thru the night.
drifter wants to go looking but i can't let her out without the rest of them going.
i have no effective method of border control.


well, bear is back, 4 hours after curfew.
i have no way to punish this.
i'd love to beat him, but he wouldn't connect punishment with staying out late, partying.
the only real punishment would be not letting him in, which makes no sense.
bear was last in the other day too.
if this is a habit, i won't be able to keep him alive..

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susie

I'd keep them in when drifter is at the vet for sure, especially if the coyotes are out. Drifter can't defend them when she's not there or when she's recovering which should take a few days. It would be worthwhile to suck it up and keep them in during drifters surgery. You may not be happy with their mess but if the predators don't smell drifter out there, they may be bold enough to grab all 4. That would be worse. She'll go out looking for them while recovering and that would be bad for all 5.

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^^^ And that is the ugly truth. ^^^

If that happened, there would be a lot of blurry monitor screens and wet keyboards.

Suzie,
Thank you for the kind words about the carrier. Your cats are now a little safer when you have to transport them.

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S&WHF 366

yup, the cheapest carriers won't hold a mean adult cat.
they might get a babe back n forth to the vet, but barely.

you know, raising kits in the house is no favor.
they don't understand the world.

after some months with me, drifter learned to meow to ask for stuff.
now she has a quiet whirring sound that means ''kits, come to me''.
she is silent mostly.
always, outdoors.
if she walks thru dried leaves, she makes little noise
more, i can see her when she lounges in the garden, untill the plants grow.
but, when she leaves, she becomes invisible.
black n white aren't camo, but she just blends in.
drifter in the bush can't be seen or heard.
this is why she's alive.
coyotes can't find her n mice don't know she's there until they are getting gobbled up.
he kits are clumsy n loud. they make noise moving.
they couldn't sneak up on anything.
worse, they meow, even outside the garden.
this is stupid.
n, if i look for them, i can find them.
they don't understand hiding.

all this is fine, for indoors.
they know how to cuddle n even purr.
a purring kitty is very pleasant.
drifter never purrs.
too much noise.

so, drifter can go anyplace safely.
she understands ''careful''.
the kits don't.

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susie

They're just babies still. Drifter will teach them. She's amazing, isn't she? It will take a while before they're properly schooled. They still have the luxury of the garden and inside the house for protection. She's had time alone to hone her skills, and it will take time for them to learn. You're wise to give them that time till they're ready for what lies in wait.... Outside...

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i found out why the kits haven't been cuddly to me.
bear decided to spend the night outside.
drifter elected to stay with him.
i could have got drifter in, but i let her stay out, to teach him how to stay alive.
they were fine this morn.
actually, bear may not need drifter.
i made a cat hose for drifter that she never used, but the kits often nap in it. he's safe in there.
these guys seem to spend most of their time on the roof anyway.

anyway, without drifter here, the 3 kits i had cuddled me, n tromped all over me, all night.
they still have an active period in the middle of the night, so were jumping on my head.
kinda fun.

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susie

That's probably best for drifter to teach them one at a time! Then she can concentrate on each one. They're probably a handful for even her to teach given the predators that they can face outside your garden..

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AAARG!!
DRIFTER IS IN HEAT AGAIN.
every 10 days?
i don't care if it's possible, it's happening.
i'm trying to keep her in, but she got out when i was letting the herd out.
might be preg already.
i don't mind keeping my drifter in, but i need those kits out !

they really need outdoor time.
not just less litter clean up, they are just happier critters when they play outside.
they climb all the time outside.
this satisfies them.
they have never been on my counters inside.

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susie

Going into heat every 10 days may mean drifter has a medical problem. You may want to give your vet a call and have her seen to determine if there's a problem that needs attention right away.

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boy, you gotta be careful what you teach kits.
i taught them SUPPERTIME, n, OUTSIDE, which is all i need to get them in n out.
but, then i got fancy.
i started calling them to me when i get into bed.
this was nice at first. i could get a kit on my hurting knee. a warm kit on an ache just feels great.
but, i forgot they were being trained by drifter.
i don't allow her on the bed because she loves rolling in the dirt.
not once or twice, she rolls til the black n white coat turns red.
might be her idea of camo.
so, i strolled out today n saw a red drifter. she rolled n rolled.
it must feel nice.
but then, i saw the kits. every one was red.
drifter has taught them to roll in the dirt.
now, either i vacuum them when they come in, or i fight to keep them away from my bed.

