Chinese Norinco

CajunBass said:
I was looking at a Chinese Norinco 45 this morning. Best i can tell unfired, in the box, instruction sheet, cleaning rod and brush. Not even an "idiot mark" on it. Nicely blued. Fixed sights GI type gun.

They any good?
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I used to have one that I bought from a friend.

The major components are first rate, probably better than mid-'80s vintage Colt. The small parts are garbage, but easily replaced.

Mine was my primary carry piece until I got laid off a few Christmases ago and needed the money to pay the rent. I ended up selling it back to the guy from whom I bought it. If I hadn't needed the money, I'd still have and carry it.
 
Scrapyards may not take spikes from the public, but some fishing shops do. Spikes are commonly used here for weights for sturgeon fishing in the Columbia River.
 
I did some research on these 1911’s back when I found mine. I found a post from an engineer in Canada that had info on the steel. I’ll try to attach a pdf if you want to read it.

Looks like if you click on the blank picture it will take you to the pdf.
 

Attachments

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I wanted to, someday, have a master pistolsmith build me a really, really nice custom 1911. Bomar sights, all the goodies. I found a NIB Norinco at a gunshow and jumped on it. Locally, the top 1911 man is Steve Barlow, Barlow's Custom Guns. I saved up some cash for the work and took cash and Norinco into his shop.

Another shooter offered me twice what I had paid for it a couple of years earlier and I sold it to him.

Right now, my favorite 1911 is my first year S&W 945 I bought new in 1998.

Were I to go shopping for a new 1911 to have dolled up today, it would be either a Colt or a Springfield Armory.
 
I will echo the hint about checking the locking lugs.

I had one that beat them up pretty badly. It seems the frame rail geometry was off on some of them. The result was the locking lugs didn't get full engagement and a "shelf" would peen into the lugs because that's the only section that was actually engaging.

I've owned one and seen one other with the problem, so they are out there. Vast majority of the ones I've looked at didn't exhibit the problem, so I would think it's pretty limited, but if you're going to buy one you should check for it.

The only damage was the lugs on the barrel. The slide didn't have any damage, probably due to the steel used in it. I fitted a Hart barrel to it, and that solved the problem. I've heard people actually changing the frame rail geometry, but that sure seemed like alot of work. I don't know if a longer link would solve it, but it seemed like the Hart barrel was the better solution to me. Anyway, I sold it to a buddy at work, and he still has it and is more than happy with it. It drove tacks with the fitted barrel.

Other than that problem, they are really well built guns, made from high quality steel.
 
Thanks for all the information but I think I'm going to pass on it. I'm afraid it would become another gun I don't shoot and I've got too many of those now.

If it was a S&W revolver that wouldn't be a consideration. :)
 
CajunBass, I'm on the same page as you I have 7 1911's, always looking at the Norinco 1911, but in the end never pull the trigger. It is a great copy of a WW2 1911a1, but I already have a '44 Remington Rand and I find the sites on that one a little lacking. If one fell into my lap for a very, very ,very good price, I would snatch it up, but for current market prices, there are S&W 66s and 28s I would buy before spending my money on the Norinco.
 
Back in "my day", I worked on several Norinco M 1911. Like everyone else I found the steel to be excellent and the small parts to be 'suspect'. I changed out springs with Wolfe's and the slide stop, ejector, sear and thumb safety with Colt's. The hammer was usually changed to a Commander style hammer out of election not because of necessity. If the customer wanted to keep using the OEM barrel, I would coat the lugs of the barrel with Dykem and send him to the range to shoot a box of hard ball thru the gun. I then 'read' the marks and would advise the customer if the barrel was fitting properly or if it should be changed. Most of the barrel fits were good, but some were off. GI barrels were a dime a dozen back then and it was a natural to swap one into the Norinco. I did fit several custom long barrels with threaded muzzle for a muzzle brake with total success. I was always a little surprised at just how good the Norinco actually was with just a little of parts swaps and tuning.

I feel the same way today about the M 1911 by Armscor. It is forged in the Philippines and assembled here in So. Nevada. The frames and slides are every bit as good as other major brands that have greater name recognition.
 
