AK-47

The accuracy difference in the 7.62x39 rifles is due to the difference in bore diameters and ammo diameter. The bores can run from .308" to .311" the ammo runs from 308" to .3115". You need to Mic your bore and bullets.
You need to roll your own for accuracy.

The yugo sks has the largest bore. Avg .311"

The early us made 7.62x39 ammo was .308"

It's not the gun that's inaccurate the ammo diameter is too small.

Here's my favorite AK:
It an AMD65 I had built as an SBR so it's registered. A very important point is WHO built a particular rifle from the parts kit as there are big difference in quality!
Jim

Buy a few Saigas, get a grip with a Tapco G2 trigger on each, and you are set. Or, buy a couple of Veprs. Tapco makes nice side folders, too. Both Russian manufacturers have great rifles. Golden Tiger and a Saiga will shoot with the best AKM-47s in 7.62x39. The earlier Romanian rifles are amazingly accurate, too. Never had a Chinese.


Tapco side folder on a Saiga 12.



Saiga in .308, stock; my walking in the woods gun.

delta-419 said:

...... so I need schooling on the best type/brand........ What are my options? Who makes the best most reliable gun.

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In my opinion the best AK-47's are pre-ban Eastern European and Chinese (Norinco) made in the arsenals/factories that make or made the military versions. My personal favorites for the best made stamped receiver AK-47's are from China (Norinco) because the receivers are 1.5 mm versus 1.0 mm. They are a bit heavier but feel much more robust. There's a long running debate whether the heavier receiver offers any real or practical durability advantage. The problem is these pre-ban guns are getting harder to find and more expensive. A post-ban MAK-90 is made with the same receiver and barrel. SC_Mike shows a post-ban MAK-90 converted* to look pre-ban. Another durability and quality debate is regarding a milled versus stamped receiver and to my knowledge it's never been settled. You'll pay more for a milled receiver gun and likely not get any advantages over a quality stamped receiver.

One member pointed out to be leery of AK-47's built from parts kits on U.S. receivers and I would echo that warning. Be very leery. Do your homework if you go this route.

A no-brainer, if you don't want to search for a pre-ban AK-47 would be to order from Arsenal out of Las Vegas. They make a quality AK-47, essentially a Bulgarian (i.e. Eastern European) gun, and offers a significant number of variations. They can be easily ordered to your local FFL through Davidson's or other suppliers.

Saiga's and Veprs are supposedly good firearms and having examined a number of them I would guess they are but they are not exactly a AK-47 built exactly like most other AK-47's so some parts may not be interchangeable. If you go this route do your homework.

*If you do a conversion from a post-ban to look like a pre-ban be sure to do your homework.

Since nobody has shown an AK-47 oddball here is my Norinco 86S. It is extremely compact at about 26" total length:

[/IMG]

Sailfish 40 said:

why the duct tape?

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Why it holds the front sight on of course!

Naaa was coyote hunting from a blind and wrapped it with camo tape.

Arik its Norinco, stamped on the receiver and slightly bubba'd up front sight.

g8rb8 said:

In my opinion the best AK-47's are pre-ban Eastern European and Chinese (Norinco) made in the arsenals/factories that make or made the military versions. My personal favorites for the best made stamped receiver AK-47's are from China (Norinco) because the receivers are 1.5 mm versus 1.0 mm. They are a bit heavier but feel much more robust. There's a long running debate whether the heavier receiver offers any real or practical durability advantage. The problem is these pre-ban guns are getting harder to find and more expensive. A post-ban MAK-90 is made with the same receiver and barrel. SC_Mike shows a post-ban MAK-90 converted* to look pre-ban. Another durability and quality debate is regarding a milled versus stamped receiver and to my knowledge it's never been settled. You'll pay more for a milled receiver gun and likely not get any advantages over a quality stamped receiver.

One member pointed out to be leery of AK-47's built from parts kits on U.S. receivers and I would echo that warning. Be very leery. Do your homework if you go this route.

A no-brainer, if you don't want to search for a pre-ban AK-47 would be to order from Arsenal out of Las Vegas. They make a quality AK-47, essentially a Bulgarian (i.e. Eastern European) gun, and offers a significant number of variations. They can be easily ordered to your local FFL through Davidson's or other suppliers.

Saiga's and Veprs are supposedly good firearms and having examined a number of them I would guess they are but they are not exactly a AK-47 built exactly like most other AK-47's so some parts may not be interchangeable. If you go this route do your homework.

*If you do a conversion from a post-ban to look like a pre-ban be sure to do your homework.

Since nobody has shown an AK-47 oddball here is my Norinco 86S. It is extremely compact at about 26" total length:

[/IMG]

Click to expand...

Those Norincos are rare.

Vepr is an AK it's just made by a different company, Molot. Everything They Make for the Military Is RPK so with their civilian versions that's essentially what you're getting....an RPK. Heavier and bulged receiver with a thicker barrel and adjustable rear sights.

Izhmash, the makers of Saiga, make military AKM and AK74.