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susie

HERE'S SOMETHING NEAT.
as my kits turn into cats, their personalities change.
a few weeks ago, they could take or leave cuddling.
now, they seek it out.
if they are sleepy, they crawl on me n purr.
they don't like being picked up, but tolerate it when i bring them to me to cuddle.
the older they get, the friendlier they are.
this is nice.
drifter remains drifter. she comes over to be brushed, but generally
stays to herself.

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susie

at 17 weeks, kits are all different persons.
one loves me lots. one ignores me.
the others are in between.

they are all headstrong.
i tried getting them in n out as a bunch, but that isn't working.
when i open the door, some rush in, some rush out.
drifter is spending most nights outdoors as soom kits will stay out every night.
hunting must be good, because she seldom comes in for dinner.
the kits do, but they sure aren't eating much kibble.
i suspect everyone is dining on game, tho i haven't seen it.

they don't make me crazy. they have all left the garden, but these guys mostly stay in the garden.
only drifter is mostly out hunting.

i'm having a very bad behavior problem with natayo.
i stepped on him n he bit me bad.blood was running from the fang marks. never been bit by a dog like that.
i didn't retaliate as it was sorta self defense.

last night i was in bed n she bit me bad on the heel, thru the blankets.
i got up n hit her with a shoe, but probably not hard enow.

i'm gonna kick her thru the wall if she does it again.

but if this is a habit, i'm gonna have to shoot her.
then, last night

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susie

I'm afraid to read your next post (lol)Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

How's Natayo? Is he being good? I hope so...

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natayo is the biter.
if that guy ever comes for his cats,
natayo will be a fine barn cat.
they all bite, but nobody but her breaks skin.
this is a big deal.

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susie

Be very careful of any cat bite that draws blood,they can be very nasty! I know of two cat bites that required major medical care to heal.

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Hue 68 noli me tangere

i won't tolerate this behavior any longer.
pets don't bite.
the other kits don't like her much.
everyone else knows that play fighting means play biting.
she bites them hard too.
i don't wanna shoot her but i will if i must. 568.00000000000000000000000000000000mm
568 that was just typed by bear

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susie

i'll call the guy that wants the cats. he's in texas, too far for me to drive.
5 cats is too many for me, ven tho inside, i have a floating population of 2-3 cats.
every time i open the door, some go out n some come in.
i won't shoot natayo unless he bites again, but i can't tolerate that behavior.
lots of them bite n i give them a thump on the nose. mild bite, mild thump.
the bite site is not infected but i'm battling a nasty infection.
one side of my face is swollen n painful at the jawhinge.
fever too.
shivering uncontrollably.
dont know if the two are related, but i do know i was only able to clean the outside of the bite.
those fangs went in deep, carrying who knows what into my body.

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susie

i won't invest in this animal.
however, i'd love to hear any training ideas.
all i've come up with is a serious beating. i can't do that without another bite.
i don't want another bite.
this kit is very loving when calm.

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susie

the second time was play, but she doesn't understand play biting.
drifter n sibs were suppose to teach this.
she doesn't seem mentally defective, but in this respect is acting like one.

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susie

I agree with jenerationx... Call your doctor asap. Let us know what's happening... When you're better, the kitties need to get rabies shots...I hope you're ok.

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the only help i need from you guys is the encouragement i get from this thread.
every time someone posts a story about their cats, i learn something [hint].
the cool thing is i now know a bunch of people who like both guns n critters.
good company.

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susie

That is cool knowing the folks on this forum.... Hoping you've seen the doctor and are feeling better. We all do care about you and the cats and also about one another. We love you and if the time comes that you need any help other than the encouragement, I, for one, would be glad to help any way I can. We're there for you, susieqz

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PS do you still have the jaw pain? Tetanus can come from puncture wounds and the common name for tetanus is "lockjaw". Tetanus shots need a booster every 10 years or so, and also if you get a severe puncture wound. Let the doctor know about the jaw pain and any other symptoms you have had. May not have anything to do with Natayo's bite but it's a significant symptom to get an explanation for. Thinking of you.. Linda

the jaw is slowly getting better, plus, i ordered fishmox that should be here tomorrow. that should handle any infection.
my next do visit is end of the month.
if i had to make an extra trip, which hurts, i'd probably shot the cat out of hand.
i can work hard, digging deep holes to plant trees n such, but i can't sit.
anyway, natayo is cuddled up to me right now.
he still gets love n food.
i only punish to correct n the animal has to understand why.
other than that, they literally walk all over me.
it's funny that the feral drifter never does anything wrong but the house cats tend to get into trouble.
drifter is a perfect lady all the time.
i guess they all think i'm family, but there is a great deal of respect between drifter n i.
no purring, but lots of respect.