Not a big deal and don't mean to hijack but I thought RIA (Armscor) 1911 slides were forged while frames were investment cast, has this changed?

ETA:
Back in the day (pre-import ban) the Norinco was not only quality steel but was the cheapest way to get a forged frame to build on. I had a GI model and sold it along with an M1A (also forged receiver) of the same persuasion. :(
I was a C3 dealer and recall the local SO buying some norinco select fire M14's for $195 each. :)
 
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It's funny how the best quality firearms and knives I have are also some of the least expensive and from China. Get the Norinco you won't regret it
 
Yep, the old Norincos were used as a base for many custom 1911s. I stumbled across a box stock one a couple of years ago and bought it. Since you rarely see them in original condition anymore, I decided to leave it as it was. ;)
 
Not to hijack or drift but IIRC, the Norinco M14 bolts had metallurgy (soft) issues and there once was a cottage industry swapping out bolts for GI's. I sold a few surplus TRW's for that reason.
 
jack the toad said:
Not to hijack or drift but IIRC, the Norinco M14 bolts had metallurgy (soft) issues and there once was a cottage industry swapping out bolts for GI's. I sold a few surplus TRW's for that reason.
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The version of this rumor that I heard alleged that Norinco "M-14" receivers were soft and after firing a lot bolt lug impressions in the receiver got deep enough to create excess head space. I was suspicious that these were economically motivated rumors made up by owners who's investment in $1,000 Springfields was being undermined by readily available $400 Norincos. I did see a few of the Norincos fired quite a bit and while they were not accurate enough to be competitive in High-Power matches they shot well and did not develop problems. Heat treating tool steel in temperature controlled furnaces is WW I technology and the steel mills supplying the steel will provide the recipe. I have had dirt cheap Chinese hand tools that were made out of unsatisfactory steel. Maybe experience with those was the seed of the rumor.
 
k22fan said:
The version of this rumor that I heard alleged that Norinco "M-14" receivers were soft and after firing a lot bolt lug impressions in the receiver got deep enough to create excess head space.
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The problem as I understood it was the bolts were inferior (with ensuing excessive headspace when shot a lot) but receivers were ok. I didn't then and still don't know if there was any truth to any of it but I did sell some bolts for that purpose. I can't honestly say if there were problems or not as the few norinco M14S models I've owned and been around didn't show any inherent problems but weren't shot a lot either. One thing I never did figure out was if the receivers heat treat was ok, why weren't the bolts?
The local SO that had the select fire versions never reported any problems (other than accuracy) but I don't know how much they were fired.

ETA:
After a quick but unthorough search, I came up with this comment...

"The bolts aren't soft, but they do have lugs that have an incorrect radius and it's a good idea to replace them with GI."
 
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If your SO (sheriff's office?) Norinco M-14s had soft metal receivers or bolts then much full auto fire would likely have brought out the problem. On the other hand, it is hard to imagine much use for difficult to control full auto .308 fire in police work so maybe they only experimented with full auto.
 
jack the toad said:
Not to hijack or drift but IIRC, the Norinco M14 bolts had metallurgy (soft) issues and there once was a cottage industry swapping out bolts for GI's. I sold a few surplus TRW's for that reason.
Click to expand...

Fulton Armory tested a norinco m14. They had a write up posted on their sight with the results. They said most of the bad stuff was concocted by the m1a/m14 manufacturers in the states. I guess the norinco m14 being very affordable hurt there sales.

I have one tucked away growing roots in the safe.

I shot a m14 select fire in full auto at my dealers gun club. He never told me about the barrel rise. On the second go around I could control it.
 
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"I shot a m14 select fire in full auto at my dealers gun club. He never told me about the barrel rise. On the second go around I could control it. "
One of the rationales for the M14 was to replace not only the M1 Garand but also the BAR, for which purpose it was ultimately unsuccessful. The BAR was heavy enough to be controllable in full automatic fire. The lighter mass of the M14 made control in full automatic mode nearly impossible. It's difficult to violate the laws of physics.
 
One of my bucket list pieces is a NORINCO TRENCH SHOTGUN ! They used to be an easy find but now have seemed to vanish from shows and GB
 
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