I still say the Saiga sporter w/16" barrel in 223 and in 308win. Leave them original lube them with moly. These have the chrome lined chambers and bores the Russians are famous for. The Saiga is a brand new Russian Izmash ak/akm

AK47

Century Arms makes a decent under-folder that retails for between $450 and $600, depending on who you buy it from. It is a great plinker and defense weapon, and could double as a hunting rifle for medium sized game. Of course with an under-folder you're not going to get that cheek weld that most people desire on a rifle. But it's compact and cool to look at. FYI, if you live in The People's Republik of Kalifornia, you have to install a device that prevents the stock from folding. However, this can be easily removed if you ever decide to leave the state.

Be careful with century rifles. Inspect it closely make sure it's a good fitted gun.

^
This

Dpapa has a good idea. Century makes a folder, AK63D (an AK-47 variant) with a milled receiver... but an unlined barrel. Blackheart International makes a stamped receiver, with an Amerian-made chrome-lined barrel... and I heard it was good.

I have an old, IMI Galil 5.56mm (AK-47 variant) that is NIB... and never been shot. It was give to me. Back then... I would not have bought it if I had a choice. Dam thang is heavy (nearly 9 pds)... but it does have a folding stock... and built-in bi-pod. Israelis liked it... cause the wood was cooler to the touch in the desert heat...

My Norinco originally had the thumb hole stock, changed out by the previous owner so I do believe it was a post gun. The loop on the front sight was also cut away for some reason, perhaps to make it look like a pre weapon, who knows.

Here's my Century Polish 1960 milled receiver. I changed the foregrip to a quad rail system and they rear stock to get a longer LOP. Originals were wood. I've heard some good some bad about Centurys but this ones been 100%.

AK-47 fan due to the fact that it was originally approved for production on the day I was born: 11/13/47. Three of mine:




Circa 1953 Russian Type III - built by Mario of Piece of History Firearms (Tucson AZ) on a full Russian parts kit.


2007 Vector Factory SBR - M92


Arsenal SLR-106CR - 5.56 – limited edition made to be converted to SBR

Hellraiser said:

...............I have an old, IMI Galil 5.56mm (AK-47 variant) ...........

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g8rb8 said:

Originally Posted by g8rb8
Saiga's and Veprs are supposedly good firearms and having examined a number of them I would guess they are but they are not exactly a AK-47 built exactly like most other AK-47's so some parts may not be interchangeable. If you go this route do your homework.

Click to expand...

Arik Quote:
Vepr is an AK it's just made by a different company, Molot. Everything They Make for the Military Is RPK so with their civilian versions that's essentially what you're getting....an RPK. Heavier and bulged receiver with a thicker barrel and adjustable rear sights.

Izhmash, the makers of Saiga, make military AKM and AK74.

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Having read a number of posts from Arik regarding AK-47's and their variants I would hold his opinion in high esteem. I also agree with him the AK-47 platform is much more accurate than their reputation would suggest.

My point was not that the Saiga and VEPR were significantly different from other AK-47's (they're not). My point was to let the original poster know there are subtle differences ("not exactly") among various AK-47's. I recall examining a 7.62 x 39 VEPR about 3-4 years ago that required proprietary magazines but cannot comment on the most recent offerings.

Hellraiser makes a good point about rifles that are AK-47's at their heart. Valmet is another example.

AK vs AR

I really appreciate the brisk discussion on the merits of both the AK47 vs. AR15, however the decision on purchasing an AK47 was overcome by events. I went to a gun show today in Mobile, AL and stopped about 1/2 way through at several long tables covered with black rifles. I had looked at several AK47s in the $700 to 2K price range. My goal was to scan the entire show and compare prices and guns, however the black gun table was having a sale of epic proportions. Folks were lined up to buy one and I was no.4 at 2pm. I came home with a S&W M&P 15 with electronic optics, forward grip handle, mags, (all NIB) and ammo out the door for less than $750, including taxes, and CC charges. Now, I have to relearn how to put it together. Last time I had one of these type rifles in my hands it was 1972. Thanks guys for your input, I think there will be an AK in my future.

This rotary bolt action(Saiga) lubed with moly. On the bolt, gas tube/piston, trigger sear is a completely different feeling rifle. The moly removes the roughness and smoothes the action right out. Even the trigger feels good.

I have never shot a semi auto rifle that spits out rounds this fast. I was seconds away from buying a new SA M1A ($2,100) when I seen the rack full of brand new Russian Izmash Saiga's for $289 in 308win. I'm glad I passed on the M1A.

Hellraiser said:

^
This

Dpapa has a good idea. Century makes a folder, AK63D (an AK-47 variant) with a milled receiver... but an unlined barrel. Blackheart International makes a stamped receiver, with an Amerian-made chrome-lined barrel... and I heard it was good.

I have an old, IMI Galil 5.56mm (AK-47 variant) that is NIB... and never been shot. It was give to me. Back then... I would not have bought it if I had a choice. Dam thang is heavy (nearly 9 pds)... but it does have a folding stock... and built-in bi-pod. Israelis liked it... cause the wood was cooler to the touch in the desert heat...

Click to expand...

Gotta love it when a military rifle comes equipped with a bottle opener!