EZ 380 Shooter issue???

my wife and I took a holster class Saturday. She was shooting her 380 EZ, only had 50 rounds through it. the class was to shoot 100 rounds, loading 5 at a time, if that matters. she was getting stove pipes almost every mag, it was happening so often she got very frustrated.

today, I took the same ez to the range and put 100 rounds through it, mostly 5 in a mag at a time, not a single stovepipe, what can a user do to cause it? seems odd to me

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commonly called "limp wrist.' More accurately, letting the pistol flop around instead of holding it correctly and firmly.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ue1l1qz-U4M[/ame]

I don't have the EZ but see threads on the forum discussing the problem. Here is one with more than a years worth of contributions. M&P 380 EZ Stovepipe Cure?

If you used the same magazine and ammo as your wife, without a problem, then her technique looks like the issue. Perhaps with range work on her part, she can fix it, or maybe she could pick a more mature platform.

we were doing one handed drills and weak hand drills, so that was likely an issue getting a good grip. of course there are many issues like this with this model.

she has her eyes on my 9mm shield now, guess I get a new 45 [emoji6]

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Regardless of someones grip, there shouldn't be as many reports of stovepipes as there are. S&W designed this pistol to be easy on those with less strength which goes hand in hand with limp wristing. The designers need to come up with a viable fix and quit pacifying owners with mag followers and springs.

akoda said:

we were doing one handed drills and weak hand drills, so that was likely an issue getting a good grip. of course there are many issues like this with this model.

she has her eyes on my 9mm shield now, guess I get a new 45 [emoji6]

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If your wife was limp-wristing a .380 EZ to the point of feeding failures, I can't imagine that she would have a productive experience with a 9mm Shield.

My wife's EZ has experienced stovepipes, but only on the last round in one of her four magazines and regardless of who shoots the pistol, so I'm reasonably sure the problem is not related to limp-wristing.

gc70 said:

If your wife was limp-wristing a .380 EZ to the point of feeding failures, I can't imagine that she would have a productive experience with a 9mm Shield.

My wife's EZ has experienced stovepipes, but only on the last round in one of her four magazines and regardless of who shoots the pistol, so I'm reasonably sure the problem is not related to limp-wristing.

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I am going to shoot it again very soon, maybe today. is the issue with last round only from a full mag? if i put 5 rounds in, would you expect the issue on the last round then?

someone in our class was a gunsmith there and suggested it could be that it hasn't been broken in yet, it has 250 rounds through it now

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Given that this EZ is marketed for less experienced shooters, it would be reasonable to expect reports of failures. I could be mistaken, but the philosophy of the EZ was to ease the process of chambering a round, not a "no-recoil pistol".

I agree with the sentiment that a Shield will not resolve the matter anymore than giving an inexperienced driver a faster car makes that individual a better driver. 9mm is a "hotter" round and some may believe that will result in more positive extraction, however, pistols are engineered/tuned for their respective calibers.

Grip is CRITICAL and based on your report, the culprit to the stovepipes > break-in factor.

I recently purchased a pistol I had my wife shoot before me. She shoots occasionally, but still struggles with things second nature to more experienced shooters. She had a stovepipe every few rounds, which obviously concerned me. The ammo was Aguila, I consider it a weaker load, and it had been sitting for years, but still, every few rounds? I picked it up and put mag after mag through it with no issues. Lemon pistol? No. She has trouble filling the gap between the dove-tail and the top of the grip, this error allows the recoil to pivot at that point, and the business end will rise and twist, resulting in stovepipes.

Most shooters expect a break-in period of a few hundred rounds, especially on pistols they carry for self-defense, this allows components to wear/polish themselves in certain toleranced areas, springs to soften, and generally everything melds into the machine it is designed to be. In addition, any issues relating to reliability are likely to be experienced in this trial period. There are manufacturer defects, but all factors considered, the type of failure reported with a new pistol, being used by an assumedly less experienced shooter, and your inability as a shooter to replicate the failure-- it is operator error.