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susie

Well, keep us posted on your condition cause we do worry about you. I don;t post a lot but I do read and keep up.

My male cats will nip when they don’t want to be petted or bothered. That’s how they say leave me alone.
Now my three tamed feral one bites me and claws me when we’re going to sleep. I pet his tummy and he latches on. The other two his brothers love there tummy petted. I can’t tell who is who in the dark.

The three outside cats have been in all day and maybe come in at night. They know the yote is around. One cat stays out for two days sometimes that scares me. The other four cats are house cats they stay in the play with my yellow lab.

The turkeys are at the bird feeders everyday. Time for the babies soon haven’t seen the deer.

Have you tried squinting your eyes and nod your head up or down slowly.?
The cats should squint back and accept you into their family. It may take a while. Some cats respond to them and they may respond back. Keep on trying to comunicate to them. Now females are different some will respond while others won’t.

I hope you are feeling better Susie. I have had my fair share of cat bites and scratches from ferals. My crabby kitty housecat sometimes bites but doesn't draw blood. My tame feral bit hard his first year when he wanted to play. Luckily he has grown out of that. I recommend saturating bites with hydrogen peroxide and applying a prescription antibiotic ointment called Mupirocin. It is amazing stuff and will help it heal faster. It can be used on cats too so you can ask your vet to prescribe it. My vet is the one who told me to use it on myself too and I am glad I got her advice! It is good to prevent or treat any skin infection, even scratches you might get out in your garden.

BigBill, similarly, I open and close my eyes slowly with the ferals and they do it back. It is pretty neat. I have seen Jackson Galaxy do that to the troubled cats he meets on his show too so this is a proven communication technique to say "hello" "thank you" and "I'm cool with you".

squinting seems kinda dumb, but if you guys use it, i can try.
thing is, natayo already thinks of me as family.
he just doesn't treat family very well.
perhaps screaming at him n hitting him with a shoe has helped.
he is lucky i didn't have anything heavier that a shoe to whack him with.
i worry he will attack drifter.
if that happens it's over.

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susie

pics are hard for me, or i would. i'm curious.
if drifter was attacked, there would be no time to msg anyone,
i would act instantly.
drifter is MY KITTY!

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susie

drifter does pin them down from time to time, but they are now 90% of her size.
i'm not super worried. pampered house cats won't be a match for feral drifter.
right now, they have to come in to eat.
drifter doesn't.
she eats 3 times/day, but kibble only once every 2 days.
she prefers mice.
drifter is still drifter.

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susie

My parents have always fed the feral cat population around their house. They’re great natural pest replant and adorable to look at. That being said, just time and feeding it will be the main ways to get it more used to you. Try to let it see you giving it food as well if possible so it will make that connection.


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I had a friend, and he would squirt milk into his cats' mouths when he milked his goats.
He said he fed them too much, and they wouldn't mouse! Don't make the same mistake with your Jedi Cat!

drifter mostly finds her own food. the kits come in the house to eat. drifter comes in to see me n eats while she's here.i guess she stays out more because kits are out, but she won't neglect hunger.
i asked her in, 2 days after she last had kibble.
she declined.
her tummy was full.
mice are yummy.
my little killer fed herself for most of her life n has forgotten nothing.

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susie

I don’t do anything to hurt my cats I try to understand them more. I know it’s hard to restrain when one bites me but he wants to be left alone. Now when I brought the last four kittens in the house the feral got jealous. I read this right away and they stayed outside more, you need to show them all equal attention. Like kids. I have one that’s a bully but I’m working on that. The other one I thought was a bully but he wants to play with the feral older cats. The feral body slams the younger kitten. He thinks it’s fun I laugh.

Cat Communication: What Your Cat's Body Language Says
Squinting, blinking number 2

Kittens do get frisky they think everything is a toy even momma and the big cats. If it moves they attack it. They like my computer screen and the wife’s keyboard. Sometimes I hear one scream at night. There playing.
Once the kittens get older they settle down and don’t play as rough. In a few years.lol

bill, you say you get bit, but you don't say you are deeply cut n bleeding.
that is not the same as nips for communication.

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susie

Also blink very slowly repeatedly. Jackson Galaxy from"cat from hell" says this is a very friendly gesture that cats understand universally because they do it to each other. Thanks Grip_ Makers_ Wife, I didn't see you had just written the same thing above me (I was reading the last posts first)

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He won't attack drifter... However it's not unheard of for a kit who matures without getting neutered can mate with the mom. She might not permit it but some do

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