Do not overlook the importance of proper grip. One does not need forearms of steel to manage recoil, but proper grip, in every nuance, is critical.

akoda said:

is the issue with last round only from a full mag? if i put 5 rounds in, would you expect the issue on the last round then?

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The last round is the same whether you start with a full mag or five rounds.



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bigwheelzip said:

The last round is the same whether you start with a full mag or five rounds.



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I certainly understand that, but pushing 8 rounds in vs 1, compressed springs differently. so can you reproduce it with only one round in mag. call it first, last or only .... want to try and reproduce because that doesn't happen on mine

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I've read on here about the stovepipe issue, but the 2 ladies at our indoor range who shoot the 380 EZ don't seem to have the issue. I've personally shot one of their 380 EZ'S and didn't have an issue. Proper grip is important in the function of a semi-auto pistol, no matter what caliber. When I was teaching my wife on my Compact 22, she had issues with misfeeds/stovepipes. Once she got a correct grip, they went away.

I don't personally buy into a "breaking in" period for a firearm. It should work out of the box, after proper cleaning/lube. I've always wondered how a $300-$400 standard grade pistol will work out of the box, but something like a Kimber requires 300-500 rounds to "break it in" to function properly? Just my thoughts....

akoda said:

I am going to shoot it again very soon, maybe today. is the issue with last round only from a full mag? if i put 5 rounds in, would you expect the issue on the last round then?

someone in our class was a gunsmith there and suggested it could be that it hasn't been broken in yet, it has 250 rounds through it now

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It's not a break in issue and it's always a last round issue no matter if you load 8 or 4 or 3 or 2... Mine occurred from day one. I now have over 3500 rounds through my EZ and have resigned myself to never expect this gun to function as it should. I have 8 magazines, have sent the gun back to Smith, changed out springs, springs and followers, and still have the problem periodically. The mag springs are too weak once they wear a bit and the magazine moves a little too much in the mag well when the gun is fired. I went to the range with my EZ last week and again had a last round stovepipe in 2 of my 8 magazines in 250 rounds. Loaded 8 per mag, each mag was loaded 4 times so 2 of my magazines failed 25% of the time last week. My experience has been 10 to 25% last round stovepipes or ejected live last round throughout the life of my EZ. I'm not impressed with that aspect of the gun. Otherwise it has been flawless.

I truly believe stronger, longer lasting springs would fix the issue. The suggestion to increase friction on the follower face might work, but Smith should have resolved this issue long ago. My CZs don't do this, nor do my Sigs, Walthers, Rugers, or Glocks. Guess which brands I'll continue to purchase and which one I won't...

Pistols should work out of the box, ideally.

Sometimes they don't, though.. for a multitude of reasons.

After all they are just small machines.

The break-in gets a misconstrued rap as new shooters shoot new firearms and say "well, it isn't broken in". ...yeah, kind of, but not necessarily.

Most any firearm will function fine from the factory, but the break-in is commonly viewed as essential to diagnose any potential, rare, issues.

I would not carry a pistol to defend my life with "out of the box", and if you wouldn't either-- you may believe in a break-in period

In regards to the OP, it does NOT sound like the pistol is the issue.

christak said:

It's not a break in issue and it's always a last round issue no matter if you load 8 or 4 or 3 or 2... Mine occurred from day one.....

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Your situation sounds different, are you saying the only stove-pipes you encounter are last round? I would number those mags to make them easier to identify and try and narrow it down. Have you had others shoot your pistol with the same result?

Boogs said:

In regards to the OP, it does NOT sound like the pistol is the issue.



Your situation sounds different, are you saying the only stove-pipes you encounter are last round? I would number those mags to make them easier to identify and try and narrow it down. Have you had others shoot your pistol with the same result?

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My gun functions flawlessly EXCEPT for the last round stovepipes or last round completely ejected from the gun. My magazines are numbered. I currently have 8, but have had 11 different mags including the ones I returned to Smith. I worked with Smith from January until August 2019 trying to sort out the issues with my EZ. Others have fired my gun...same results...and I'm an experienced handgun guy with many handguns from all the gun makers listed in my post above plus Beretta and Springfield. I've never seen a gun have this kind of issue that apparently has no cure. I know many don't report having this issue, but I've gotten to the point that after 3835 rounds of 8 different brands of ammo through my gun and multiple iterations trying to fix the problem, I just no longer enjoy having the EZ. It's great fun when it isn't stovepiping, but I can't shoot 250 rounds without issues. All my other handguns are completely reliable and as such are far more fun to shoot. I shoot 13000 to 15000 rounds per year...I'm at the range every week. I'm currently down on Smith and don't plan to purchase any more semi-automatics from them. I know that is an overreaction, but that's where I am. YMMV

Trying to narrow down potential causes of the issue, certainly seems like you covered your bases and your experience, unfortunately may be an issue pistol related.

I do not own an EZ, it does not satisfy any vacant need for me, but seems much of your focus has been ammo/mag related-- I imagine if it was one or the other you would see variations in your results.

Total shot in the dark, have you considered changing the extractor? The last round element throws me, especially with different mags, different ammo, and different shooters

christak said:

My gun functions flawlessly EXCEPT for the last round stovepipes or last round completely ejected from the gun. My magazines are numbered. I currently have 8, but have had 11 different mags including the ones I returned to Smith. I worked with Smith from January until August 2019 trying to sort out the issues with my EZ. Others have fired my gun...same results...and I'm an experienced handgun guy with many handguns from all the gun makers listed in my post above plus Beretta and Springfield. I've never seen a gun have this kind of issue that apparently has no cure. I know many don't report having this issue, but I've gotten to the point that after 3835 rounds of 8 different brands of ammo through my gun and multiple iterations trying to fix the problem, I just no longer enjoy having the EZ. It's great fun when it isn't stovepiping, but I can't shoot 250 rounds without issues. All my other handguns are completely reliable and as such are far more fun to shoot. I shoot 13000 to 15000 rounds per year...I'm at the range every week. I'm currently down on Smith and don't plan to purchase any more semi-automatics from them. I know that is an overreaction, but that's where I am. YMMV

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Truly unfortunate, as this design concept is perfect for the consumer with compromised grip strength and/or recoil sensitivity. Smith & Wesson's lack of solution is so puzzling.

I too have given up. The 380 EZ has gone from heralded solution to family and friends to trade bait.

Could have been great.

I just got my Shield 380 EZ last week. Bought it to teach my girl friend to shoot, but haven't shot it yet. I guess after reading all the posts here, I will take it to the range and put a few hundred rounds down range to Test It / Break It In or what ever we want to call it, before I have her start shooting it.

Bob

Boogs said:

Trying to narrow down potential causes of the issue, certainly seems like you covered your bases and your experience, unfortunately may be an issue pistol related.

I do not own an EZ, it does not satisfy any vacant need for me, but seems much of your focus has been ammo/mag related-- I imagine if it was one or the other you would see variations in your results.

Total shot in the dark, have you considered changing the extractor? The last round element throws me, especially with different mags, different ammo, and different shooters

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I sent the gun back to Smith. They said the "gun" was fine...which I don't doubt...and gave me 2 new magazines. The new mags didn't solve the problem for long. I'm 100% convinced that it's a magazine/mag spring/mag well issue. Didn't change the extractor...and as you may have gathered, I'm done messing with it unless they come out with new mags or springs... You might understand the last round issue better if you owned an EZ. The last round is not held very securely and the recoil of the slide cycling causes the last round to move even before the slide is coming forward to pick up and chamber the round, so occasionally the round stands straight up and gets caught in the ejection port or is completely ejected from the gun.

with rounds in the magazine, is it more difficult to insert the mags into the gun? mine is, it has to be whacked pretty good



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